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POWER MODS -- proper order to do them (Read 3039 times)
BurnPgh
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POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
12/04/10 at 23:38:16
 
here's how it'll probably go (cosmetic mods not included)

1 - Remove brass idle mix plug and tune to help backfiring/decel popping.
2 - Lancer jet kit/white spacer - tune the bike in stock form like it SHOULD be , not like the factory has it.
3 - Replace stock cannon muffler with something reasonable (Ie better flowing and better sounding) and repeat steps 1 and 2.
4 - Replace stock Air filter with somethign more free flowing to match the new muffler. Repeat steps 1 and 2
5 - Replace carb with Mikuni VM available most cost effectively from Lancer. Repeat steps 1 and 2.
6 - The real mods begin. At this point depending on what you HAVE to do to fix up your engine already you can go with a - overbore/wiseco piston, b - cam stage 1 or 2 available from Lancer, c - Both. Repeat steps 1 and 2.
7 - Minimal head porting with a dremel. Probably wont require a whole lot of jetting change if you keep the stock header but you ought to do it anyway. Repeat steps 1 and 2.
8 - At this point you've probably spent more tinkering than you have invested in the initial bike purchase. In for a penny, in for a pound. Replacing stock header with something more open. Gunna have to be a 1 off or $400 Raask system from sweden. Repeat steps 1 and 2
9 - By now you're pushing about 45-50Hp (vs stock 26-30HP) at the wheel and running 0-60 in about 4-5 seconds...maybe a bit less. You're already in for a pound. You're already making every puffed up midlife-crisis Harley rider in your area get real pissed when you smoke 'em. You've got few tried and reliable options at this point. If you went with a stage 1 cam in step 6 you can trade up for a stage 2. If you went with a 95mm wiseco piston you can trade up to a 97mm. You COULD, if your resourceful, patient, and maybe cash laden procure a slightly longer connecting rod which would even further up the compression ratio from your already hi-comp wiseco piston. If you're even more cash laden and/or resourceful you might do an honest to god stroke job. You could have a profession porting job done.
By this point you will have also replaced the stock clutch plates and springs with a barnett or OldFellers 6 plate method and are seriously cursing suzuki's stock cam chain set-up. You already know what you're doing now for the most part. We'll probably end up asking you questions as Lancer is the only member here who's gotten to #9.

To give you an idea of what all of this entails as far as time and money. I've had my bike for 2 years and have pretty much tinkered consistently as long as cash allows. I'm at #7 looking at #8.
Bike - 1500
Lancer Jet kit for stock carb - 20
Harley muffler - 25
Cam (stage 1, add another $200 if you eventually go for stage 2)- 200
Carb - 250 (assuming the included jets work. I actually bought a lot more to play with at $3 a peice as the included mains didnt go up quite high enough and I wanted ample space to play with. I payed for more than I needed but...)
Wiseco - 200
Overbore - 50
KN air filter 50

This is ONLY "performance" mods that I've done and doesnt include necessary valve work to my individual engine ($100), A verslavy modified chain tension (you NEED one. Get this before you do anything else. About $100), replacement cam chain/guides ($200), Chain conversion (not necessary but put me back about $150 all say and done), a wheel swap for GS cast wheels (not necessary but put me back about $150 all said and done), progressive 412 shocks (not necessary but put me back about $150), Barnett clutch ($150), and several hundred dollars in odds and ends such as oil, plugs (to read while carb tuning), gaskets, and tires. All general labor was done by myself. If you're planning to have nay of this done at a shop, dont bother wasting the money.

My individual case scenario, Im probably in about $4k. But there isnt any bike that can beat me light to light, no average crotch rockets that can beat me 0-60, and almost no stock v-twin that can beat me 1/4 mile (no stock harley whatsoever).
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« Last Edit: 07/14/12 at 12:40:22 by Oldfeller »  
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verslagen1
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Re: Power?
Reply #1 - 12/07/10 at 20:23:12
 
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« Last Edit: 12/07/10 at 21:32:35 by verslagen1 »  

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Krusher
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #2 - 01/15/18 at 15:59:20
 
Where can I order these parts?
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LANCER
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #3 - 02/06/18 at 23:50:05
 
Krusher wrote on 01/15/18 at 15:59:20:
Where can I order these parts?



Hey dude, what parts do you want ?
I have most of them.
Will also PM you just as a backup.

Michael
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #4 - 03/15/18 at 16:12:08
 
This might be a dumb question, but can I leave everything on to port and polish the exhaust manifold? Maybe use a vacuum/ air blaster to get all the dust out afterwards Lips Sealed
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #5 - 03/16/18 at 04:02:52
 
Willaction wrote on 03/15/18 at 16:12:08:
This might be a dumb question, but can I leave everything on to port and polish the exhaust manifold? Maybe use a vacuum/ air blaster to get all the dust out afterwards Lips Sealed


You can do a bit of work with the head still on.  Make sure the exhaust valves are closed, then take some small pieces of cotton rags and coat them with a bit of oil - then stuff them up around the exhaust valves.....make sure that none of the valves/stems/guides are visible.  You can then grind away stuff that is still visible.....mostly the restrictive ring and a bit of the sharp ramp.

When you are done pull the rags out and wipe away any grit....don't spray  a cleaning fluid or any compressed air up the exhaust port or you could blow grit into the guides.
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #6 - 05/26/18 at 11:26:25
 
How affective would a stage 3 cam be without doing a bore and piston? And with the stock carb. I'm about to "rebuild" my savage. Head plug, tensioner, and new rocker arms. While I have everything open I'm considering a new cam and/or a weiseco. Thanks
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #7 - 05/26/18 at 11:28:01
 
I'm also considering a chain conversion. Already have a kn stock replacement filter, jetted the carb, and threw on a dyna muffler
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Re: POWER MODS -- proper order to do them
Reply #8 - 05/29/18 at 08:31:35
 
Willaction wrote on 05/26/18 at 11:26:25:
How affective would a stage 3 cam be without doing a bore and piston? And with the stock carb. I'm about to "rebuild" my savage. Head plug, tensioner, and new rocker arms. While I have everything open I'm considering a new cam and/or a weiseco. Thanks

In the beginning I started with  a Stage 1 cam and nothing else.  It made a nice noticable difference.  Torque improved with a bump in hp and my effective usable range went from 2500-4500 up to 2500-5500, with power still increasing to 6500 but at a little slower pace.  It felt like I had 50% more torque in those ranges, it just pulled. 

I later tried the VM, then an Amal, then an Edelbrock carb.  They all worked well but for a new carb the VM was more cost effective.  There is a synergistic effect with the piston/cam/carb/exhaust setup.  As you add parts you will feel more of the effect of the camshaft, and the increased compression, and the better fuel delivery.  They just work better together than individually.

None of these parts are "Racing" parts, they provide improvements in efficiency and with that better performance overall.  Top speed will go up a little but the real gain is in throttle responsiveness and torque & power in the low and mid ranges where we ride 95% of the time.  This engine is not a racing powerhouse, it is a slow turning torque machine and these parts are designed to take advantage of that prime characteristic.  The bike will cruise more easily and pass more quickly and it can sprint a bit within its capabilities.

You did well with getting a Dyna muffler, it works very well with this machine and is cheap to get.  Since you already have a K&N be sure that you oil it very well, it is necessary for it to filter properly.  When using a stock carb your stock air filter will filter better than the K&N and it does flow plenty of air.

As you add engine parts keep in mind that brake and suspension improvements can be made, and they make riding more pleasurable and safer.  Improving the seat cushion can make things more comfortable for your butt as well.

I almost forgot ... fuel efficiency.  Even with all of these parts added to the engine, when properly set up and tuned correctly, your milage should not be affected.  Assuming of course that you don't have a heavy hand.  I tend to be that way and so sometimes my milage goes down some.  Last week some of us were in the Hill Country of Texas, just west of Austin, and during the week going up and down hills and round and around, I started the week with 50mpg but then adjusted my riding slightly and averaged 58-62 mpg.  My bike has about everything done to it that is possible and I still get very good milage.


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