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Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc (Read 5530 times)
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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #210 - 12/24/15 at 09:35:50
 

Here is what's fun about steam, it currently comes in 6 radial cylinders for very low pressure steam and in one long long stroking single cylinder for high temperature steam.    Both ideas are fully engineered out right now with a hundred plus years of development time behind them.   Both systems can be bought today, from existing companies.

Tolerances are generous in steam, as things grow and contract a lot.   Modern stainless steel, everything teflon coated steam engines use water for their lubricant, they don't even need that stinky greasy steam oil any more.

No need for a transmission either just as long as the piston area is enough square inches to start the machine to rolling on an uphill lay.   If it can start rolling over (enough starting torque) it is good for any functional mph (up to well over 100 mph).

Steam cars were all direct drive long stroking single cylinder engines.

High temp high pressure steam can do cars and such much better than low temp steam, but not as efficiently as the newly invented gasoline engines could do the same jobs back in the 1930s when internal combustion engines took over all of steam's duties because gasoline was 19 cents a gallon.  

Fuel cost was the separator back then,  but with LENR now offering practically free fuel cost the equation swings back in the other direction back to high pressure steam being the most cost effective future pathway.

A steam engine is very cheap to build compared to an internal combustion engine (far fewer parts at much easier tolerances).

Smiley

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« Last Edit: 12/24/15 at 19:42:26 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #211 - 12/26/15 at 17:36:59
 
 
http://www.e-catworld.com/2015/12/26/rossi-the-e-cat-x-does-produce-electrici...

CHRISTMAS UPDATE (Dec 26, 2015)

Frank Acland followed up on the JONP with a couple of questions:

1. Is the amount of electricity being produced at the moment large enough to be practical and useful?
2. Is there an external input of power required to maintain the production this electricity?

Andrea Rossi
December 26th, 2015 at 10:35 AM
Frank Acland:
1- yes and the efficiency is very high
2- yes and the COP is very high
But attention: this comes from a work made this last night so it is too soon to chant victory.
Maybe it breaks up. Right now I am on the E-Cat X and it works making heat and electricity. I hope it is not a dream of half Winter.
Warm Regards
A.R.


Now, what does this mean?

Efficiency that is very high is generally better than 25% efficiency (high temp steam turbine generation is 25% or better, with some large plants running at the 40% efficiency levels).

VERY HIGH might mean ..... very high.

COP that is very high is going to be better than 20 COP ..... based on the current low temp plant offering COP at 20 and above over time.   Up to 80 COP has been reported by visitors to Rossi's 1 megawatt container plant (then all the visitor folks were silenced immediately as this disclosure violated their NDA, but not before another visitor had verified the 20-80 COP in writing, which was then also withdrawn a day later).

So, if the 20-80 COP plant is indeed the comparison point and the new one is "very high COP" you may indeed have something not yet imagined by the outside world, nor by Rossi's competitor/copycats.  

Look to see complete secrecy shrouding this new plant until the active patents are applied for and at least patent pending status granted.    

And since the whole thing will be suitcase size, Rossi may just plunk one down at the patent counter as proof of concept.

Wouldn't that be something?    

Rossi is also hinting that the new cells can be made by layering the elements using something akin to silicone wafer building crossed with 3-D printing.

And that my friends is very cheap automatic type processing.

And a Happy New Year to you all.





There have been lots of follow up questions put to Rossi and his answers are getting shorter and shorter.

However this exchange is telling, because it suggest the RATIO of heat to electricity is an "adjustable variable" once an output level has be set for the reactor overall -- then the ratio of heat vs electricity can be tuned at that selected general output level.

He provided an interesting response to a question by Hank Mills who asked, “When the COP of the E-Cat X (in terms of electrical output) is high, does the COP (only considering heat output) also remain high?” Ross responded, “obviously”. Mills followed up with this question:

In the E-Cat X now, which is greater: the heat output, or electricity output?”

Response:

Andrea Rossi
December 26th, 2015 at 9:57 PM
Frank Acland:
We can choose.
Warm Regards,
A.R.




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« Last Edit: 12/27/15 at 21:42:11 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #212 - 12/27/15 at 11:37:37
 

"Italo R. December 27th, 2015 at 11:38 AM

Dear Dr. Rossi, does the E-Cat-X produce electricity also during SSM periods?
Kind Regards, Italo R.

Andrea Rossi December 27th, 2015 at 1:01 PM
Italo R.: Yes.
Warm Regards, A.R."



You are looking at a steam car package and a remote living "power, heat, hot water" package .....

Roll them all into a steam RV and you got true mobile living (if you can get you a cold water hook up somehow).

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #213 - 12/27/15 at 12:39:22
 
My concern at this point what will the effect be on global climate change?
Naturally, 10,000,000 burning fires great and small are extinguished...
and an equal amount of LENR heaters are set to glow.  When it cost a bundle of wood a day to heat your home, now you can flip a switch and you can heat your home to the point snow won't stay on the roof.
will it be better or worse?
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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #214 - 12/27/15 at 12:48:31
 

Now LENR is beginning to be taken seriously the oil industry's "BLACK SWAN" effect is being predicted to hit any number of other industrial sectors starting as soon as this upcoming year.

Socio-economic historians are looking back at the electrical revolution as the predictor of what this paradigm shift effect will be like, except this time no wires have to be run all over the place to carry the power.

DE-CENTRALIZATION is the big buzz word now -- regional, co-op and city-wide power plants popping up all over instead of folks continuing to invest in large centralized plants.

The coal industry is the first to go, followed by heating oils and other petroleum products.   Natural gas will go last as it is already pretty much a regional power source and it is much cleaner, only making water vapor and CO2 as its burn end products.

Canada will get filled up with people finally, as the cooler climate does not affect people settling there nearly as much whenever you can have all the power and heat you want for peanuts.  

Canada has clean water and lots of big empty places for people to be.    As Global warming continues, Canada will become more and more desirable as real estate.

PEOPLE in multiple new billions will cause more warming by stripping off tree cover, etc. etc.

Industry and industrial wastes causes global pollution that results in bio-death and more global warming.

Global warming will not stop until the planet dies off totally.

By then the smartest and best of our great-grandkids will have moved off planet to a variety of new venues, and the great Diaspora will have begun.

Scientists have opened their eyes now, and the newest theories that allow for LENR allow all sorts of new transformation effects and some are seeing potential temporal and gravitational effects in these new theories as well.
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« Last Edit: 12/27/15 at 21:44:40 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #215 - 12/27/15 at 16:12:09
 
Some amazing developments in science. The possibilities that Rossis work has, add that to the promise of graphene, look at this stuff
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovation/metal-999-percent-air-180957574

There is this bit of a head scratcher,

Next to last one

http://ppcorn.com/us/2015/11/10/top-6-scientific-discoveries-2015/

the categories of matter, such as gas, liquid, and solid, scientists have added a substance called Jahn-Teller Metal to this list. This material is said to be not only a metal, but also a magnet, superconductor, and insulator. This development holds promising opportunities for energy revolution, as it has the ability to conduct electricity without any sort of energy release such as heat or sound. This metal receives its name after the Jahn-Teller effect, which describes the distortion of the geometric patterns of molecules and ions at low pressures under an electronic state. This material is revolutionary in that it can turn previously insulating materials into conductors with only a small amount of pressure.


Superconductor AND insulator,,
Is that kinda like something that could constipate you or give you diarrhea?

Interesting times.
Wouldn't it be great to have energy so affordable and able to put in places where now it's just not feasible?
Imagine the smiles of the people who are cooking over burning ox crap. If this works out there is just no comparison to how important it is, IMO.  
Energy, wow,
If it drives oil down, then that would make oil less important, which would make fighting for it less likely.
So much good stuff that could come from this. This threatens so many peoples fortunes. I'm shocked that he is still alive. Or, maybe the oil magnates are figuring out how to get ahead with the coming changes.
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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #216 - 12/27/15 at 20:20:21
 

Justin, he just spent months sleeping on a cot inside a steel box in a secret location ...... I think folks not knowing where he is at any given time is a very good idea right now.

Smart folks can see lots of ways to make a profit out of the changes that are coming.  

Ragheads and radicals would be the ones shooting at various misc. steel containers scattered here and there with rocket grenades and tank killers.



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« Last Edit: 12/27/15 at 21:27:55 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #217 - 12/28/15 at 08:04:01
 

http://www.e-catworld.com/2015/12/28/rossi-planning-a-commercial-as-well-as-t...



Rossi Planning a Commercial (as Well as Technological) Revolution
Posted on December 28, 2015 by Frank Acland

"Now Andrea Rossi has made an apparently spectacular breakthrough with the E-Cat he seems to be turning his mind not just to technological revolution, but commercial revolution. Here are some comments he made yesterday on this topic.

“My dream is a product for everybody that makes everybody make money with it. I am also studying a commercial system that will allow everybody to make money with the E-Cat. I dream a product that extends the benefits of it to everybody. Until I will not arrive to this point my work will not have been terminated.I want to make not only a revolution in the energy field, but also in the commercial field. F9.”

“I am preparing a commercial revolution to make of the E-Cat a money maker for a mass of persons. A totally new commercial system fit for the E-Cat.
Let me study on this.I have an idea, but it too is maturing.”

“To explain I give just 2 examples:
1- example of pruduct that has made everybody make money: the computer
2- example of small individual entity that developed such a product and grew up: Apple
About the particulars of what we are setting up ( F9) it is not the case to disclose them now”.

Andrea Rossi has always been interested in making a practical difference in people’s lives with his technology, and not just success in the laboratory. Now, in additional to making products, it sounds like he is thinking of ways to change the world of commerce, and making everyone wealthy with the E-Cat. This is quite a tall order indeed.

But maybe not so surprising, or far fetched. I have always thought that if we could get products into the marketplace that made the production of energy a trivial thing in terms of expense and complexity, that our whole economic system would need to change, as so much of the cost the goods and services we used is based on the cost of the energy needed to provide them.

I am, however, a bit confused about what Rossi means when he wants people to use the E-Cat to make money. If he means selling energy back to the grid with an E-Cat, that would not make sense if everyone has E-Cats producing excess electricity, since there would then be no need for the grid.

Maybe he’s thinking of some elaborate sales or referral plan where people can make money selling E-Cats to their neighbors and friends, thus pushing the tech quickly into the marketplace. But that wouldn’t last long, and the benefits would be mainly for the initial seller.

When Rossi gives the example of the computer and Apple as a product and company that have helped people make money, the computer has certainly had a vast economic impact, and provided great benefits around the world but I’m not so sure that Apple would be an example of a company that has helped lots of people make money. Their products are very expensive.

So I guess we’ll have to wait to find out exactly what he means here. Maybe it’s a flash in the pan idea that won’t amount to much when faced with the realities of the cold hard world of commerce — but perhaps he really will come up with something really revolutionary. For now I think this commercial plan will have to be a secondary issue. The first order of the day is going to have to get the products working successfully."


Rossi is trying to set up a system by which his wafer built E-Cat X is cheap enough to discourage copy cat production and complex enough to forestall easy reverse engineering.

This is consistent with Rossi keeping formula secrets such that nobody has really completely replicated his work even yet.

This thought pattern is common with most inventions that CAN be kept secret.  And if an programmed assembly machine builds the flat center of that E-Cat X module in a fine detailed manner and then sends out completed "difficult to analyze" modules to power a wide variety of items (outputs dependent on the device programming) then Rossi can keep control over his world while selling it widely.

Will Rossi's first items be pricey?   Likely yes, but unless he ramps the price down quickly  and the supply up VERY QUICKLY somebody in a nation that does NOT HONOR PATENTS will be cranking out his stuff for him for cheap.  His secrets will be stolen by somebody.   And then Rossi will have to become a patent enforcer with all of his free time.

And yes, Dean Kamen will be putting Rossi's reactor modules inside his third world desalinization plants and the Gates Foundation will be backing this EFFECTIVE HUMANITARIAN effort ASAP.

Rossi's invention will permit a population explosion that will quickly drive us off  this planet just as soon as the tech to do so is developed.

When I was a kid, science fiction was way way out there.   I have lived long enough to see much of it come to pass, and for some of it to be surpassed.



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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #218 - 12/29/15 at 20:23:36
 

People are asking Rossi to please hurry up and put an E Cat-X on sale as a demo unit so they can experiment with it.   They are impatient, very impatient.  

Rossi responds:

Akum:

You can’t imagine how impatient am I, but I must be patient all the way, working to make it happen as soon as possible. Sometime you can’t foresee: for example, I studied for years how to get out from an E-Cat directly electricity ( we had traces of it), but I have not been able and for those years no progress has been done…suddenly, during a night in the plant, I got an idea that arrived unexpected, and in few seconds we got a progress that we didn’t get in years.

Therefore, it is impossible to give an answer.

Warm Regards,

A.R.



I think Rossi is really saying that until he can tuck all his functional secrets and mix secrets into a flat matrix sealed component unit such that dissection for secrets isn't obvious or easy to do then no one will see or hold early examples of his newest tricks.

Certainly not until the controlling patents are firmly in hand, anyway, and real production and distribution has begun.

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #219 - 12/30/15 at 09:28:03
 

http://www.e-catworld.com/2015/12/30/overview-of-the-electric-e-cat-x/

2015 summary of E-Cat X       The comments at the bottom of this link are very interesting, might want to read them too.

"Work on the E-Cat X is taking place in a separate lab from the shipping container where the 1 MW plant is located, but it’s close to allow for easy access to both working locations. Immediately on making this discovery, Rossi shut off access to this lab to anyone but himself — in fact he says he is the only person who has seen the E-Cat X producing electricity.

He has gone to work right away writing a new patent application that covers this discovery which he says he will deposit within days. He says he cannot provide more information at this point on the E-Cat X to avoid pre-disclosure. One thing he does say is that the ratio of heat to electricity can be adjusted, and also Volts and Amps can be adjusted.

The E-Cat X is based on the same wafer technology that is described in the US Patent that covers the E-Cat, and he built the E-Cat X to fit within this patent, which he emphasized belongs to Leonardo Corporation. He says that once the patent application has been filed he will “set up a specific team in Leonardo Corporation” to work on the E-Cat X.

The E-Cat X uses wafers as described in his US Patent and these wafers which include the fuel and the electric resistors are now being produced by machine, rather than being hand built. When asked if the E-Cat X had any moving parts, Rossi responded, “confidential” but he says it makes no sound when operating. He also said that it does include additional parts.

The electric E-Cat X does require an external energy source to operate, but Rossi does say that it continues to produce electricity during period of self-sustain. Regarding the efficiency of the electricity production, he says it is very high, as is the COP. He says that the power of the E-Cat X can be throttled up and down and that the response is fast.

So that’s a summary of the way things are at the moment, based on what AR has reported. It’s interesting to me that he is again emphasizing the primacy of Leonardo Corporation in this whole enterprise with the E-Cat X, rather than Industrial Heat."



New item to me is that Rossi HAS the prototype production robotic assembly equipment right there outside the original trailer and he is using it to make his experimental samples.

Since E-Cat X ramps up and down quickly Rossi can make new samples, test the startup characteristics and output and adjustability levels, document it all and then cut them way way on up for upper limit radiation output testing (destroying them in the process) then make another set and do it again to see how consistent this particular mix/construction really is behaving.

He is able to collapse what took a long long year to do with the low temp 1 megawatt steam reactors into just a few weeks time span.

Rossi could then duplicate the assembly machinery at Woodford and simply courier the programming over to get it started up when the time comes.   Or else he can box up the plant itself and ship it (containerized automatic assembly lines are a common trick that is done in industry all the time right now).

Secrecy is high at the IH facility that Rossi is working in, and it sounds like this is also going to be the prototype automated assembly plant as well, where all the kinks get worked out of the assembly process.

This CAD "illustration" may be a lot more real than folks think.


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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #220 - 01/01/16 at 03:42:15
 

Rossi had promised a "revealing update" of his dreams on the E-Cat X for his New Year's ball dropping present to the world.   He did do this, but the amount of completely new information is minimal apart from a generalized $50 per killowatt construction cost.

The New Year's dream is for a large scale distributed creation of heat and light and electricity with the current Rossi dream system using the lighting portion as "street lights" ????? or exterior house lights ??????   Issue apparently is the very large amount of heat generated when run at electricity levels requires outside heat dumping if you want the large amounts of light and electricity as your primary uses.    You can tap part of the heat using circulating hot water systems as a freebee by product, but would have to use/pay for electricity to run hot water pumps, etc.

If you are after just heat (or steam) forget about the light, it stays inside the chamber and is turned into yet more heat inside the chamber itself.    These smaller units can be inside your house and more effectively placed at point of use.

In full temperature SSM mode, the E-Cat X is a net generator of electricity -- BUT in heat up mode it draws strongly more electricity than it produces and produces nothing much "in excess" unless it is a glowing blindingly white hot thing.

Here is an existing drawing of the Ecat X core construction.   At full temperature the thing glows at a brilliant white light level, emitting large amounts of usable light.   It is capable of being used as a room light source if run "exposed" at those high levels for either the making of heat or of electricity.   A very small unit in a light pole style light fixture could produce multi-room heat and single room constant on lighting in the winter time.

Issue becomes all the heat that gets generated at those "power and light generating" levels.  Something big enough to power your home would heat you out of it completely.

Light seems to be a function of the turned up intensity level the cell is run at, while the amount of heat or electricity seems to be a trade off function of electricity draw off from the plates which is removing reaction energy from the cell and tends to muffle the cell somewhat.

There is much that is insufficiently explained at this point in time but it is clear that the "little sun" test rod made by the MFMP people showed a real effect that Rossi's finished wafer device is also now showing.  

Rossi has intentionally spread his reactor out in a planar ribbon like fashion, layering the reactors on both sides of a ribbon heater so he can heat up to reaction temps quickly and also turn it down quickly in reaction to a changing steam generation load.

The drawing comes from the Rossi existing Patent, so it discloses no new information.   His words simply say the thing is capable of making lots of light, lots of heat and some electricity as a normal draw off of what is going on in the lithium transformation reactions.

Rossi's words (upon review and in light of his Patent drawing and the wording of his Patent) show that the long flat 1 megawatt reactor that has been running for the last year is somewhat akin to this design as well.



========================================



Nothing discussed so far seems to exclude construction of a Steam Car, but such might have to be connected to wall power to get it fired up after being off for a while.

The car steam chamber might have to be stored dry and very very hot during stop and go driving, so think of it as a flash steam chamber rather than a boiler system and you have a better fix on the resulting steam car idea.

Using an injector system to meter the input water and keeping the reactor chamber metered to be a uniform HOT TEMP means you can have instant accelerator action response with minimal to no lag.   The reactor will only have HOT and idle modes, so the control requirements of the reactor are not so severe.   "Keeping a head of steam up" all the time when on has some inherent benefits as far as buffering small rate changes goes ..... the reactor itself doesn't need to yo yo back and forth so much, it just needs to keep up with the overall demand level in general.

You need to develop a fast acting steam high temp /pressure injector to feed steam into the cylinder itself, (akin to the fuel injectors used today) to give the instant fine foot pedal control.  

This valve will require an upstream user changeable trash filter to keep the valve from getting fouled up with lime deposit trash.   Some early models may use mechanical poppet valves as are used in current cars, but would require some filtering as even a poppet valve cannot handle solid trash getting trapped on the seat.

The simpler lower temperature / pressure water injector to the reactor to keep the steam pressure constant and high is not as challenging a task as you will have a broader "good" range for that and a slower response requirement as you are just building and maintaining a good head of steam.

Periodic descaling of the flash chamber will be required, but that could be an additive put in with the water every week or so, with a purge cycle that you put the parked car into to high volume blow off mode to clean the steam chamber while you feed it the chemical water to dissolve the lime deposits.   This would go out a separate purge valve that would vent up and out at an angle, a purge valve with enough mechanical strength to crush lime deposit trash on cut off as it would certainly see some trash when it was used.



Andrea Rossi
January 1st, 2016 at 12:19 AM
ing
Dear Readers of the JoNP:

It’s 00.00.01″ of January 1st 2016.

Update: the 1 MW E-Cat is stable and in ssm, the E-Cat X is very promising and still operating and making heat, electricity.

The E-Cat X is very close to the design of the core of the apparatus described in the US Patent, I mean the wafer. It has been engineered to resist to very high temperatures. The electricity exits directly from the wafer.

As I said , several nights ago I had a dream. The E-Cat X had been produced in billions pieces, each of them assembled with others in various combinations to make public lamps: a town was totally illuminated by the E-Cat X and from every lamp a network of pipes and of wires was able to distribute heat and electricity to the houses.

In that town there were about 1 million lamps each of them of 500 watts, consuming about 50 watts; consequently, there were 450 MWh/h produced, of which about half were turned into heat distributed to the houses through a network of well insulated pipes, running inderground, like optic fibers, the other half was used to enlight the town and to distribute electricity to the households.

The cost of the E-Cat X was around 50 $/kW of power, due to the production of billions of pieces per year in all the world, with tens of thousands of jobs. Less taxes were paid by the people, due to the saves derived from low pollution and low energy cost for public services.

Millions of persons were also earning money selling E-Cats and every owner of E-Cats was saving money in utilities ( electricity, heat, light).

Then I heard the alarm clock: it was time to return to the factory, to make true the dream. F9.
Happy new year, I love you all.

I am drinking my cup of Korbel champagne, then i have to return to the gauges of the plant. She is good, tonight.

Again, Happy 2016, May God bless you all,

Andrea



Further refinements and down-sizing efforts will have to be made as Rossi is starting out at his 1 megawatt plant layered ribbons and working down towards toaster ovens and light bulbs.

Wink
     
Hey Rossi !!!  Build either one of these and I'd buy one ASAP !!!!

                     
Constant on light and multi-room heater --- multiple flat plates force room air intermix -- keeps "reasonable" temp levels above fixture




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« Last Edit: 01/11/16 at 00:28:12 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #221 - 01/03/16 at 12:37:32
 

On JONP:

"Andrea Rossi January 3rd, 2016 at 8:27 AM
Richard Wade:
Here are “ballpark” figures, to be worked upon:
Cost of the E-Cat X/kW: 50 $, payback time 90 days
Cost of the water piping to distribute the heat in an urban neighborhood: average 200 $/kW, payback time 1 year
Cost of the light 10 $/kW, payback time 10 days
Cost of the cabling to distribute the electric energy 200 $/kW, payback time 1 year
Total cost of the “network system” : 2 years and 4 months
Expected lifespan of the system: 15 years
Potential market, considering to serve 1 billion people: 3 billion kWh/h
Potential E-Cat market, limited to this sector of employment: 1.5 trillions of $
Now, let’s wake up, shake off the dreams and put down to work.
Warm Regards,
A.R."

Rossi to Rachel:
"It’s 08.05 a.m. of Sunday Jan 3rd
E-Cat 1 MW stable, mostly in ssm.
E-Cat X in operation, still promising to make the dream true.
"

It is clear Rossi is thinking tightly packed urban and possibly Scandinavian urban at that.    It would also fit Chinese and Indian urban as well, especially in the northern provinces.

Swedes and Norwegians already like to use steam heat (geothermal) when it is available, and they are definitely socialistic/communistic in their approach to "common resource allocations" inside their communities.    China and India are too, of course.

And, as a group they both detest any form of pollution with a passion.    China and India are choking to death by the hundreds every month on air pollution, and are certainly ripe for getting rid of coal power plants completely.

By proposing doing hundreds of "streetlights" or apartment atrium zone lights in a new construction complex Rossi is scratching several Scandinavian type itches all at the same time with his dream system.

Like the detailed "CAD illustrations" that have been released, I wonder if there is more reality to this "dream" than Rossi is letting on about, but just until his new patents get filed and acknowledged as having "patent pending" protection.

To get cheap low transportation cost heat, Scandinavian countries would be willing to fast track trial implementations in people isolated government complexes to prove out the new tech as far as their version of UL goes.    

Ditto for USA DARPA groups, especially at the N & S Pole military/scientific stations where people are already very limited in their endless exposure to the current nuclear plants.    And double ditto for a new class of submarine and war ship, with them not having to carry all the shielding weight and radiation danger that is required now with nuclear.


Roll Eyes    


America will not be the first released market for E-Cat X, our UL rules and our fat cat politics will slow our adoption by at least 2 years compared to India and China and at least 1 year compared to the Scandinavian countries.
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« Last Edit: 01/03/16 at 16:41:26 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #222 - 01/04/16 at 15:10:28
 
I wouldn't be surprised if the next nuclear sub to be refueled isn't converted instead.  There are 18 and they are refitted every 15 years or so.
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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #223 - 01/05/16 at 04:54:32
 

The large size of the current subs is a reflection of nuclear power and the old huge ballistic missile size.

A LENR based "clean sheet of paper" CAD design would be much much smaller, since the missiles can be fired out of a torpedo tube now-a-days and certainly don't have to have vertical silos any more as they really aren't that big.

We have enough old style boomers, but what we need now are a much smaller class of attack subs (that also carry a missile or two in their racks).

Bad thing is every tom dickie and harry is going to have them too.


=======================================


How small do you think a LENR based sub could be if it were remote controlled like a drone is controlled?

I think something the size of a big bus could be possible, a kind of covert throw away sub.    You could fake up the sonar return so it looked like a whale on a sonar screen -- a covert sleeper sub.   Get it into position and just let it sit quietly on the ocean floor.  You could even play whale sounds from it when it was in motion to fake out sonus buoys, etc.

Betcha that would make all the Peta folks crazy .....

Global whale population plummets as Soviets fire automatically on any and all whale sonar sightings

SAVE OUR WHALES -- BAN ALL MINI-SUBS


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« Last Edit: 01/09/16 at 20:21:15 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Update on E-Cat, state of oil markets, etc
Reply #224 - 01/09/16 at 02:32:14
 

http://www.e-catworld.com/2016/01/08/some-new-e-cat-milestones-listed-on-ecat...

Some New E-Cat Milestones Listed on Ecat.com (Hot Cat Safety Certification, Patent Extendability, 60 Patents Pending)

Rossi, Industrial Heat and Woodford are marching forward with the 60 world-wide patents which tie down the E-Cat X (are all now firmly patents pending), having published a granted Hot Cat Safety Certification from the major European UL equivalent (Bureau Veritas) and are now getting ready to go into some form of limited production here in the USA and in Europe.

Hot Cat's real competition right now is the smaller class of molten salt thorium reactors which ARE BEING BUILT BY THE HUNDREDS in Canada and in China as we speak.   These will be simple shielded / insulated thick walled steel pots of self-heating molten thorium salt solutions which last approximately 20 years in full production and then get covered over with dirt and left alone for the next 100 years while they become stone cold and fairly non-radioactive.

Generating power in a remote, dry area makes sense as there is no ground water to get contaminated should a boo boo occur.   The plant's real life span is determined by corrosion, as molten thorium salts will eat up even specialty steels in less than 20 years.   The pot is backed up with thick fire brick walls, so even if the steel gets eaten the pot charge remains in one lump.  The charge does not ever get hot enough to ever try to do a China Syndrome and by its nature the reaction cannot "run away".

By using the simple "open top pot" type of reactor, the old steam piping can be lifted out and a new set of steam piping can be dropped into place using a remote controlled crane to keep the plant in production until the entire pot charge loses effective temperature and solidifies.

No special container dome is required, it is just a lidded pot of molten thorium ore that is kicked off with a molten salt transfer from the next reactor over, then extra ore rocks are gradually put into the pot to bring the pot up to a full level.  

And yes, a wiff of radioactive air gets released whenever you open the pot on one of these remote generation sites.

You don't even need to refine the ore, the raw ore melts and the stone slag gets skimmed off the top and tossed into a fire brick lined covered pit.   A crane mounted robot arm does the skimming and the crane also does the pulling and placing of the heat exchange piping when a steam piping change out is needed.

The ideal site is flat, remote, rocky dry open ground that has room for a long string of rail tracking for the big remote controlled crane which can then service the dozens of relatively small uncomplicated reactors as they each get brought on line in turn.   A building over the string of reactors is optional in very remote locations, but would be required in a populated area.  

Populated area uses of thorium reactors would by necessity be much more expensive to build and maintain, so none are being placed in populated areas.

       obviously the smaller "remote area" reactors to the left are much less expensive and a lot quicker to build

And yes, E-Cat technology will replace this thorium effort inside the next 10-20 years as it rolls out into distributed use all over the place.   But the harsh fact is you need something RIGHT NOW to keep the lights going or your general population will get very very angry with you ......  so thorium is still rolling along as a interim effort.    It is cheap, easy to control and has "containable" environmental impacts that self-absolve inside a 100 year time frame after you push dirt over the top of it.  No, not perfect, but better than the very very expensive traditional plutonium enriched nuclear power by a good long bit.  

(oh, say 10,000 years or so better)

There is 1 month and 19 days left in the 1 year 1 megawatt plant test period.    Two of the four reactors now show early signs of tapering off now, but are still making rate as individuals and the entire four reactor plant is still running at rate with "reserve to spare".
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« Last Edit: 01/11/16 at 22:42:12 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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