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Regearing for more gears? (Read 497 times)
old_rider
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #15 - 05/13/14 at 22:53:09
 
If your bike is vibrating so bad a 55mph that you can not tolerate it, there is a problem with your wheel balance, or your engine is loose.

At 65-70 you should have some vibrations, but not shake your teeth vibrating.

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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #16 - 05/13/14 at 23:10:12
 
I ran my 98 for years with only one bolt in the top mount, 15" rise bars, very high mounted mirrors... and could see everything fine in the mirrors, which were not blurry.

Check your riser bolts, the nuts can back off. Check the riser bushings, they are cheap rubber and get worn out, I usually replace mine with oilite (self lubricating) bronze. Check your wheels, if the rims have a bunch of glue on weights, somebody at some point was extremely lazy and mounted the tires improperly. For that matter, check your tire pressures, overinflated can cause a lot of front end issues. You want no more than the maximum pressure listed on the sidewall, less if you like a softer ride. If the maximum safe pressure listed is less than 35psi, you need a better quality tire... cheap tires can cause a lot of handling woes... won't be buying anymore Shinko 712Fs with their 33psi max, I like running 40psi front and rear.

Also, check the tension on your steering head bearings, they do need to be reset occasionally. And, they are old style Timken bearings, not sealed bearings, so, they need to be greased every once in a while.

The Savage is straight out of the late 1970s, except the factory forgot to install a kick start mechanism.
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #17 - 05/14/14 at 05:33:03
 
WD wrote on 05/13/14 at 22:31:25:
Vibration? That's easy... change the handlebar for something comfortable and order some decent grips. Decent means like the old Gran Turismo jobbies that Emgo (among others) is cranking out copies of. Finding them in 1" can be a bit of a pain, but worth the effort. Also, pop off one riser cap, drill a hole, and fill the bar with sand or bird shot. No more vibration.


This modification sounds doable.  Mind you, I just spent nearly an hour searching the web trying to figure out what a "riser cap" is, and I'm still not sure.  But if the idea is just to fill the handlebars with sand or shot, I bet I can figure out a way to do that.

As far as grips, would these grips work?

http://shop.rycamotors.com/grips.html

Also, do I have to get different handle bars or can I do this modification with the stock handlebars?  If I do get new handlebars, what kind of limitations are there?  Do they have to be 1 inch, for example?  Do you suggest any handlebars in particular?

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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #18 - 05/14/14 at 07:21:48
 
Check the peg bolts & moto0r mounts
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #19 - 05/14/14 at 08:58:48
 
Guys,, our new rider hasnt had time to learn the bikes strong points. The bike needs a good going over, making sure things are tight, pegs, motor mounts,etc, to kill the vibes. He said he wouldnt even begin to try that chain conversion,, so,, if that chain conversion is intimidating, then that "Inside the transmission" thing would be an absolute heart attack.. The only way I would even consider splitting the cases would be
A The engine is dead & I just wanna see what all is in there
or
B I have a spare engine Im gonna play with

But to walk off into my one & only running engine because I dont like the vibration level? Uhh, no,,Not This old boy,,
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #20 - 05/14/14 at 10:12:13
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 05/14/14 at 08:58:48:
Guys,, our new rider hasnt had time to learn the bikes strong points. The bike needs a good going over, making sure things are tight, pegs, motor mounts,etc, to kill the vibes. He said he wouldnt even begin to try that chain conversion,, so,, if that chain conversion is intimidating, then that "Inside the transmission" thing would be an absolute heart attack.. The only way I would even consider splitting the cases would be
A The engine is dead & I just wanna see what all is in there
or
B I have a spare engine Im gonna play with

But to walk off into my one & only running engine because I dont like the vibration level? Uhh, no,,Not This old boy,,


Naaaah....I was throwing out that thought to the general population....hoping that someone, someday, would be in a spot to expore that longshot possibility.  It is far easier to change the final drive ratio with a pulley change....or go to a chain and sprocket.....or an oversize rear tire.

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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #21 - 05/14/14 at 12:07:05
 
ihasabike wrote on 05/14/14 at 05:33:03:
WD wrote on 05/13/14 at 22:31:25:
Vibration? That's easy... change the handlebar for something comfortable and order some decent grips. Decent means like the old Gran Turismo jobbies that Emgo (among others) is cranking out copies of. Finding them in 1" can be a bit of a pain, but worth the effort. Also, pop off one riser cap, drill a hole, and fill the bar with sand or bird shot. No more vibration.


This modification sounds doable.  Mind you, I just spent nearly an hour searching the web trying to figure out what a "riser cap" is, and I'm still not sure.  But if the idea is just to fill the handlebars with sand or shot, I bet I can figure out a way to do that.

As far as grips, would these grips work?

http://shop.rycamotors.com/grips.html

Also, do I have to get different handle bars or can I do this modification with the stock handlebars?  If I do get new handlebars, what kind of limitations are there?  Do they have to be 1 inch, for example?  Do you suggest any handlebars in particular?



Yep, those exact grips, and that is a great price for them. Will be ordering a set for my own daily rider.

Riser cap is the upper clamp that holds the bar in place. You can also remove the switch boxes and drill the holes (one per side) under those if you want to fill the entire handlebar.

ANY 1" Harley, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Yamaha or aftermarket bar can work. I'm 6'2" 235# with a 35" inseam and a 72" tip to tip "wing span".... I generally use wide handlebars or high and wide handlebars.

The epitome of comfort and handling for me was my last Panhead, a 1957 rigid barhopper with a springer, Flanders dogbones and a medium rise buckhorn bar...

Gone but not forgotten, Rust in Pieces. She's actually in storage out in Buckley WA with the friend I got her from. and Rust in Pieces is actually that bikes name, it's a serious s*** pile of a shipwreck. Needs everything redone, to the tune of about $28K...
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #22 - 05/14/14 at 22:24:56
 
& make sure the bolts are tight..
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #23 - 05/14/14 at 22:27:33
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 05/14/14 at 22:24:56:
& make sure the bolts are tight..

Here... hold my beer   Smiley
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #24 - 05/15/14 at 04:44:44
 
I'm really talking about "hand numbing" vibration, not "teeth rattling" vibration.  Different standards for "intolerable," I guess.

I might be able to get my husband to help me with some of this stuff, but we know a mechanic who owns and works on motorbikes and who runs his own shop, so he might be able to help us if I can figure out what to do.

I'm wondering, what does WD's proposed sprocket job do as far as handling?  Does it make the gearing better at the top end and worse at the bottom?
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #25 - 05/15/14 at 06:46:00
 
I have "regeared" mine with Kawasaki pulleys....and I love it.  It is now a fully capable freeway cruiser.  First gear is now really tall, and pulling away from a stop on a hill involves a little more clutch slip to get going.  If you ride with two on the bike or have it loaded with luggage.....it might be a bit too tall of gearing.  At a minimum you should consider having the front pulley changed to the Kawasaki Pulley....you need to find someone with a machine shop to have the pulley cut to fit.

Thread derail post:

I don't know to capture parts manual pages and post them here - but her is the link to the LS650 transmission.  The 5th gear drive and driven gear sets are part numbers 9 and 29.
http://www.hondaofflorence.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=432125&catego...

Here is the SV650 transmission link.  The 6th gear set appears to be the same set up as far as the drive and driven arrangement, and how the fork sliders engage.  Once again part numbers 9 and 29 are the parts (6th gear on this bike) that are of interest.  It is not common that parts will interchange between transmission on different bikes.....but the diagram looks like the parts are very similar in arrangement.  I have no idea if the shaft spacing is the same, the shaft splines match, or if the gear sets are compatable.  It may be that the ratio is not helpful.....but it is the closest thing I have seen in looking through a whole bunch of parts diagrams.
http://www.hondaofflorence.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=434419&catego...

I watched for a while and never saw a SV650 gear set that was cheap enough to buy out of curiosity......and I don't have an LS650 gear set to compare it to.  This is a long shot that it would work.....and it also requires tearing the engine completely down if the gears are a different ratio and can be swapped.    

I solved the gearing issue on my bike by changing to Kawasaki pulleys, and it works well enough I no longer have any reason to go into the transmission.
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #26 - 05/17/14 at 05:01:33
 
I noticed lately that I don't think my hands have gone numb since I got the dry filter issue sorted out and the stock pipe reinstalled.  The dry oil bath filter was making my bike stall.  Is it possible the dry filter and/or aftermarket shorty pipe also produced increased vibrations at higher RPMs or road speeds?

EDIT:  Nevermind, I just duplicated the problem.  I think it happens at high speeds on the country roads around here with rougher asphalt than the smoother interstates.
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« Last Edit: 05/17/14 at 14:39:47 by ihasabike »  

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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #27 - 05/22/14 at 11:07:03
 
ihasabike wrote on 05/17/14 at 05:01:33:
I noticed lately that I don't think my hands have gone numb since I got the dry filter issue sorted out and the stock pipe reinstalled.  The dry oil bath filter was making my bike stall.  Is it possible the dry filter and/or aftermarket shorty pipe also produced increased vibrations at higher RPMs or road speeds?

EDIT:  Nevermind, I just duplicated the problem.  I think it happens at high speeds on the country roads around here with rougher asphalt than the smoother interstates.  



SOME of the felt vibration has to do with just how firmly youre gripping the bars. If you arent wearing gloves, you should be. You go down your hands are very likely to get messed up. Just some good leather work gloves will help. Dont go cheap, look at the leather edge. Ive forgotten what the color is, but theres vegetable cured leather & theres chemical cured, chemical cured puts heavy metals on your palms, which absorb things, Bad News,, Cheap leather gloves, like Harbod Freight, from China, NO.. Ill wear them, IF Im only gonna wear them long enough to "Do Something", not long enough to sweat.
You mite even go for some gloves with gel pads in the palm. I noticed my right hand went numb more than the left, so I decided Id see how softly I could hold the gas on & the numbness issue went away,,
Once I learned I could literally just lay my hand on the gas & it stay "right there" everything changed. Of course, rough roads or running thru turns requires fingers around the gas, but I beat "Numb hands" by changing my habits,
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #28 - 05/22/14 at 12:00:38
 
I split the 2 topics regearing and reducing the vibes... OK?
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Re: Regearing for more gears?
Reply #29 - 05/22/14 at 19:15:37
 
Cool.  What's the other thread called?
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