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Long Term Fuel Storage Test (Read 722 times)
Dave
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Long Term Fuel Storage Test
10/25/13 at 04:16:18
 
When the ethanol fuel came on the market, people started to experience problems that had never occurrred previously.  My uncle had a couple of muscle cars that needed new accelerator pump diaphragms every spring after storage, and as forum member ZAR can probably tell you the fuel pump diaphragms in Briggs and Stratton engines were becoming soft and deformed - while the normal failure mode used to be the diaphagms would get holes in them or dry out and get stiff.  I have several pieces of equipment that had fuel hoses that dissolved and became like sticky taffy.  My neighbors started bringing their yard equipment over to me far more than they used to......as they could not get them started in the spring.   My own experience has been that equipment that is stored in an insulated and heated garage or basement stores much better than equipment that is stored outdoors, under a carport, or in a barn where the temperature and weather conditions swing wildly.

In an effort to satisfy my curiousity, I filled some plastic bottles with different fuels to see what changes I could see in the fuel.  I filled each bottle to the same level and set them on a shelf in my garage.  I did not take a picture when I bottled them up two year ago.......but this is what the bottles look like after two years of storage.  The first bottle on the left is pump gas regular with 10% ethanol, the second bottle is Sunoco 96 octane racing fuel, the third bottle is Avgas 100LL, and the fourth bottle is CountryMark 90+ fuel that has no ethanol. The bottles were all  filled to the horizontal molding line in the middle of the bottles where the first and third bottle levels are, and the different heights is evidently the result of the fuel evaporating through the plastic bottle, as the caps are screwed down tight.    



About a week ago I decided that I had not learned much from this test, as it only shows what happens if you store the fuel in a tightly sealed fuel container.  I was seeding my lawn at the time and I dumped the Avgas, Shell 96 and CountryMark fuels into the seeder fuel tank and they all ran fine.  When I went to dump the pump gas w/ethanol into the seeder I noticed that there was something in the bottom of the bottle that was not mixed with the fuel.  I am not sure if this is ethanol or water - but it is laying in the bottom of the bottle and does not mix with the fuel.  I have not dumped this out yet, and I am going to drop some bare steel in the bottle and see if the metal rusts when in contact.



In order to get more useful information, I have decided to repeat the test with some modifications.  I have drilled a tiny hole in the cap to simulate the fuel tank and carb vents - this will allow the bottle to better approximate the storage in a real fuel tank and carb.  I have also placed a small piece of brass wire, a small piece of aluminum, and a small piece of bare steel in the bottle so I can see how they hold up when immersed in the fuel.  I will also be placing these bottles out in my wood shed so they will be out of the weather - but exposed to the changes in outdoor temperature and humidity.  The fuels in this test are Avgas 100LL, pump premium w/ethanol, Sunoco 96 racing fuel, CountryMark 90+, pump premium w/ethanol, pump premioum w/ethanol and Startron added.



This photo shows the brass wire, steel tubing and aluminum placed in the bottle.



I will give you all an update as the fuel ages.  I really don't expect much to happen right away......I expect this to take a while.

Funny what some of us "gearheads" will do to entertain ourselves! Shocked
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engineer
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #1 - 10/25/13 at 06:38:31
 
Great study Dave.  It's good that someone is actually experimenting rather than just using anecdotal evidence.  Most gas tanks are vented and subject to some "breathing" as you pointed out in the recent post about fuel additives in Rubber Side Down.  In addition to your fuel storage in a sealed container experiment I wonder if another set of bottles with some vent holes might help to reflect what happens in a typical gas tank.  Small vents would allow more moisture and oxygen to enter the fuel and corrode the metal pieces.

Here is a picture of a fuel filter that was in the tank of a Moto Guzzi.  The filters and hoses had to be replaced in all the bikes that used this filter in the US with our E10 fuel.  As far as I know it was not a problem in countries with E5 or ethanol free fuels.  This filter was caught before any leakage started.



The ethanol softens and weakens some plastics.  In my portable power generator it softened the adhesive used to mount the fuel gauge float assembly which fell off and had to be fished out along with small bits of the adhesive which clogged the carburetor.  Something also dissolved much of the body of plastic floats in the carbs of some older lawn equipment I had.  At the equipment store where I buy parts they told me that a good percentage of their business is related to ethanol problems.

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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #2 - 10/25/13 at 06:45:59
 
Engineer:

The new test does have vent holes in the caps - so it will approximate a fuel tank or float bowl.

The fuel tank on my Sherco trials bike is made from Nylon.  I bought the bike new and the importer stated that premium pump gas was fine to use in them.  In about 2 months the fuel tank started to expand like the fuel filter photo you posted......only it grew in all directions and did not look so deformed as the filter.  The tank howewer was getting so large it would not fit in the frame rails and was starting to push the rear fender backwards.  I took the tank off and emptied it and let it air out for a couple of weeks and it returned to a normal size - and I have been using the CountryMark 90+ ethanol free fuel and it has been 4 years with no additional problems.
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #3 - 10/25/13 at 07:21:58
 
Cool test.. though instead of brass .. I would have put in natural rubber aka gasoline hose.
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #4 - 10/25/13 at 09:02:08
 
+1,.. Pine...

Maybe just drop a small o-ring in each bottle?...
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #5 - 10/25/13 at 10:55:21
 
Serowbot wrote on 10/25/13 at 09:02:08:
+1,.. Pine...

Maybe just drop a small o-ring in each bottle?...


I have plenty of O-rings....and I will add one to each bottle before I move them to the woodshed this weekend.  I didn't use fuel line as all the the fuel line I bought recently is stuff like Tygon or Silicone, and most fuel line formulas have been changed to be ethanol resistant.
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #6 - 10/25/13 at 11:04:20
 
......and, now we wait.....
Hmm, hmm hmmm... hmmm,... hmmm...
... for...  a year or so...

Hmmmm. hmmm... Huh...

Are we there yet?... Huh...
No... Undecided...
 
Huh................
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #7 - 11/02/13 at 06:23:47
 
I found a size of O-ring that was a normal fit over the steel tube, so I installed one on each of the tubes in all the test fuel bottles.



Then I put the test bottles in a small box, and moved it out to a remote corner of the wood shed.  It has a roof and walls, but no doors on the openings front and back so the air is free to move through the shed and season the wood.  This will provide a good test for what happens when equipment is stored in places that are not insulated.



I really don't expect any need for an update for months.......this will take a while I expect.
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« Last Edit: 11/02/13 at 12:09:23 by Dave »  

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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #8 - 11/02/13 at 07:25:51
 
Where are Marty and the professor when you need them? Grin Dave, we could get a delorian and work on a flux capacitor... or wait. Which would be more fun?

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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #9 - 11/02/13 at 09:01:17
 
Well I can tell you deloreans are NO FUN to work on.
OR drive.
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #10 - 11/02/13 at 12:14:43
 
old_rider wrote on 11/02/13 at 07:25:51:
Where are Marty and the professor when you need them? Grin Dave, we could get a delorian and work on a flux capacitor... or wait. Which would be more fun?



I have a strong belief that ethanol fuel is hard on small equipment that sits idle for long period of time.....or anything that is not used regularly enough to keep the fuel fresh.  I have fixed a lot of equipment for my neighbors that I believe was damage caused by ethanol fuel..... just want to see the process first hand.  I use the ethanol free CountryMark 90+ fuel in mine and I add StaBil to this fuel.  I have used fuel that is 2 years old and stored in 55 gallon steel drums that are sealed up, and I pull about 15 gallons out every month or so to fill my 5 gallon cans, and I have never had any fuel related problems.  
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #11 - 11/02/13 at 19:01:09
 
Well you are correct in that the ethanol fuel kept outside in your equipment will melt the rubber or plastic in todays lawn mowers and weed eaters.  This year I replaced both, the weed eaters primer bulb melted, it disentigrated when went to prime it start. The lawnmower had internal bits and pieces that were rubber based, they melted and gummed up everything. This is the third season for the lawn mower, and only the second one for the weed eater. I left fuel in both of them for about four to five months.

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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #12 - 11/02/13 at 19:45:36
 
The first sample looks suspiciously like a the urine sample I gave to the lab, which, coincidentally, they say is now missing. Hmmmm.

Good hunting
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #13 - 11/03/13 at 06:50:59
 
The W-650 actuially has an accelerator pump on one carb.. about the size of a quarter, & a bit over 25 dollars,, & it goes away with ethanol
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Re: Long Term Fuel Storage Test
Reply #14 - 11/09/13 at 07:44:49
 
The local gas station just got an E85 pump.....so I bought a little bit of it and added it to the test just for kicks.  The stuff is clear as water, and it smells nothing like gasoline.

The other bottles are showing little change.  The level has dropped slightly in a few bottles - but the steel, aluminum, rubber and brass parts don't show any corrosion yet.  Not a surprise....it has only been a few weeks.

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