Donate!
Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register :: View Members
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 ... 11
Send Topic Print
Rear Pulley Wobble Fix (Read 2022 times)
Hiko
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 250
Tauranga New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #60 - 06/06/20 at 14:56:12
 
JDvt 600

Nearly a year now on my cheap chinese bearing and no issues

This is a very worthwhile mod IMHO
Back to top
 
 
Hiko   IP Logged
DragBikeMike
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 4167
Honolulu
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #61 - 06/06/20 at 17:43:11
 
Jdvt600, I currently have 9445 miles on the odometer, so I have logged just about 6000 miles on the duplex bearing.  It is just like it was the day I installed it.  No wobble, no adverse noise or vibration.  It is holding up well.  I am comfortable with the cheap bearing.

One gotcha that should be helpful.  Make some sort of holder for the bearing.  Something you can but in the inner race so that you can align and drop the bearing into the hot hub.  It's much easier to install if you have something to hold it with.  I believe I used a bolt and nut along with the inner spacer, then removed the nut and slipped the bolt out through the hub.

This shows a socket head cap bolt, washer, nut, and the inner spacer.  They are installed on the stock bearing.  The same sort of device will work just fine on the duplex bearing.  You hold the threaded portion of the bolt.  It allows you to jiggle the bearing around until it aligns perfectly with the hole.  Once aligned, the bearing drops right in.  No pounding or pressing.  Very easy.  Guarantees no damage to the bearing or hub.

Once the bearing is in all the way, let the hub cool completely, then remove the nut and washer.  Push the bolt out and you are ready to go.

Good luck.
Back to top
 

Brg_Holder_2_2.JPG

Knowledge is power.
  IP Logged
Jdvt600
Junior Member
**
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 83

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #62 - 06/07/20 at 08:02:06
 
@Hiko and @DragBikeMike thank you for the update!

@DBM thanks a ton for that tip! I've definitely use this technique when I reassemble.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Jdvt600
Junior Member
**
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 83

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #63 - 06/15/20 at 09:55:01
 
Hey all. Does anyone have any pointers on removing the stock grease seal from the driven pulley without destroying it?
( @dragbikemike) If I have to I will. Even though the new bearing is sealed and I won't reuse the stock seal, it pains me slightly to rip it out destroying it in the process.

I have time as the new spacer from @Armen should be arriving later this afternoon when the mailman comes. So I'm paused until then anyway.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Jdvt600
Junior Member
**
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 83

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #64 - 06/15/20 at 10:23:02
 
Jdvt600 wrote on 06/15/20 at 09:55:01:
Hey all. Does anyone have any pointers on removing the stock grease seal from the driven pulley without destroying it?
( @dragbikemike) If I have to I will. Even though the new bearing is sealed and I won't reuse the stock seal, it pains me slightly to rip it out destroying it in the process.

I have time as the new spacer from @Armen should be arriving later this afternoon when the mailman comes. So I'm paused until then anyway.


Quoting myself here. I got it out by inserting a screw driver underneath and leveraging up with the floor jack handle over the screw driver. Grease went everywhere when it popped off  Tongue

Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Jdvt600
Junior Member
**
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 83

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #65 - 06/15/20 at 14:00:56
 
Done. No more wobble or rubbing!

Thanks to everyone on the forums especially @Dave, @DragBikeMike and @Armen for the R&D and supply of these parts! New bearing and spacer is installed. I used the 250 degree bbq method with a carrier and the bearing went "plop" right were it needed to. I will admit, I was impatient at first and waited only 10 mins of heating, the bearing only went halfway. Waited 55 mins next time and all went smoothly.

A lot of this is/was new to me. One hangup that caused me a few moments of head scratching, the custom spacer from @Armen is a "left hand". As mentioned in this post http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1119775997, the rear axel is reversed in the image within the Clymers manual. Common sense prevailed and everything went smoothly.

Looking forward to more community mods in the future!
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
RocketScienceSmurf
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 268
Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #66 - 09/15/20 at 06:37:39
 
I have basically NO experience with working on vehicles of any kind and I don't fully understand how the rear tire assembly and the associated bearings work and what forces are in play but I was wondering if it's possible or maybe even preferable to use a single row tapered bearing?

https://www.skf.com/group/products/rolling-bearings/roller-bearings/tapered-r...
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Armen
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Half-Witted
Wrench-Jockey from
Jersey

Posts: 1431

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #67 - 09/15/20 at 14:28:14
 
Kamel,
Not at all. Even if you completely reengineered the whole ass end and had a new hub/pulley carrier made, it'd still be a worse idea.
FWIW, the last mass produced bikes to use tapered roller wheel bearings were Harley in 2000, before them BMW in 1984.
An idea who's time has passed.
If 200+ HP bikes are happy with ball bearings, I think they're ok on 30 HP Savages.
Plus, setting up the shimming/preload is a pain. Not sure how you'd do it without making a new hub/carrier.
Back to top
 
 

In theory, theory and reality are the same. In reality, they aren't...
  IP Logged
Hiko
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 250
Tauranga New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #68 - 09/15/20 at 17:27:00
 
Put the double row sealed ball bearing in You wont regret it
Back to top
 
 
Hiko   IP Logged
RocketScienceSmurf
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 268
Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #69 - 09/16/20 at 02:08:55
 
Thank you Hiko and Armen.

I am curious by nature and question EVERYTHING. I will have a look at the rear wheel hub and pulley assembly and get a better understanding of how it all works. I am pretty sure DragBikeMike's solution is the best but I always challenge ideas and I mean no disrespect with it.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Armen
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Half-Witted
Wrench-Jockey from
Jersey

Posts: 1431

Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #70 - 09/16/20 at 06:00:42
 
Hey Kamel,
At one point tapered rollers for wheels were considered the best way to go. When BMW was doing it, it was a sign of them making the effort to make the best set-up. There is an outfit that offers a sealed ball bearing conversion for the old Airheads, and I copied it for one of mine. Mentioning it on the Airhead list brought a barrage of poop slinging like you can't imagine.
The reality is, that with a large enough ball bearing, you make up for any of the theoretical advantages of a tapered roller in terms of being able to tolerate loads from all directions.
The advantage of the ball bearing is that it's sealed and you essentially forget it. With a tapered roller you'd have to set up some way to shim the inner spacer to have basically no play. And the bearings need to come apart, be cleaned, re-shimmed, and repacked occasionally.
In this particular application, the double row ball bearing keeps the pulley carrier from wobbling. If anything, the tapered roller might allow a bit of wobble.
By all means try it out, though. Take pics and let us know how it works.
Back to top
 
 

In theory, theory and reality are the same. In reality, they aren't...
  IP Logged
RocketScienceSmurf
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 268
Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #71 - 09/17/20 at 11:23:44
 
I took a closer look at the pulley today and I think I found a way to improve it even further.

The original bearing is a 6305 ball bearing. A single row bearing with a 25mm ID and 62mm OD and a width of 17mm.

Inside that bearing sits a bushing that has an edge on it and two ends with OD 25mm and ID 17mm.

On the opposite side of the 62mm bearing inside the pulley thingy there is nothing supporting the bushing but a 37x25mm bearing could be fitted there to remedy this and make it even sturdier. One slight problem is that the inside diameter of the aluminium part is slightly larger than 37mm so a 37mm bearing wont sit as tight as it should.
Back to top
 

pulley_bearing_6305.png
  IP Logged
RocketScienceSmurf
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 268
Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #72 - 09/17/20 at 11:31:32
 
I was thinking one could put the whole thing in a lathe and widen the hole to 38mm and fit a ball bearing or even a needle roller bearing. That would give the bushing a LOT of support in both ends almost eliminating any chance of wobble.

NKI 25/20 is a needle roller bearing that seem to fit with just a little bit of machining.
Back to top
 

pulley_inwards.png
  IP Logged
DragBikeMike
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 4167
Honolulu
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #73 - 09/17/20 at 12:17:57
 
Kamelryttarn, I can report that the bargain-basement 5305-2RS is holding up well.  I have logged about 7500 miles on it and it's still solid as a rock, no pulley wobble, no problems at all.  Still looks good too.  This is such a simple modification.  There really is no need to go any farther.  Pop in the duplex bearing.  Do the simple mod to the spacer.  Ride it.

How's your project goin?  As I recall, you picked up a totally beat Savage. Swing arm bearings were disintegrated.  Steering stem frozen.  You had some top end work to do.  All your posts show nice clean work on your part. You must be getting close to firing it up.
Back to top
 
 

Knowledge is power.
  IP Logged
RocketScienceSmurf
Senior Member
****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 268
Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Rear Pulley Wobble Fix
Reply #74 - 09/20/20 at 00:40:07
 
I took a few measurements of the pulley and this is a rough sketch of the current configuration
Back to top
 

rear_pulley.png
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 ... 11
Send Topic Print


« Home

 
« Home
SuzukiSavage.com
04/27/24 at 13:21:57



General CategoryRubber Side Down! › Rear Pulley Wobble Fix


SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2!
YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved.