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Finn Hammer's Savage (Read 2069 times)
DragBikeMike
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #195 - 04/09/24 at 15:10:32
 
To gather some additional reference points, I decided to take some measurement on the clutch plate tangs.  This will also help to determine if there is sufficient clearance on the tangs to permit full release of the clutch.

This shows a late model primary driven gear with the 13-plate clutch stack in the fully engaged position.  The clearance between the tang and the bottom of the slot is about .155".
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Late_Basket_Tang_Clearance_Full_Engage__155.JPG

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DragBikeMike
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #196 - 04/09/24 at 15:14:38
 
This shows a late model primary driven gear with the clutch stack in the fully released position.  The clearance between the tang and the bottom of the slot is about .080".  So, the allowed movement is about .075" (.155" - .080" = .075").
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Late_basket_Tang_Clearance_Full_Release__080.JPG

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DragBikeMike
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #197 - 04/09/24 at 15:17:17
 
This shows an early model primary driven gear with the 13-plate clutch stack in the fully engaged position.  The clearance between the tang and the bottom of the slot is about .130".
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Early_Basket_Full_Engage__130.JPG

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DragBikeMike
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #198 - 04/09/24 at 15:22:30
 
This shows an early model primary driven gear with the clutch stack in the fully released position.  The clearance between the tang and the bottom of the slot is about .100"".  So, the allowed movement is about .030" (.130" - .100" = .030").  That's not very much.  

Since there are a total of 13 plates, there are 26 friction surfaces.  That leaves only about .0012" clearance between friction surfaces.  The clutch won't release.
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Early_Bskt_Full_Release__100.JPG

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #199 - 04/09/24 at 15:26:28
 
To double check, I placed the clutch in the full release position and inserted feelers between the face of the sleeve hub (4) and drive plate (9).  Yep, only .030".  Looks like the early model primary driven gear needs a little work to permit use on the 13-plate clutch mod.
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Early_Basket_Full_Release_Plate_Clearance__030.JPG

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #200 - 04/09/24 at 15:39:49
 
To use the early model primary driven gear on the 13-plate clutch mod you need to increase pressure disk travel, and increase tang clearance for the innermost drive plate (8).

You can accomplish that by installing an additional washer (7), but I don't think that's a good idea.  It might work, but it could also be very bad if the release plate hits anything.  It might work at first, but as the clutch wears the release plate will drift out closer to the release arm.  You can try it, but I wouldn't add any more washer than necessary to achieve .075" pressure disk travel and .075 tang clearance.  The 2mm washer is too much, a 1mm washer would accomplish what you need to do.  In addition, you should trim the tops of bolts (16) to provide an additional margin of safety.  You MUST do clay checks to confirm adequate clearance.

I personally prefer machining the hard stops and hand working the slots in the primary driven gear.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #201 - 04/09/24 at 15:44:33
 
I wanted to see how hard it would be to trim the hard stops in the primary driven gear.  I didn't want to tamper with the early model primary driven gear at this time, so I decided to try it on a late model unit.  I have several of those and they are easy to come by.

It chucks right up in the lathe and runs fairly true.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #202 - 04/09/24 at 15:46:49
 
Since the hard stops in the late model primary driven gear are about .035" higher than the face of the thrust washer, I trimmed them back .030".  It worked good.
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Mach_Stops__030.JPG

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #203 - 04/09/24 at 15:50:29
 
Then I checked contact by painting up the stops with Sharpie pen and installing the pressure disk.  The contact is a bit sketchy, but the pressure disk is an unmachined casting.  Looked OK to me.

This shows the hard stop contact.
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Hard_Stop_Contact.JPG

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #204 - 04/09/24 at 15:52:43
 
And this shows the transfer onto the pressure disk.  Looks like the cast face of the pressure disk is not perfectly square.  I think that's OK.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #205 - 04/09/24 at 16:04:12
 
To provide additional clearance for the drive plate tangs, you could hand work the bottom of each slot in the primary driven gear.  You don't want square corners as they will promote cracking, so a small round file is in order for the radii, and a small flat file to remove the semi-circular cast stops.  Just remove enough material to permit the drive plate tang to move down into the slot about ,045".
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #206 - 04/09/24 at 16:10:26
 
All of this clutch modification work mandates thorough clearance checks.  Clay checks to verify proper running clearance between the rotating clutch and the clutch cover/release mechanism must be accomplished.  Pressure disk travel checks with a dial indicator are necessary.  If you choose to skip these checks, you do so at your own peril.  This is true regardless of the approach you take, adding a washer or machining the primary driven gear.

Keep us posted.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #207 - 04/10/24 at 13:13:31
 
Mike,

To repeat the words of Dave, you sure is thorough!.
Thanks for taking interest in this detail of the build. I know how long time it takes to build a case, I am still in the process of gathering all points in mine, and have not gotten to the end yet. I do feel somewhat redeemed by your last series of entries, regarding the clutch mod using the 4 speed variety of transfer gear.
To be honest paranoia started to creep in in the form of fantasies, someone with interest might start to think along these lines: If he can't put the clutch together correctly, how on earth is he going to get the valve timing right.

But to the point of clay tests, here with the extra 2mm washer installed. There are a couple of places that don't give cause for worry:
First is the area around the release cam, plenty of clearance here.

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #208 - 04/10/24 at 13:13:43
 
Then there are the bolts that hold the release plate. when I fit the bolts shown, there are 2mm clearance to the face of the flange on the  sleeve hub, and the clutch is not going to wear that much.
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7_004.jpg

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #209 - 04/10/24 at 13:13:56
 
Therefore the main places of concern are situated around the parts of the clutch cover which are circled in red:
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01_001.jpg

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