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Removed the white spacer, what else? (Read 70 times)
Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #60 - 10/27/04 at 15:28:59
 
Wifey went to ket the kids, so I had time to run around a little.

The air/fuel mixture screw was at 4 1/4 turns out !
Wow! No wonder it was running rich!

I adjusted to 3/4 of a turn out. I left out the white spacer, and moved the clip on the jet needle up to the 3rd position.

We'll see how that goes.  

It took awhile for the bike to start up after doing the work to the bike.  Had me worried for a little bit.  Undecided
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #61 - 10/28/04 at 02:20:29
 
Wow.  A lot went on after I left yesterday.....

So you do have a DJ kit.  I wondered when you said the main jet was a 144.....

Okay, let's backup.  We started all this because you bought a bike with a Trapp and you have backfiring.  That is why we got sidetracked on changing jets (it's good that the previous owner did a good job).  I'm sorry if I caused you to run all over the place getting parts  Embarrassed  Next time I'll suggest exploratory surgery first....

Now, we have got to get rid of the backfires and you don't have to buy anything....

So you have a Trapp with 8 disks, a DJ kit and backfires....

How often does it backfire?  When?
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #62 - 10/28/04 at 02:53:31
 
I just found an old picture of the jets....this is a stock jet needle and shows the spacer that I used (you don't need).

The spring pushes against the clip and the spacer merely changes the upward position.  You have slots and you can adjust that distance.  Moving YOUR clip to a lower slot makes it richer.  Moving it up a slot makes it leaner.

You have backfires and need to be richer.  Where did you start?  Do you remember?
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Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #63 - 10/28/04 at 06:03:54
 
It backfires when letting off the accelerator, switching gears, and when you shut the bike off.

I have the DJ kit, I put in a 152.5 main jet yesterday, with no spacer and moved the clip up to the 3rd position and changed the air/fuel mixture to 3/4 of a turn out, it was at 4 1/2 turns out.

The little riding I did after all this, the bike seemed to run better, but still backfiring when letting off the gas and switching gears, and when turning off the bike.
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #64 - 10/28/04 at 06:48:55
 
Okay first....to the 3/4 turn on the idle mixture.....with bike hot and idling, turn the screw on the right side to the fastest smooth idle speed.  It isn't the number of turns...but the fastest smoothest idle that matters.  Mine is about 2 turns out, but with different pipes and mods, everyone is a little different.

Now if the bike is idling too fast (seems to you), then lower the idle speed with the idle speed screw on the left side.  Since you don't have a tach, just lower it to just above a loping speed where letting out the clutch and accelerating is smooth without stalling or revving.

How is it so far?
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Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #65 - 10/28/04 at 15:29:28
 
I went out just a little bit ago and the bike started right up.

It died a few times when I put it into 1st gear, so I let it warm up a little longer, and it seemed to be fine.
Is that normal for it to die, if it hasn't warmed up long enough?

I rode it for a few mins (that's all the time I have for now) and came back and adjusted the idle mixture to almost 2 turns out. The idle seems to be real good.

Still backfiring..
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Savage_Rob
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #66 - 10/28/04 at 19:29:52
 
I always start mine with the choke halfway out and wait about 20-30 seconds until I hear her start to gag.  Then I give her a slight throttle while pushing the choke in.  After that I usually let her idle for another minute or two just to circulate oil before riding.

Well, today's the first day I've had a chance to actually ride for more than a few minutes since adding the MAC muffler and rejetting.  She backfired worse than before and when going from higher throttle to nothing (when coming to a stop) she died twice.  I was wondering if she might.  Just with higher throttle and then sharp drop off, she kinda choked.  I'm sure it's a result of leaving the spacer in after adding the DJ kit.  I thought it might be too lean - especially with the major difference in airflow with the MAC muffler and K&N air filter done at the same time.  On Saturday I'll be removing the spacer and leaving the needle setting where it is at the 4th notch down.  That and changing to either a 155 or 157.5 Mikuni main should fix it right up, I think.  The Mikuni jets should arrive within a few days and that part won't require tank removal.
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1998|MAC muffler|ceramic coated header|K&N air filter|Amal Mk2 carb|Odyssey battery|iridium plug|NC windshield|Dunlop 491s|Superbrace|EBC brake rotor|12.5" Progressive shocks|Kuryakyn ISO grips
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #67 - 10/29/04 at 03:14:27
 
Okay....the first thing that I notice (not rocket science) is that both you guys have DJ kits.  Firefighter has one installed and didn't know it, and Rob has a partial kit installed.  And both of you have backfires.  What's up?

It's cool that you both have adjustable needles cause that can probably eliminate the spacer all together....

Just remember, the higher the clip on the needle the leaner the mixture, and vice versa....we gotta try to talk about clip positions from the same end too to avoid confusion.  Shall we refer to the slot numbers as "from the top"?

Both of our bikes have aftermarket pipes installed and neither one backfires.  So what's the difference and the cure?
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #68 - 10/29/04 at 03:29:11
 
Firefighter wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:
I went out just a little bit ago and the bike started right up.

It died a few times when I put it into 1st gear, so I let it warm up a little longer, and it seemed to be fine.
Is that normal for it to die, if it hasn't warmed up long enough?


No it isn't normal.  I gotta ask...Are you real new to riding?  Is it dying because of rider error when you start out?  As Rob says, 1/2 choke is helpful, but the weather is also warm right now too and it shouldn't need much choke.  Are you using the clutch and gas correctly to start, or is there a problem with the bike?  Is the idle speed too low?

Quote:
I rode it for a few mins (that's all the time I have for now) and came back and adjusted the idle mixture to almost 2 turns out. The idle seems to be real good.


Okay, you adjusted it after you got back, not before.  2 turns out should be better than the 3/4 that it was.  Next time, take it for a ride before you make any adjustments to find out what change 2 turns made.

Quote:
Still backfiring..


Let's define "backfire".

Is it a "pop, pop, pop" or a 'boom'?  

And when does it "pop", or "boom'" while you are riding?
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klx650sm2002
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #69 - 10/29/04 at 07:32:44
 
I prefer a slightly rich idle mix, it gives a more consistant tickover from cold.
Keihin needles have 7 slots, mine is on #5.

Clive W  Cheesy
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klx650sm2002
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #70 - 10/29/04 at 07:53:59
 
Keihin set as above gives wheelspin in second in the wet.

Clive W  Cheesy
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Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #71 - 10/29/04 at 08:45:27
 
Savage_Greg wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:
No it isn't normal.  I gotta ask...Are you real new to riding?  Is it dying because of rider error when you start out?  As Rob says, 1/2 choke is helpful, but the weather is also warm right now too and it shouldn't need much choke.  Are you using the clutch and gas correctly to start, or is there a problem with the bike?  Is the idle speed too low?

Okay, you adjusted it after you got back, not before.  2 turns out should be better than the 3/4 that it was.  Next time, take it for a ride before you make any adjustments to find out what change 2 turns made.


Let's define "backfire".

Is it a "pop, pop, pop" or a 'boom'?  

And when does it "pop", or "boom'" while you are riding?


I am a new rider, but it wasn't driver error. I think it just had to warm up a little more.  I haven't ran it yet today, but I am getting ready to. I'll see how it goes from there.

It is a "pop, pop, pop" and then when you shut the bike off, it gives one last "pop".
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Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #72 - 10/29/04 at 08:48:09
 
Savage_Greg wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:
Okay....the first thing that I notice (not rocket science) is that both you guys have DJ kits.  Firefighter has one installed and didn't know it, and Rob has a partial kit installed.  And both of you have backfires.  What's up?

It's cool that you both have adjustable needles cause that can probably eliminate the spacer all together....

Just remember, the higher the clip on the needle the leaner the mixture, and vice versa....we gotta try to talk about clip positions from the same end too to avoid confusion.  Shall we refer to the slot numbers as "from the top"?

Both of our bikes have aftermarket pipes installed and neither one backfires.  So what's the difference and the cure?


Ok, referring from the top, I now have my needle set on "3".  It was on "4" and it seemed too rich, BUT, I didn't adjust the fuel mixture screw any, but it was set really lean.
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #73 - 10/29/04 at 08:58:14
 
Firefighter wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:
Ok, referring from the top, I now have my needle set on "3".  It was on "4" and it seemed too rich, BUT, I didn't adjust the fuel mixture screw any, but it was set really lean.


Are the slots about the same distance apart as the spacer?  Does it look anything like the distance on the needle in the photo above?

I bet that you are really sick of removing the tank too?
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Firefighter
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Re: Removed the white spacer, what else?
Reply #74 - 10/29/04 at 09:00:33
 
I would say the slots are closer than the distance of the spacer.

I haven't removed the tank anymore since I moved it to the 3rd position.  I am gonn go right now and run it for a few and get it good and warm and see how it goes.
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