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Bad stator or regulator/rectifier? (Read 344 times)
svenofthejungle
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #15 - 04/27/13 at 11:23:34
 
More for my own later reference, but also for anyone who runs into these kinds of problems down the road, I found the r/r test thread (started by constrapolator):

How to test your Voltage Regulator-Rectifier
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1245984387

And another useful thread about issues similar to mine:
HELP!  Black rectifier wire melted the connector (started by misterman1)
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1269650762

Busy day today ahead of me; can't guarantee I'll get around to any of the tests everyone suggested. Here are the current hypotheses we're testing here (two most likely first):

1. Fault in the stator. I just ordered an alternator cover gasket and will post pictures once I get a chance to look at the stator. Frayed insulation, broken or exposed wires, or excessive gunkiness will support this hypothesis. But alternator does put out power --- testing voltages at the yellow wires gives me around 100V each at RPM, so I know the alt's at least putting out juice into the r/r. But it's apparently not making it out of the r/r, so that brings me to...

2. ...fault in r/r. Possible causes: not a perfect fit on the boltholes, so it may be subject to undue vibration. Or, crappy r/r (new unit, but aftermarket). I'm getting enough juice to keep the battery at steady voltage when idling, but when I roll on the throttle, the voltage barely increases in proportion to the amount of throttle I'm laying on. I'm definitely not getting 14.something volts at 2,000rpm (but did when I first installed the new r/r). Will test both r/r's (kept the old unit) per the thread I found.

Note: I did blow a fuse when I first installed the new r/r --- but the fuse casing was cracked from something and probably hasn't been replaced in a few years, so it could have just been a bad fuse. All new fuses; haven't blown any since.

3. Fault in decomp relay box (suggested by WD): will test as directed.

4. Fault in starter or starter solenoid. (suggested by Cavi Mike) Unlikely, as the problem appears to be somewhere between the r/r and alternator; i.e. the bike starts just fine but doesn't charge like it should. Still worth looking at, since a fault in either component might be contributing to my troubles. Also, my lights definitely don't dim when I start it up, but I never did check out the lights when last my bike failed to start. Will watch out for it.

5. Dirty connectors, frayed insulation, broken wires, hot spots, and corrosion. (suggested by Oldfeller) A likely contributor, since I do live in Florida, and as much as I try to keep my bike covered (don't have a garage), it still gets rained on once in a while. Wouldn't hurt to have another go with the contact cleaner and dielectric grease on every point I can get to on the wire harness.

One or more of these can be true. (sigh) I'm willing to consider appeasing these electro-gremlins with a sacrifice. Ten broken diodes and twenty feet of frayed copper cable? Or are they the kind to demand blood?
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merpius
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #16 - 04/27/13 at 11:32:52
 
Cavi Mike wrote on 04/27/13 at 05:14:04:
Doesn't sound like anything is wrong with the battery or the charging system to me. What you need to pay attention to next time your bike won't start is the lights. If the lights don't dim at all when you press the start button, that means it has nothing to do with the battery or the charging system - you've got a bad solenoid or starter.

To find out if it's the solenoid or the starter, bridge the two large terminals on the solenoid with a screw-driver or wrench. If the bike cranks, you've got a bad solenoid. If nothing happens, you've got a bad starter.

Just be warned that it's going to make a heck of a spark when you bridge those terminals if the starter is good. 12V is nowhere near enough to harm you but big sparks tend to put people on edge.


I used to start my truck this way.  Smiley Reach down in there with a big screwdriver, spark spark (careful not to let it get welded), vroom vroom!
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Cavi Mike
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #17 - 05/01/13 at 05:50:44
 
svenofthejungle wrote on 04/27/13 at 09:12:28:
The lights do not dim on start-up, or if they do, it's imperceptible to me when the headlight's aimed at something (in this case, a wooden fence) when I'm starting at night.

So you're saying that if I have a bad starter or solenoid (per the test you suggest), it could somehow prevent my battery from charging while the bike is running, and my alternator/rectifier/battery could be just fine?


I didn't say anything about the battery not charging. In fact I just said it sounds like your battery and charging system are fine.

I also didn't say watch your lights when you start your bike - I said watch your lights when your bike WON'T start.

I'm not going to repeat myself. Re-read my post. If you can't follow those simple instructions, I can't help you.
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svenofthejungle
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #18 - 05/02/13 at 09:49:02
 
I apologize; I must've come off as more testy than I intended to.

Got into a bicycle accident the other day, so work's been put off until I can crouch again (sprained my ankle something fierce). Will report back when I have something.
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Serowbot
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OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #19 - 05/02/13 at 09:59:49
 
Don't worry Sven,... you're not coming off as testy...
Cavi is... Grin...
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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svenofthejungle
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #20 - 05/03/13 at 12:20:45
 
Oompa doompa doopity-doo, I have another bunch of numbers for you...

Smiley

Wasn't able to get to some of the tests suggested, but I did clean up the contacts and greased them up generously.

My numbers:

Resting voltage of battery (fully charged, disconnected from charger for 48 hours): 13.1V
Voltage drop when key turned: 12.89V
Voltage drop when starting: 10.something V
Voltage on idle (warming up): 12.5V and rising slowly
Voltage on idle (warmed up): 12.7V give or take .1V
Voltage on ~1/3 throttle: 13.0V
Resting voltage of battery after shut-down (waited 15min to measure): 13.0V

Question: I'm measuring these voltages by wedging the probes of the multimeter into the battery terminals. Am I doing it wrong?

So the battery's holding a charge and the alt's pumping some volts into the batt. Some of the connectors were warm to the touch after this, so I cleaned them again, started the bike up again, rolled on the throttle up to about 1/2 for a few minutes, and felt them again, and they were cool. So part of my problem could have been dirty contacts. Negative frame ground cleaned again too --- it collects a lot of dirt and gunk from the road, and the rainy season's starting in Florida, so muddy oily roads.

Scratching my head, but I'll give the bike a more thorough looking-over when I have a full day to devote to it. I appreciate everyone's help so far, and their indulgence of a chucklehead like me. Smiley
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Digger
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #21 - 05/03/13 at 21:10:39
 
svenofthejungle wrote on 05/03/13 at 12:20:45:
....Question: I'm measuring these voltages by wedging the probes of the multimeter into the battery terminals. Am I doing it wrong?....


Nope...you are doing it correctly.
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Digger
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Digger
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Ya gotta be tough to
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Re: Bad stator or regulator/rectifier?
Reply #22 - 05/04/13 at 18:00:38
 
svenofthejungle wrote on 04/26/13 at 21:45:51:
.....My intuition suggests it's not the alternator, even though signs suggest it might be grounding to the frame. It's putting out volts, but those volts aren't making it to the battery at a sufficient rate to charge it, which suggests anything from the wires leading from the alt to the r/r....


Sven,

If you're still suspecting those wires, check out this strange and terrible saga:

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1363989148/10#10
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Digger
2001, Metallic Glacial Blue, Raptor Petcock, Verslavy (first hole) (otherwise, mechanically, the bike is stock), 13,xxx miles
I don't own a cage.
www.astronautbiker.com
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