pg wrote on 09/08/17 at 20:25:39:


Australia like every country in the world has a past of incredible cruelty. The Spanish destroyed the entire Mayan civilisation. Aborigines were hunted like animals. Much like the way Americans gave the American Indians smallpox infected blankets. But this is not the issue here.

We also have a government who pander to hate with acts of pointless dog whistling random cruelty but there are good people here too as you can see here https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/sep/09/victoria-steps-in-to-h...

Yes immigration should be controlled and people should follow the law, nevertheless the answer is not acts of random cruelty. And for wealthy nations to engage in this sort of cruelty for the sake of their own politics is reprehensible. However what Trump is doing to the USofA is on a scale that's barely comprehensible. His dismantling of laws to stop chemical companies dumping toxic waste in rivers is frankly weird and how people can support this sort of environmental vandalism is beyond my ability to comprehend.

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 09/08/17 at 23:45:16:


Show you what? A copy of the new regulations?

Please feel free to correct me if I've somehow got this wrong but I was under the impression that his sworn duty was to uphold the law and not to break it. He was found to be in criminal contempt precisely because his own take on what his duties were, were found to be illegal and he still refused to comply with the law.

We have major US cities refusing to follow current immigration laws and in fact are actively promoting methods, using public funds, how to avoid the consequences of violating  state and federal laws. We have a previous IRS commissioner who will escape FBI investigation for violating the laws that outline her duties. Both of these are examples of political prosecutions that DIDNT happen which is the opposite of what happened to that Sheriff. There are a hundred Joes on the opposite side of the fence who have no worry or fear about violating laws. Old Joe here stood up and did what was right and took the heat.

I always find it interesting when foreigners attack the USA with such vile and hatred. And from what little of your crap I've read, you have no real first hand knowledge of what's going on. As I pointed out, you were completely wrong about this topic to begin with.

And Jog's questions are valid. When do you stop immigration? When do you say enough? How long do you voluntarily change the very core of your nation, because that's what immigration without assimilation does and that's what's happening.

It's easy and simplistic to claim some moral high ground and shed fake tears over parents trying to escape $hitholes like Mexico. I get that. But at some point, adults have step in and look to the future. That's where we are and the question deserves a valid answer.

So, Obama, signed a, ‘deal’, with Australia, just  DAYS  BEFORE  the election,
to take, Australia’s  refugees, from their, ‘Off Shore”, camps.
And bring them to the US.

    (The  B.S., 'good for you, but not for me', comes to mind)

“The Coalition government, now led by Turnbull, campaigned in 2013 on a vow to “stop the boats," and OSB included posters with slogans such as "No Way: You will not make Australia home."

“Boat arrivals have all but dried up since Australia said it would refuse resettlement to any refugees arriving on unauthorized vessels, sending  them instead to Papua New Guinea and Nauru in the Pacific."

“…While Australia welcomes migrants and visitors, individuals must arrive lawfully…”
“…Under the new detention model high risk unlawful non-citizens remain subject to detention in immigration detention facilities as necessary. The safety of the Australian community is important. The decision to place an individual who does not hold a valid visa into an immigration detention facility includes consideration of whether or not they present a risk to the Australian community….”

“…If a person has exhausted all options to stay in Australia and does not leave, the Department will facilitate their removal….”

“…Over the past few years, the nature of people in immigration detention has changed from illegal maritime arrivals to a population that potentially presents a security risk to the community and those who have had their visa cancelled due to their substantial criminal history…”

“…The increase of people who have had their visa cancelled on character grounds now makes up around a third of the held detention population. This presents challenges to the safe management of detention facilities resulting in an increased need to use mechanical restraints including flexi-cuffs—particularly when moving a high risk detainee from one facility to another. Where this is done, it is recorded as ‘use of force’, and it is undertaken within the law and appropriate guidelines. The use of restraints must always be necessary, proportionate and reported….”

That’s just 15 minuets, on Just  ONE, Subject,  
          “Refugees”


No need to go into the, ‘gun’ laws,
which are a  Unbelievable, ‘Lack of Freedom”.
  (Well what does one expect from a, ‘Common wealth’)

And what does that, ‘Commonwealth’, do with,
‘Un - Documented Aliens’?  (Not the ones from Mars)
 Very Hard to find it, it is well hidden.
Not worth the time to dig it up.

@pg, @mn...

Gee willikers and golly gosh we've got photos from pg, and we have a big big post from mn. I am humbled  that you have both taken the time to compose such specious bullshit.

However you pose a dilemma for me, how do I respond. Do I play this with a straight bat and just point out the fallacy of your false equivalency? Would that be condescending because to do that I would have to assume that you are as stupid as you pretend to be. OR do I respond as if you really ARE as thick as two planks... What to do what to do.

Am I allowed to phone a friend? Maybe some other helpful readers can select which way I go on this. For the record I simply do not believe you guys are this dumb, after all you ride motorbikes in some twisted way we are all brothers here.

OK help me out, answer this, are you guys serious when you pretend that stopping people arriving by a rickety boat where unscrupulous agents send them out to either make it to shore or die, is identical to DACA where those targeted have lived in the US and for all intents and purposes been US citizens in every way except for a technicality. Who are not just dumped into the illegal alien basket but are in fact nearly a million strong group of people who have very very tight restrictions on how they qualify and what they must do in order to fully gain legitimacy. People who have already contributed to this marvellous but flawed country you all profess to love so much.

Are you guy seriously putting these two scenarios on the table for consideration as to their moral, ethical and legal equivalence. When I get an answer to that, I'll be in a better position to respond appropriately.

P.S for the record the govt. of Australia has just agreed to pay out $70,000,000 dollars for illegal detention to these people.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-14/commonwealth-agrees-to-pay-manus-island...

ho are not just dumped into the illegal alien basket but are in fact nearly a million strong group of people who have very very tight restrictions on how they qualify and what they must do in order to fully gain legitimacy. People who have already contributed to this marvellous but flawed country you all profess to love so much.


Gosh, you mean those people are all clean cut, hard working Americans?
I guess that report last week about the dreamers who pulled a murder was a lie..

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 09/09/17 at 16:52:04:


Mate those people are just normal Americans. I would expect some of them to be thieves and rapists, at the exact same level of the general population. But then this is how racism works isn't it, find a few bad eggs and use that as an excuse. I'll bet though none of them are as as criminally insane as the All American hero timothy mcveigh  or the columbine killers. but there you go.

@pg, you win, you've beaten me with your obdurate idiocy I resign.

Jog, everyone's a good guy in the end, but sometime we behave badly. However the DACA stuff is simple pointless cruelty, which is what Trump loves, it's simply pandering to the worst of the worst. It's dog whistling. Had he had his way he's cut taxes for the rich and remove health care for the poor. Laughably the Freedom Caucus thought the the health care bill wasn't nasty enough!

DACA are a separate and quite different class of 'illegals' to people who sneak over the border. In fact it had bi partisan support, but the Republicans are too piss weak to not let Trump and Foghorn Leghorn ply their cruelty.

And as for 'taking your jobs' they are creating jobs and growing the economy. Why do you think countries even bother to embrace immigration at all? Overall 800,000 people living in the USA for 20 years on average from children to adults are like any other citizen born there part of the wealth. Sure there's be some criminals, sure there'll be some bludgers just like the non illegal population. They've already been consuming goods, paying taxes, and growing the economy. And the economy has been growing steadily during the time they've been in the USA. Your GDP has gone up. Had these 800,000 never been in the country the USA would not be wealthier for it.

Even people on social security don't pile up that cash under their bed, they spend it, it goes back into the economy, even if they buy drugs the drug dealers spend it. Australia is one of the only Western countries in the world who did not suffer from a recession during the global meltdown because the Labor govt, injected a massive (for us) 54 billion into the economy. It was called irresponsible at the time, now it's called genius.