SuzukiSavage.com - EEEEEK! Guns.....

HovisPresley Serious Thumper Offline Good Vibrations! Posts: 991 Midlands, UK Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #45 - 07/27/15 at 06:32:45 The Ireland figures don't really count for much as the IRA and the 'troubles' were at their peak in the early 70's. In 1972, 26 unarmed civilians were shot by the occupying forces whilst on a civil rights march. So then lots of people armed themselves, not as a defence measure, but as a 'peoples army' wanting to overthrow the system.
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Paraquat

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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #46 - 07/27/15 at 09:21:57

HovisPresley wrote on 07/27/15 at 06:23:12:

What sharp drop off c.2014?

None of those graphs go up to 2014, or am I missing something?

My apologies. I was at the end of my break and typing feverishly to complete the post. I used the information from 2014 and the data from 2004 and superimposed the two in my head.

The facts remain the same though, since permits were issued to citizens the crime rate has dropped, and in areas where firearms were restricted crime has risen.

--Steve

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HovisPresley

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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #47 - 07/27/15 at 10:17:26

Paraquat wrote on 07/27/15 at 09:21:57:

The facts remain the same though, since permits were issued to citizens the crime rate has dropped, and in areas where firearms were restricted crime has risen.
--Steve

(Italics mine).
..........................................................

The graph you showed for England & Wales shows less homicides in 2010 than in 1997 (when an amendment was made to the firearms law following the Dunblane school massacre), so there is no correlation.

The amendment banned hand guns, not firearms, as anyone with a sawn-off shotgun will tell you.

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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #48 - 07/27/15 at 11:13:45

The key things I take away from the graph is the spike following the ban, and the constant increase of police officers/constables/etc.

More personnel is required to maintain the same levels 20 years ago.

I will openly admit that I don't know what constitutes a "firearm" or what the specific restrictions regarding firearms are in the UK.

--Steve

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HovisPresley

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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #49 - 07/27/15 at 11:44:42

I agree, the spike is alarming, but it came down as quick as it rose, and it reached a lower point than it was prior to the ban.

The police numbers are just that, numbers of police, rather than a ratio or percentage of police per 'citizen'.
The UK has a growing population, yet the police numbers are falling.

The graph shows that police numbers grew rapidly and steadily around September 2001, when political and security issues were forced to be reassessed, for obvious reasons. Sad

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WebsterMark Serious Thumper Online SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 12847 Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #50 - 07/28/15 at 04:51:12 If we're going to let a woman decide if she wants to kill her baby or not, I think we should let people decide on their own if they want to own a gun. I'm Pro-choice on gun ownership.
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HovisPresley Serious Thumper Offline Good Vibrations! Posts: 991 Midlands, UK Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #51 - 07/28/15 at 05:43:29 So Mark, if (God forbid) a big black bi-sexual Muslim 'liberal' guy steps out of the shadows and rapes your wife/daughter/mother at gun point.... can I assume that you'd approve of him carrying a gun, as is his right, and you'd be okay in 9 months time when you have a new child, grandchild, or half-brother?
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old.indian Serious Thumper Offline Fighting Foreign Terrorism since 1492 Posts: 975 Central New Mexico Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #52 - 07/28/15 at 13:16:29 HP ... I keep telling you that a wise man never argues with a fool. Uninformed observers might not be able to tell the difference...... (I know that I'm quoting someone , but I can't remember who....)
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WebsterMark Serious Thumper Online SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 12847 Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #53 - 07/28/15 at 13:18:29 i beg your pardon oldindian....
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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #54 - 07/28/15 at 13:32:04

Quote:

“ … guy steps out of the shadows and rapes your wife/daughter/mother at gun point…. “

Let’s see, this is a, ‘criminal’, who has the gun.
And the upstanding Citizen, who does Not ?

Exactly, HOW, taking a gun, away, from the, ‘husband’, of above wife.
Will STOP, the, ‘Criminal’, from having one?

OR as you, imply, he is, ’not’, a Criminal.
Quote:

“ … I assume that you’d approve of him carrying a gun, as is his right … “

Well then it’s simple, because the, ‘husband’, would have one also,
because, his, 'RIGHT’, was Not, taken, away !

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .

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old.indian Serious Thumper Offline Fighting Foreign Terrorism since 1492 Posts: 975 Central New Mexico Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #55 - 07/28/15 at 14:54:47 WebsterMark wrote on 07/28/15 at 13:18:29: i beg your pardon oldindian.... OK... NOW what did you say/do ???????
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HovisPresley

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Re: EEEEEK! Guns.....
Reply #56 - 07/28/15 at 14:54:56

The 'husband' is, say, at home fixing his bike in his garage.

The mother/wife/daughter has a gun in her handbag.

As it's in her bag it's useless because the rapist snatched her bag as she was walking home across the park from college/work/shops.

She had no time to react as the guy jumped out from behind a bush/fence....

Then it's off to Mothercare....

PS. I didn't imply that he wasn't a criminal, I said that I assume you (WM) would support his right to bear arms, as is his right to.

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WebsterMark Serious Thumper Online SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 12847 Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #57 - 07/28/15 at 15:14:44 old.indian wrote on 07/28/15 at 14:54:47: WebsterMark wrote on 07/28/15 at 13:18:29: i beg your pardon oldindian.... OK... NOW what did you say/do ??????? Nothing that I know of.
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Serowbot YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline OK.... so what's the speed of dark? Posts: 28375 Tucson Az Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #58 - 07/28/15 at 18:04:57 WebsterMark wrote on 07/28/15 at 15:14:44: old.indian wrote on 07/28/15 at 14:54:47: WebsterMark wrote on 07/28/15 at 13:18:29: i beg your pardon oldindian.... OK... NOW what did you say/do ??????? Nothing that I know of. Did somebody fart?... ... We''lll blame the dawg... ...
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old.indian Serious Thumper Offline Fighting Foreign Terrorism since 1492 Posts: 975 Central New Mexico Gender:	Re: EEEEEK! Guns..... Reply #59 - 07/28/15 at 19:15:12 Am I the only one that has noticed that whenever 'bot has done something rude and uncouth he tries to blame the dawg ???? (And he isn't even embarrassed about it either.... )
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