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Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam chain (Read 538 times)
tbalam
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #45 - 03/03/07 at 20:04:28
 
Oh i forgot to mention...

I am slowing going to change out the bars with some 1 1/4" drag bars, and change the controls eventually. all takes time when living on financial aid.
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1996 Mirage paint, seat lift, 2 #4 washers, 155 main, 52.5 pilot. Removed pillon, belt guard, rear blinker mod, moved battery box. K&N cone, Chain conversion 17/43 (in process). Cam tensioner mod.
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justin_o_guy
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #46 - 03/03/07 at 21:35:06
 
Sounds great. Have fun. That it takes time & ya have to work inside a budget just makes it all that much cooler when you are done.

I am just planing on shimming the clutch springs. I hope that's enough.I've reshaped my seat a few times. I seem to give it a "Mohawk" every now & then.
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franch
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #47 - 03/03/07 at 22:12:42
 
I agree with Tbalam,
the guides change shape/become more flexible etc..
bottom line - we have to be diligent with our cam chains and it's really not hard to take off the right side cover to check.
Also I feel strongly (based on experience) that the gasket can be reused-  

(as long as the top portion of the gasket doesn't tear, since  it acts as an oilway)

-by adding  some permatex here and there ; usually at bolt locations; where some of the gasket sticks to the case and some of it sticks to the cover.
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #48 - 03/04/07 at 06:09:47
 
tbalam wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
I just ordered the guides, as my chain was spec'd new at 127mm. My tensioner was 20mm out and that was the last tooth on the ratchet. As soon as they come in and I stick it back together I'll let you know how much the tensioner is out.

My guess is that the guides don't where much but that they aren't the same shape as they are new. I'll post pics when they come in.

Oh, and Greg, It's all your fault. My Block is sitting out of the frame and in peices. I am not doing a piston or full tear down, but it was far enough apart that i decided to do some take it out and clean and mod a few things. Thanks for all your help.


Whew!  I was worried.  I hadn't been blamed for anything in a couple weeks, but that makes me feel much better.  Thanks.

The chain was 127 mm new?  Huh?

Would you mind measuring the new guides and make a detailed comparison between old and new.

Believe it or not, I found a way to leave the crankcase in the frame and still remove the head and cylinder.

There she sits with the electrical still attached...(I put the side cases back on just to keep dirt out)

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allan
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #49 - 03/04/07 at 08:52:00
 
Grin oh my greg someones wiped chocolate over your casings Grin

allan.
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #50 - 03/04/07 at 11:36:07
 
Allan wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
Grin oh my greg someones wiped chocolate over your casings Grin

allan.


Darn.  I wonder how that happened.
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Kropatchek
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #51 - 03/04/07 at 12:01:16
 
Savage_Greg wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
And Kropatchek...your opinion please?


I think verslagen  is almost right. The distance between the last and first tooth is controling the timing but i believe  for the driving force more thooth are involved.
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KenGLong
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #52 - 03/04/07 at 16:08:01
 
What happens if the tensioner comes apart when you're doing 70 on the freeway? (I just got back from a ride in which about 40 miles was at 70 on the freeway and my Savage has about 22,000 on the odometer.)

Also, I just priced out all the parts to do a cam chain job on the Savage and it came to $225 at Ron Ayers. That was for the cam chain, the guides, the tensioner, the clutch cover gasket, three small gaskets and the 8mm circlip. Am I forgetting anything?

Ken

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justin_o_guy
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #53 - 03/04/07 at 18:48:18
 
I've only got 14,000 miles on mine & it's time. If mine had 22,000 it wouldn't roll out the door till I looked at that chain & tensioner. Bad stuff happens , Ken, when that tensioner lets go.
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Reelthing
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #54 - 03/04/07 at 19:04:11
 
KenGLong wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
What happens if the tensioner comes apart when you're doing 70 on the freeway? (I just got back from a ride in which about 40 miles was at 70 on the freeway and my Savage has about 22,000 on the odometer.)

Also, I just priced out all the parts to do a cam chain job on the Savage and it came to $225 at Ron Ayers. That was for the cam chain, the guides, the tensioner, the clutch cover gasket, three small gaskets and the 8mm circlip. Am I forgetting anything?

Ken


well you can't d but one guide without pulling the jug - had you intended to go that far?
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #55 - 03/04/07 at 20:39:19
 
KenGLong wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
What happens if the tensioner comes apart when you're doing 70 on the freeway? (I just got back from a ride in which about 40 miles was at 70 on the freeway and my Savage has about 22,000 on the odometer.)

Also, I just priced out all the parts to do a cam chain job on the Savage and it came to $225 at Ron Ayers. That was for the cam chain, the guides, the tensioner, the clutch cover gasket, three small gaskets and the 8mm circlip. Am I forgetting anything?

Ken



Yep.  You'll need a 5th driven gear too.
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Kropatchek
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #56 - 03/05/07 at 05:33:52
 
KenGLong wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
What happens if the tensioner comes apart when you're doing 70 on the freeway? (I just got back from a ride in which about 40 miles was at 70 on the freeway and my Savage has about 22,000 on the odometer.)

Also, I just priced out all the parts to do a cam chain job on the Savage and it came to $225 at Ron Ayers. That was for the cam chain, the guides, the tensioner, the clutch cover gasket, three small gaskets and the 8mm circlip. Am I forgetting anything?

Ken



The tensioner will separate in 2 pieces, the spring will fall inbetween the primary gear and the clutch gear. As the camchain is no longer tight it will skip a few teeth, hence the valve timing is out of sequence, the valves will hit the piston causing consideral more damage than the $ 225 you have to spent now.

Required parts:

The front guide is not required. As reelting said: you have to remove the cylinder head. If the tensioner is not more than 18mm out and the housing is not damaged you can reset and reuse it. The 8 mm circlip can be reused.

Step 1 The tensioner separates:

Step 2 The timing has changed and the valve(s) have hit the piston


And so on: Now you need a complete head, piston, valves, etc.





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Never ask your bike to scream before her throat is warm.
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #57 - 03/05/07 at 05:46:49
 
Kropatchek wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
The tensioner will separate in 2 pieces, the spring will fall inbetween the primary gear and the clutch gear. As the camchain is no longer tight it will skip a few teeth, hence the valve timing is out of sequence, the valves will hit the piston causing consideral more damage than the $ 225 you have to spent now.


Boy, that little graphic sure takes all the fun out of it Smiley

Has anyone yet compared the thickness on a new and old rear guide?

Just curious, since I know that my chain has stretched 1 MM over a span of 21 pins (from 127 to 128...)
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KenGLong
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #58 - 03/05/07 at 07:01:53
 
Kropatchek wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
The tensioner will separate in 2 pieces, the spring will fall in between the primary gear and the clutch gear. As the camchain is no longer tight it will skip a few teeth, hence the valve timing is out of sequence, the valves will hit the piston causing consideral more damage than the $ 225 you have to spent now.


Wow. Guess I'll get the parts on order and refrain from 70 MPH on the freeway until, I take a look in there.

This cam chain tensioner issue begs the question...how many miles do all of you put on your Savages in a year? Can't be much 'cause if I had to do this cam chain tensioner job every two years...well, you get the idea.

Ken
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Okay, popped the case & looked at the cam
Reply #59 - 03/05/07 at 08:06:21
 
KenGLong wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
Wow. Guess I'll get the parts on order and refrain from 70 MPH on the freeway until, I take a look in there.

This cam chain tensioner issue begs the question...how many miles do all of you put on your Savages in a year? Can't be much 'cause if I had to do this cam chain tensioner job every two years...well, you get the idea.

Ken


Yes.  It really begs an answer too.  Like is there a way to prevent it, was something done wrong that caused it, or will this happen over and over?

Funny too 'cause after having the bike for 7 years, this was the first time the subject came up.
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