Oldfeller--FSO wrote on 08/02/12 at 10:58:21:

That it could, but I'm sure bill would still find a way to try and do oil wars somehow

Matter of fact, I DID put both cost and ready availability in the criteria for "Recommended." I don't know where I'd draw the line for cost, particularly with the differences in cost of conventional and synthetic oils. I'd prefer avoiding a whole bunch of lists, though there might be "Recommended Conventional" and "Recommended Synthetic" lists. Ready availability would mean something to the effect of available in Walmart, Autozone, O'Reilly, and the like, and would pretty much exclude those which have to be ordered or purchased from a specialty dealership. You will notice I specifically avoided mentioning brand names.

 
Bill, given the criteria for "SuzukiSavage.com Recommended Dino and Synthetic Oils" as developed so far
do you have any oils that should be included in the list?

Uno-Lung wrote on 08/02/12 at 12:58:03:


So I take it from this your saying just because an oil has a high TBN number makes it bad for a gasoline engine?  Does this mean your stance on Amsoil products are crap and shouldn't be used in any gasoline engine period since they have one of the highest TBN numbers of all oils out there? This also applies to most syn oils compared to dino oils as well, as they also have TBN numbers that are much higher then the dino oils they are compared to for the same application.  The additive package also known as the TBN is what helps remove and encapsulate the junk in the oil so that it can be carried to the filtration system in a much more efficient process.  The higher the TBN the longer the oil can last between change intervals unless the oil starts to break down.

How much ZDDP does Suzuki motorcycle oil have in it.

Uno-Lung wrote on 08/02/12 at 12:58:03:

Exactly the kind of argument I was asking for, thank you.  So what you (and the article) are saying is, the amount of carbon deposits left by the fuel and the amount of detergent in the oil have to be carefully balanced or else you'll lose compression.  I remember hearing that some carbon deposits are good, that a little carbon residue helps with the piston ring/cylinder seal.. so that makes sense.  Also, that is probably why my air compressor specifies 'ND' or 'Non-Detergent' oil.. it simply doesn't make any residue to clean up.  

The oil change interval probably also plays into it.  I wonder if it is actually better to let the oil go long, as OF does, when running a high TBN oil in a gas engine?

I am running Amsoil in a couple of engines and wonder if it is over-cleaning them..    Compression does seem good, perhaps it is not as good at it could be.

To get kind of back on track:

I've had good results (in highly abused 1998 Savage) with: Castrol GTX 20W50. Rotella 15W40, Delo 15W40, Super Tech (Wal-mart brand) 15W40. Valvoline 4 stroke motorcycle 20W50 (only used it once though, was given to me).

I've had lousy results (in the same bike) with: dino or synthetic 10W40, both automotive spec and bike specific formulations. Shifts rough, misses shifts, more noises, vanishing oil... Brand has not mattered. And I've tried some high dollar 10W40s.

My wife Lisa's 1996 VS800 Intruder likes Rotella 15W40 and the old formula Syntec 10W40. Does not like the new Syntec at all. Or ANY of the bike specific brands we've tried (Spectro, Acterra, Valvoline 4 stroke, Amsoil, Klotz). Clutch slips, rough shifting, missed shifts, top end noise, magically vanishing oil...

Try various weights and brands until you find what works best in YOUR bike. No two are exactly the same, especially lower end bikes like the Savage/S40.  When I can go 2 years on HDEO or 4 hours on 10W40 synthetic, I know what I'll keep buying. I got over the "must use bike oils" real quick on the advice of a factory race mechanic. Followed his advice and 14 years later I still have never had to adjust a valve, change the clutch plates or swap the timing chain.

Use the thin stuff if you must. Suzuki parts sales thanks you.

bill67 wrote on 08/02/12 at 14:14:27:

Probably for the same reason I'm going to: Price.

People pay out the nose for bike stuff for some reason. Sorry but no thanks, there's no good reason why I need to pay 3x as much for something just because it's going on/in a bike.