SuzukiSavage.com - cam chain tensioner mod works

verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28763 L.A. California Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #45 - 06/02/07 at 20:18:41 There's a grenade in every bike. Our bike is cheap, so it has a short fuse. We know how to put a new longer one in now.
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Oldfeller2 Senior Member Offline I love YaBB 1G - SP1! Posts: 323 Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #46 - 06/03/07 at 05:59:41 Vtail, Could your opposite end modification with the extension block be made as a simple kit that could be sold to members as an inexpensive drop in fix? Oldfeller
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verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28763 L.A. California Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #47 - 06/03/07 at 09:31:49 vtail, I don't see what you have in mind, but it would be easier to mod the attachment point rather than welding a tab on the plunger. The housing is all aluminum and easy to machine. Even Tbalam's concept of adjustment screw could be done from this end. I'll work on it.
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vtail

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #48 - 06/03/07 at 14:26:11

Plunger and housing stay totally stock. Just like the german invention, so unit is re-usable when new chain and guides are installed. We're moving the the housing further forward. Thought about it overnight and we can simplefy this even more. Take a block of steel ( I like 4130 ) 20x20x40 mm. Cut a 15mm long grove (same thickness of housig attach point) into 20x20 side . (Now you have 35mm of ungroved left). Drill hole thru groved part so that when you slide it on housing, it will fit snug to the housing and bolt together. Now drill the mounting hole parallel to first hole at the desired spacing ( say 15 to 18 mm ) To be able to put circlip in we drrill a larger hole from th top (90 degree offset) thu the second (Rearward) hole an put cirlip in with needle nos plyers. Voila. I'll make a drawing tommorrow. Keep the shiny side up

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vtail Senior Member Offline life's short, ride fast Posts: 408 Portland,OR Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #49 - 06/03/07 at 16:59:03 On tuesday I'll make some wooden models so Y'all can picture it better
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vtail Senior Member Offline life's short, ride fast Posts: 408 Portland,OR Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #50 - 06/04/07 at 08:15:11 Thought about it some more, For this last solution there might not be anough room on the pin and you'd have to use an Omega circlip. Anyway I'll make a wooden model and I might post it (picture) on Wednesday.
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borne2fly

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #51 - 06/04/07 at 09:20:52

How about .............. simply remove the spring inside the tensioner adjuster housing? It would then become a manually adjusted tensioner.

I don't have the bike or a manual in front of me now, but I seem to recall that we can see the adjuster through the oil filter inspection plate. If so, then whenever we change the oil filter we could also give the adjuster a shove and see if it advances to the next click. If the next click happened to be the end of the rope then we might be able to see or feel it do something odd right then and there before it damaged anything..

Several folks suggested that the cam chain stretch might be due to the tensioner always racheting forward when the engine is cold, so that when the engine warms up and expands this would result in an overtightened chain. A manual adjuster would lend much better control over this sort of thing and possibly improve the chain life. Whaddya think?

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vtail

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #52 - 06/04/07 at 10:16:05

Steel expand when hot. We've all seen pictures of railroad traks buckled by extreme heat because there was not enough expansion space between tracks. So the chain is longest when hot and that,s when the tensioner adjusts to the next notch. The spring might not be strong anough to work without the ratching mechanism. However one could maybe remove that mechanism, drill a tiny 1/16" hole thru the TOP of the housing (at the bottom) of plunger hole, campher it with a 1/4" drill (like countersinking). Fill housing with oil, put in spring,put in piston, compress for installation (excess oil will come out of hole,and countersink acts like miniature reservoir filled from splash oil ) You now have a mini shock absorber. A slightly stronger spring might be necessary. Roll Eyes

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vtail Senior Member Offline life's short, ride fast Posts: 408 Portland,OR Gender:	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #53 - 06/04/07 at 10:27:44 Oh and you'd have to gove the bottom on plunger for an o'ring to seal. Maybe to complex so I'll stick with my first solution. ( Y shaped steel extension)
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verslagen1

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #54 - 06/04/07 at 11:27:42

there's no access to the tensioner thru the oil filter cover.

However, with right piece of sheet metal, you could create a piece that could be accessed thru the oil fill.

BTW: I ran numbers on the expansion of the chain and cylinder. The cylinder grows faster than the chain. And I think the cylinder is more apt to be hotter than the chain is. So, most likely adjustment occurs at peak heat.

Shock absorber idea: the fit between the plunger and housing is already tight. Add a little oil and it's in hydraulic lock as there's not a vent on the backside. Which might negate the problem of overtight adjustment.

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borne2fly Ex Member	Re: cam chain tensioner mod works Reply #55 - 06/04/07 at 11:56:37 verslagen1 ....... I still like the idea of pulling out the tensioner spring. But without any access through the oil filter area I'm going to have to cut an access port into the housing. It sounds a little brutal, but anything as finicky as this tensioner thing warrants some means of easy inspection.
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borne2fly

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #56 - 06/04/07 at 11:59:24

verslagen1 wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:06:

BTW: I ran numbers on the expansion of the chain and cylinder. The cylinder grows faster than the chain. And I think the cylinder is more apt to be hotter than the chain is. So, most likely adjustment occurs at peak heat.

If the cylinder grows faster than the chain, then wouldn't the chain be looser when the engine is cold?

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vtail

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #57 - 06/04/07 at 15:56:50

With all due respect, if you read it again I did drill a 1/16 camphered venthole on top of the housing bottom to prevent hydraulic lock. Cylinder head temps should be ideally between 325 to 375 degrees (450 to 500 max) measured at the sparkplug hole. On aircraft we run both a cylinder head temp (CHT) and an exhaust gas temp (EGT) gauge. Verslagen you're right, the timing chain probably runs in the naborhood of the oil temp, somewhere around 180 to 200 degrees.

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'07, White spacer REMOVED, 152,5 main jet, K&N drop-in filter, Mac exh, Sigma 906, ENM PT15B2 tach, factory s bags, shield, backrest/lug rack, crashbar, Kuryakyn 7980 ext hwy pegs,412-4233C+'09 C50T

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verslagen1

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #58 - 06/04/07 at 17:10:39

borne, agree with you. I'd thought of an access port before but found out that the oil cover limited the size. I would cut a hole and fit a pipe plug to it. Maybe you can find one in aluminum that you can polish up.

Vtail, sorry, I read thru it between bites and swallers. And really was refering to stock.

I got one of them cheap temp gages and measured the temps 10 min after I got home. head 185°F, cylinder 215°F, case 165°F. Tomorrow I'll take it again right after I get off.

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borne2fly

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Re: cam chain tensioner mod works
Reply #59 - 06/04/07 at 18:00:12

verslagen1 ..... do you think the adjuster is overtightening the chain? This is one of my main reasons for building a manual tensioner. I'm hoping that a properly adjusted manual tensioner will extend the chain life to something more acceptable, and that I wouldn't have to fiddle with it any more often than a valve adjustment.

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