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2020 -- new Intel failures & successes (Read 12299 times)
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & issues
Reply #60 - 09/25/18 at 02:40:31
 
       
https://liliputing.com/2018/09/zhaoxins-latest-x86-chip-is-a-3-ghz-octa-core-...




Zhaoxin is co-owned by the Shanghai municipal government and VIA Technologies (which used to be a bit player in the x86 space).

The company’s new KX-6000 processor is an octa-core processor with a top clock speed of 3 GHz, 8MB of cache, and support for dual-channel DDR4-3200 memory. It’s manufactured using a 16nm process.

The older KX-5000 processor, meanwhile, was a 28nm, 2 GHz processor with four to eight CPU cores.

Zhaoxin says the new chip is designed for desktops, laptops, or servers and that it should offer performance that’s on par with a 7th-gen Intel Core i5 processor, although I haven’t seen any independent confirmation of that claim yet.

While it’s unlikely that we’ll see these chips show up in products sold outside of the Chinese market anytime soon, it looks like Chinese efforts to develop some home-grown alternatives to Intel and AMD processors are starting to bear some fruit.



This one is actually a good bit better than Via's very best chipset back in the day.  Suddenly it is "back in production and is readily available for immediate shipment."    AMD might have put some limitations on where their chips can be sold, but the ghost of Via certainly did not .....

Intel is encouraging these new competitors to "come on in, water's fine" by jacking up their chip prices synthetically and by putting a large profit margin on "older, more obsolete 22nm technologies" as they miss shipment after shipment on Intel 14nm chipsets.

Yes, Via's ghost (when combined with some current AMD technologies) can easily make a Core i5 equivalent 8 core chipset, as can other new fabs in China now that the Chinese government has bought some old USA companies for pennies on the dollar so as to excuse their new production being on the international market.
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« Last Edit: 10/01/18 at 14:45:27 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #61 - 09/28/18 at 19:05:55
 
   
https://newsroom.intel.com/news-releases/supply-update/

Intel in Crisis Mode

I have been showing you guys the building crisis that Intel finds itself inside at this particular point in time.

Intel is being run right now by their Chief Bean Picker not by a real CEO at all and not somebody that can make a realistic "visionary" strategy for improvement as that has never been his job before.    He counts beans, and reports on comparative bean counts -- that is what he is good at.

HOWEVER,  as a bean picker he can recognize the bean count numbers talking to him.   He has decided just this week to put 1 Billion additional beans into increasing Intel 14nm production capability by converting out of country 22nm lines to 14nm.


We are thrilled that in an increasingly competitive market, you keep choosing Intel. Thank you.

Now for the challenge… The surprising return to PC TAM growth has put pressure on our factory network. We’re prioritizing the production of Intel® Xeon® and Intel® Core™ processors so that collectively we can serve the high-performance segments of the market. That said, supply is undoubtedly tight, particularly at the entry-level of the PC market. We continue to believe we will have at least the supply to meet the full-year revenue outlook we announced in July, which was $4.5 billion higher than our January expectations.

To address this challenge, we’re taking the following actions:

We are investing a record $15 billion in capital expenditures in 2018, up approximately $1 billion from the beginning of the year. We’re putting that additional $1 billion into our 14nm manufacturing sites in Oregon, Arizona, Ireland and Israel. This capital along with other efficiencies is increasing our supply to respond to your increased demand.
We’re making progress with 10nm. Yields are improving and we continue to expect volume production in 2019.
We are taking a customer-first approach. We’re working with your teams to align demand with available supply. You can expect us to stay close, listen, partner and keep you informed.
The actions we are taking have put us on a path of continuous improvement. At the end of the day, we want to help you make great products and deliver strong business results. Many of you have been longtime Intel customers and partners, and you have seen us at our best when we are solving problems.

Sincerely,

Bob Swan
Intel Corporation CFO and Interim CEO


Sadly, the only options his bean-picking based staff sees available for new production are OLD 14nm tech options and in converting some old 22nm tech lines over to 14nm.   This is the non-technical bean picker's view of the whole mess and is at the root of Intel's poor decisions of late.

It never occurs to him to put some of the 15 billion of the rest of his capital expenditures dollars into new 5nm EUV direct burn technology lines and to leapfrog the log jam and get current with the rest of the ARM world while  he still has some discretionary funds to spend.  

Bean pickers lack vision, I guess ......

Tongue

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« Last Edit: 10/01/18 at 08:45:30 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #62 - 09/30/18 at 03:45:35
 
   
We are thrilled that in an increasingly competitive market, you keep choosing Intel. Thank you.
 
Intel has been considering itself to be the "PC market" for 20 years now, and now Intel is stating their belief that the market says they are "preferred" over all other sources and Intel now feels that they are free to drop in old 22nm chipsets and use that 10 year old old technology to bridge the production gap that Intel has itself created by not being able to follow the industry down to 10nm production and below.

Intel aggravates this 14nm production shortage by crowding more and more and more cores into their current chipsets (taking up larger and larger chip areas) which cuts down significantly on the number of finished chipsets you can get per wafer.

So, failure on top of failure is not "failure" for Intel.  

The Intel stockholders are thrilled if Intel makes money and pays dividends.   Intel stock prices thus remain high.

Until the previous sentence changes, Intel's current bean picker boss has no motivation to do anything.

By cranking up their old 22nm production lines to make some previous (2 generations back) small processors and by laying out a plan to spend a billion dollars to convert some old now out of country 22nm production lines over to 14nm Intel has functionally kicked their can on down the road a bit.

In Intel's eyes, the crisis has been averted and is over for now ......    (customer orders for new style chips can now be filled at first with old 22nm part numbers out of warehouse stock by just a little wipe with a solvent rag to get the ID numbers off the 10 year old inventory)

Tongue

In reality, Intel is mentally stuck firmly in the past and isn't moving anywhere.   Competitors are using AMD Ryzen tech and Via tech and ARM laptop SoC tech to make lower cost competitive chips in China and elsewhere that are just now starting to sell internationally.


...... jest kicking back and laughing at all them stupid user mullets in the Intel Boardroom jacuzzi .....



Intel is a big 'ol old fat set of frog buddies, contentedly sitting in a pan of water that is slowly getting hotter and hotter .......


We are thrilled that in an increasingly competitive market, you keep choosing Intel. Thank you.

Financial writers taking a hard look at market growth numbers take exception to Intel's claims of large market growth vs this claim of We are thrilled that in an increasingly competitive market, you keep choosing Intel. Thank you.  

First, the consumer PC market has shrunk 30% in the last five years and has only rebounded 2.5% just recently.  The Rackspace Market has grown fairly steadily over the entire period, but very very slowly.  Intel had enough 14nm manufacturing capacity prior to the last 0.5 % of this rebound period because their competition (AMD) was supplying a little more than half of the total industry's net growth amount.

What Intel has been successful at is their "core multiplication = progress" Jedi mind trick and although this mind trick loses effectiveness past 6-8 cores we find both Intel and AMD are beating those tired lathered horses on down the racetrack anyway.  Core counts are up to 12, 18, 24 and 32 cores now and enthusiast game boy consumers are actually buying the size equivalent of a HUGE rack space chipset from 3 years back (and Intel is calling this sad situation a market "preference" for Intel chipsets?)

How fast can Intel increase their real manufacturing capacity, turning 22nm lines into 14nm lines?   Not all that fast, unfortunately.   A whole lot of the smaller Intel 14nm chipsets will move back to 22nm production processes in the mean time.  

Make no mistake, Intel is picking the items they can best afford to lose (and they will lose them, ASAP).

AMD's Ryzen 2nd Generation is out now and 7nm++ production runs from TSMC are flowing as we speak, and the first finished production units from this AMD process stream clearly outperform most all of the older generations of 14nm Intel chipsets.  

All Ryzen chipsets clearly outperform the old 22nm Intel chipsets, with the only remaining Intel advantage has is coming from the Intel written gaming drivers that give a total intentional advantage to Intel motherboards and greatly (intentionally) disadvantaging the AMD Ryzen based motherboards.

Rackspace (Linux) uses of AMD shine though, because Linux and Linux drivers are optimized for each system, and both Intel and AMD boards are near equivalents in all Linux functions and tests, with AMD showing itself much better in Linux than it does in Windows.

So, Intel has some real competition now and that competition is making Intel get better somewhat faster than it did in years past.  

So why has Intel simply stopped advancing technologically at this point of the game ??   Intel still cannot currently make even a small 10nm two core chipset (the video segment doesn't work at all and production yields on the half of the chip Intel says they will keep are so poor Intel still won't tell anyone (including the people who ordered the chips) what the current yield rates actually are.

Can Intel jump out of the 14nm-22nm pot before they boil to death is the question now, really.


....... humph, is that fat old complacent frog still able to jump high enough to clear the edge of the pot ???
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« Last Edit: 10/03/18 at 03:15:24 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #63 - 10/01/18 at 07:25:37
 
   
https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-intel-core-cpu-market-share-price-report-septe...


Intel bites the big one .......  Intel new processor market share is tanking to >25% of the "new processor market share" --  this loss is due to Intel's recent compounded stupidities lead by a price jack up of 50%.  

Intel cannot meet established orders, so they are jacking up the price to encourage cancellation of orders that they cannot fill.   

PC vendors are now busy setting up new AMD Ryzen boards and building finished AMD units to be ready in time for Christmas.








This is current new processor sales data from Mindfactory.de (Germany's big version of Best Buy) just this past month.    Just look at the graphs then read the market share articles that are popping up all over the place.  

Barclays has downgraded Intel to  SELL  status due to these same issues.


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/01/barclays-downgrades-intel-to-sell-citing-risk...



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« Last Edit: 10/06/18 at 17:55:48 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #64 - 10/01/18 at 11:43:59
 
   
https://liliputing.com/2018/10/googles-project-stream-will-let-you-play-aaa-g...


Google joins Steam as everybody out there begins to chip away at Wintel's gaming monopoly .....


https://youtu.be/sE53eSbzxoU        click on this to view playing a game at 60 frames per second play rate (no matter how slow your PC is).


This hurts Intel because the only reason the fan boys stuck with big bucks Wintel units was to buy themselves a really good frame rate on their favorite AAA game.    Now this simply isn't a requirement any more, any old PC will do that  (and you don't have to run Windows 10, or even Window at all ......    My 15 year old Linux box can do it jest fine.)

With Google Tensor Servers to carry the calculation and video throughput work loads just about any old unit that can mount a "good enough" video card can make a fanboy all game happy now using Google's newest tricks.

See Gabe offer the packaged Google gaming service on Steam before Christmas time this year ......    

Betcha this new Google trick works with ARM Deimos and ARM Hercules Chromebook chipsets right out of the gate -- right along with all the older Linux OS machines which will follow along in a month or so.
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« Last Edit: 10/03/18 at 04:19:00 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #65 - 10/02/18 at 09:50:55
 

How the heck can Google think that they can run gaming for millions of fanboys off Google servers and be just as fast (or faster) than big Intel server chips (renamed as gaming rigs) can do on a local box level?

Something is up, boys and girls .......  and the answer is water cooled TPU version 3.  It can be AI, it can be learning, it can be execution, it can be GPU, it can be CPU, it can be programmable gate array and ..... yup, and it can execute video based games like nothing seen before, ever.


https://www.nextplatform.com/2018/05/10/tearing-apart-googles-tpu-3-0-ai-copr...

The old Version 2.0 is on top

This is the new Version 3.0 in on the bottom, this is 8 times faster than the stuff in the pic up above.
Go to the slider at the bottom of the post to see all 8 pods of Version 3.0 that are sitting in that one row.



Your machine becomes just a mouse/keyboard/gamepad interface and every PC has the guts to do that plenty fast enough.

Removing network lag from the system is kinda neat, at any control instance in the game there are choices to be made by the operator/game player.   Say 3-4 possible choices per decision junction.  Google just calculates out each of them and sends to your PC's memory buffer solutions for each instance, so when your slow meat fingers finally makes its physical move the choice is instantly implemented and the next set of choices is loaded.   Choice sets can be stacked in your buffer and 3 tall is commonly used as beyond that serious "calculations never used" waste takes place.

Is this efficient?   Not really, but Google says that TPU Version 2 was so direly underutilized it could be that supporting a lot of gaming simply makes use-sense to Google for TPU Version 3.   After all TPU Version 3 is 8 times better/faster throughput than ever before -- got to have something to keep that Google TPU Version 3 from getting all bored and taking over the world.

The whole trick keys off the fact that the human user is just sooooo durn slow compared to a good fast internet connection so that the Google/TPU/internet connection will have enough time to stay well ahead of the human being.

How fast is Google TPU version 3?   Well over 100 petaflops per second per pod.

Pe·ta·flop
pronounced ˈpedəˌfläp
noun COMPUTING
A unit of computing speed equal to one thousand million million floating-point operations per second.

This means the speed of ONE HUNDRED of Big Blue's complete room sized RoadRunner supercomputer per pod.   That's a bunch folks, a BUNCH of a bunch.


Year 2010's Big Blue Roadrunner at Los Alamo's Nuclear Research Center



Also note that each vertical stack you see below is a pod.   This is just one row of a Google server farm, and there are 12 Google server farms scattered around in the USA.




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« Last Edit: 10/03/18 at 14:42:49 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #66 - 10/03/18 at 07:00:31
 

 So you are saying 15 year old hardware runs current games at high FPS?  How do the processors handle that?
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #67 - 10/03/18 at 13:41:02
 

I can run the linked demo sampling at full 60 frames per second because .....

1)  I have a ATI video card in the old box so my display graphics can move right along OK, good enough anyway.

2)  I am not doing any game processing on my old box, but am just taking video feed from Google.   With the exception of giving some gaming inputs through a controller or mouse it is the same thing as Google's proposed gaming service will do.

3)  Instead of being crippled by Mickey not liking what I have for equipment (or being just too too out of date power-wise) I am running Chrome Browser on Linux Mint which does not see any "synthetic" hardware problems like a Windows 10 system might see.   Google / Steam would not care either.   The game will run like the feed does ..... fast and flawless.

You need to go back up to the top of the page and then read forward (stopping to read the references provided) because you miss a bunch of stuff by just looking at the last item at the bottom of a page.

Stuff like this .......   https://youtu.be/sE53eSbzxoU        click on this to view playing a game at 60 frames per second play rate (no matter how slow your PC is).


===================================================


Gabe at Steam now has 5 streaming games on his front page for folks to play around with.  

Google Stream at Steam, Steam Stream, Steam powered Google, Google out the seam pipe  .....  gotta be a catchy phrase in there somewhere.
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« Last Edit: 10/05/18 at 06:07:00 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #68 - 10/03/18 at 16:44:45
 

 I understand streaming and input-based feedback, I was just wondering how hardware that old didn't still have old-hardware issues like dealing with the input lag, or having outdated connection hardware.

 I like the idea of streamed gaming for increased access even though I will most likely stick to personal hardware updates every two years.  

 What I wonder about is if this won't just end up as a subscription service as well, like what Apple is planning for iTunes.
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #69 - 10/03/18 at 17:20:14
 

USB 2.0 on all the USB ports on the old machine -- this was an Engineer's Workstation from Dell when it was new, so I swing 8 gigs of systems memory and a 250 gig hard drive that is fairly modern for the input standards for 2001.  I have a X-box 360 controller and a Logitech mouse  and Logitech keyboard attached to it, so my input standards really aren't that ancient, but the processor is a 3 ghz Core 2 Duo and that is pretty slow compared to today's mega stuff.  

I get frame rates in the 30s and 40s for the games that will run at all off my local hardware.   Still, not bad for a $70 off lease Dell from 15 years ago.

Yes, this Google data farm feed service will be a subscription service --- you can pay Gabe/Google as you go or you can pay Mickey's monthly blood bowl fees after you have to go shell out for some super-expensive hardware from Intel.   Plus buy the game of course.  

Going Mickey's route is always more expensive, always.

Question is open. which one actually runs better and costs less.

We shall see if it actually becomes real and what that answer might wind up being.

You do realize that a nice cheap Chromebook will likely be able to do this trick as well, right?

Ditto for a USB 2.0 equipped TV with a small Google I/0 device attached to it.

And you might just be able to pay Gabe for the service right along with the particular games that you want.

But you can see where this is headed, right?    Games as an OS agnostic "supplied as needed" sort of thing which is what Gabe is driving towards right now.
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« Last Edit: 10/05/18 at 06:08:19 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #70 - 10/04/18 at 06:46:03
 

 Some of it is appealing but in general Chromebooks and such just don't meet the standard for what I use so I don't know how they would work in this type of setup.

 I typically don't care for the idea of not having the appropriate hardware to run the programs I am using and not having immediate replacements when damaged, but as you say time will tell as to which method is better and at a better value.  I suspect people like me will continue to purchase or build PC's while others will use the same PC for years taking advantage of the data farms.
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #71 - 10/04/18 at 14:35:56
 
Off topic but a good (scary) read if you are a geek -
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-10-04/the-big-hack-how-china-use...
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #72 - 10/05/18 at 06:01:22
 

Rest easy, NSA and CIA likely will be reading the tiny chip's outputs directly as it runs through the internet nodes, just to be seeing directly who the Chinese have caught in their itty bitty fishnet.

...... And folks wonder why the NSA and CIA are so adamant about not allowing any Huawei networking equipment to be installed in the USA by Sprint last past year .......

Chinese industrial espionage is evident everywhere already, in every USA research lab and Government agency.

I still find it amazing that the Chinese can finish up Qualcomm development projects and beat the American firm to first production, thus muddying up the "who came first" issue completely for any licensing purposes.  
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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #73 - 10/05/18 at 09:36:21
 
 
https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/5/17940902/microsoft-windows-10-october-2018...

https://betanews.com/2018/10/04/windows-10-october-2018-update-deleting-docum...





Win 10 isn't always faulting out when it lacks the room to properly re-install itself.   Sometimes it just deletes recent items that still in progress and wipes various system buffer system states to make enough room to re-install itself during the upgrade.    

And since it likes to do this spontaneously while you are at work, guess what can happen to the files and stuff (in the foreground or in the background) to whatever the heck you were just working on .......


New instructions

https://lifehacker.com/back-up-windows-10-before-installing-the-october-updat...

Please notice this fix comes from a third party.   Microsoft is still "investigating the issue" and has done nothing so far to help people get their damaged machines back to running again.


Bad Mickey,   bad bad bad clumsy STUPID evil little Mousie you.....



====================================================



Microsoft pulls the big October update off the servers and reverts users to their old system.   Issues with this "revert to your old system" exist as some machines won't even boot when Mickey does this un-announced "routine maintenance" thing late at night while you are sleeping, because Mickey had already deleted to many files due to a simple lack of hard drive space.    

But this is your fault because Mickey has done told you REPEATEDLY you need twice as much hard drive as your current data load actually uses.

Undecided

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« Last Edit: 10/06/18 at 18:06:16 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2018 -- new Intel failures & sucesses
Reply #74 - 10/05/18 at 10:15:44
 

https://www.eetasia.com/news/article/18100502-tsmc-to-start-5nm-production-in...

TSMC to Start 5nm Production in April


TSMC announces today that they will forego the 7nm++++ production generation this fall, but will instead begin "at risk" 5nm production right now instead.   5nm trial runs for ARM Holdings new Hercules SoCs and several other brands SoC and AMD chipsets having been already very successful completed with a full steady flow of 5nm memory products are currently rolling out of their new 5nm EUV process lines.

All of this is telling TSMC that 5nm is proven out completely and is ready to go.  

So TSMC is now taking some "at risk" 5nm production orders at this time.

Smart customers have already cancelled their 7nm +++ orders this past month in anticipation of this announcement.    This means the Deimos 7nm++++ ARM generation will likely be completely leapfrogged in favor of the full 5nm Hercules generation.

Next month, TSMC will put out their design tools for customers to convert their 12nm, 10nm & 7nm designs over to the closer packed 5nm designs.   Smart customers have already done their state of the art new Hercules 5nm designs fresh, based upon the ARM Holdings contract released 5nm design tools and the ARM preliminary released "fully certified" 5nm Hercules design set ups. (since all of these are all actually going to be "user modified ARM 5nm designs" anyway)  

TSMC has already run all the certification runs for ARM and AMD products already. so the yields for the 5nm Hercules process are already very well known to the participants.    Samsung has already run their own 5nm design runs as well, stating publicly they already have a 4nm capable process ready to go at this point in time.

In April or when the very first official TSMC 5nm runs actually ships then Intel will be formally 3 full process generations behind.   Intel cannot possibly recover on that process based performance lead by adding more and more cores and more cores to their already overburdened 14nm production system.

Come April at the latest, the fat lady officially sings for Intel
...... and the Intel Core i3-9 family begins its long underground circular spinning journey to the sea.
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« Last Edit: 10/06/18 at 18:10:23 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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