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coil and ignitor destroyed (Read 1231 times)
fsmidt
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nulli cedo

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coil and ignitor destroyed
12/29/10 at 07:58:22
 
i`ve been chopping my electrical wiring.
puting it back, ride a while and parked it in the shed.
next day no spark.
checking the coil, darn thing was melted down, replaced it and try .....no spark.
checking and smelling ignitor, humm not smelling nice, operate the darn thing.
after opening the ignitor i saw this. Sad

http://www.suzukisavage.nl/ForumsPro/download/id=728.html

how on earth it is possible to melt down the coil and ignitor.

i ordered replace ignitor from the dutch savagesite but affraid it will be destroyed again.
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« Last Edit: 12/08/12 at 12:40:21 by Oldfeller »  
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verslagen1
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #1 - 12/29/10 at 08:41:22
 


That's a power transister that's burnt to a cinder.
And right there my friends is why we loose spark at 10v, IC chips.
Designed to run on 12v, as soon as the voltage drops, they don't work.

me thinks you left the switch on, the coil shorted and the limited heat sink on the power IC overheated.

Please take a pic of the backside and enough picts so all the components can be identified.  This looks like a single sided pc board, it can be duplicated.
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fsmidt
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #2 - 12/29/10 at 10:08:34
 
http://www.suzukisavage.nl/ForumsPro/download/id=729.html

http://www.suzukisavage.nl/ForumsPro/download/id=727.html

the wires to the 3 pins (mosfett ?) are orange/wite    black/yellow  and black/white.

orange/white is not direct to the mosfett but first an diode after this one 2 other resistance.

these pictures are from 2009 when i had the same problem,broken coil and igniter.

is it possible problems start when you use a batterycharger on battery while you start the engine?
i think both time this nuts happens the battery is/was low on power.
i also left on switch for a longtime.

i also had/have current on both wires of the coil when switch is on.
i don`t know if this was before or after ignitor was melting down.

the bike just ran fine the day before.

is there no spark when current is below 10v? but at 10volt the starterengine is not turning isn`t it?

if ground is not good is it possible to ruine the coil? and when the coil was down the igniter was next?

i know a lot of questions...

i`ve you like i can make picture`s of Ignitor.do you want to duplicate it?


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verslagen1
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #3 - 12/29/10 at 10:46:27
 
This is for a '86 thru '88


Quote:
the wires to the 3 pins (mosfett ?) are orange/white    black/yellow  and black/white.


Seems to confirm a problem with the coil.
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« Last Edit: 07/09/12 at 20:24:51 by verslagen1 »  

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fsmidt
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #4 - 01/07/11 at 06:56:04
 
Quote:
I don't personally want to duplicate, but if someone wanted to repair one in the future, it would be good info to have.


maybey for you electric goeroes,create with info on link an programmable cdi or else ,there are 5 differant cdi explaned.

http://www.transmic.net/en/home.htm


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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #5 - 01/16/11 at 22:19:25
 
I've lost the ignitor several times myself from leaving power on to the coil. Damage to mine looked like your pictures.
The Savage unit is a TCI system(Transistor Controlled Igniton). With the ignition switch on there is 12 volts on the coil at all times. The TCI interupts the ground side of the coil(Yellow-Black wire to pin 5) and the sparkplug fires. If you leave the ignition switch on with engine not running for an extended period the power transistor will overheat and fail.
Sounds like you have 2 failed ignitors. They can be repaired fairly easy. If you do  it yourself cost to repair both shouldn't be over $15.00. More if you use a shop. If you want to  repair them, let me know and I can give you a list of parts and source.
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fsmidt
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #6 - 01/16/11 at 22:46:36
 
i have a used one on it right now,but plz send the needed part numbers and instructions.

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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #7 - 01/17/11 at 18:42:26
 
fsmidt:
To repair the ignitors you should be familiar with simple PC board repairs and good soldering practices or have a good friend who does nearby.
 I would begin by cleaning the foil side of the  pc board in the burnt area. If the copper foil is burnt away from the board, it is not a good candidate for repair. You can use a toothbrush,solvent,steelwool to clean the area. If you are able to polish the copper where it will take solder, component replacement is possible.
 From your picture of the component side of ignitor it looks like you lost the transistor and the black diode and blue resistor (470 ohm) directly below it. unseen in your picture are two small resistors underneath the transistors heat sink. The one closest to the board edge is 22 ohm, the other a 2K ohm. Both are 1/8 watt rated. If they look damaged I would replace them.
 Remove the damaged components using a low wattage gun and some solder wick. Remove the screw holding the transistor to the heat sink. With the transistor out of the way you can clean heat sink to insure good thermal contact  between it and the new transistor. Use thermal grease between them. The new transistor is a direct replacement with same mounting holes and pin layout. observe polarity when mounting diode.(Banded end faces away from block connector)
 After soldering and trimming leads, check the foil side closely for shorts and solder bridges. A good magnifier comes in handy here.
 I have had sucess in repairing two ignitors. Hopes this works for you.

 These components should be available from any electronic supply house:   A 1 amp rated general purpose diode(1n4003, 4 or 5)
            470 ohm 1 watt resistor  (Blue one in pic)
            22 ohm and 2K ohm  1/8 watt resistors if needed

 The transistor I used is a High Voltage Ignition Coil Driver mfg by ST Micro Electronics. This is a NPN Power darlington type in a TO-220 package. Part # is BU914ZT. I bought mine from Mouser Electronics(mouser.com) under part # 511-BU941ZT for about  3 bucks each. I think Digikey(digikey.com) also stocked these.
 Good luck with your repairs. Sucess qualifies you as a Savage Brain Surgeon.
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Re: coil and ignitor destroyed
Reply #8 - 01/18/11 at 00:43:20
 
GREAT!!!! tnx tx650.

i have friend(now good friend Wink )who can solder tiny things.
luckily the copper is still intact its a little lose but ok.
thanks for components numbers.
we will give it a try.
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #9 - 04/03/12 at 08:49:40
 
is the glue looking material on the board the signs on a melted board?
verslagen1 wrote on 12/29/10 at 08:41:22:
http://www.suzukisavage.nl/ForumsPro/download/id=728.html

That's a power transister that's burnt to a cinder.
And right there my friends is why we loose spark at 10v, IC chips.
Designed to run on 12v, as soon as the voltage drops, they don't work.

me thinks you left the switch on, the coil shorted and the limited heat sink on the power IC overheated.

Please take a pic of the backside and enough picts so all the components can be identified.  This looks like a single sided pc board, it can be duplicated.

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verslagen1
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Re: coil and ignitor distroyed
Reply #10 - 04/03/12 at 09:13:30
 
No, that's conformal coating.  It protects the board from moisture and helps prevent vibration damage.

Rome08 wrote on 04/03/12 at 08:49:40:
is the glue looking material on the board the signs on a melted board?




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Re: coil and ignitor destroyed
Reply #11 - 04/03/12 at 09:48:32
 
is it bad if it drips onto the back of the board and could this cause sputtering/stalling during accelleration?
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Re: coil and ignitor destroyed
Reply #12 - 07/09/12 at 20:28:22
 
This is for a '95 on


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verslagen1
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Re: coil and ignitor destroyed
Reply #13 - 07/22/12 at 11:41:16
 
Be aware, check the connector before buying.
Different years have different connectors and may not be compatible to your bike even if you change the connector.
the 80's series are definitely not compatible to the 90's series due to timing issues.
And now I see an '09 might have a 6 prong connector.
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Re: coil and ignitor destroyed
Reply #14 - 08/22/13 at 15:21:07
 
I have had had two CDI blow due to the reason highlighted in this post I think. I have paid lots of money to get

two new CDI and they have blown also. I repaired both CDI's with new power transitors and they also blow. I have

decided to make my own CDI based on http://www.transmic.net/en/dc628-v20.htm
Does anyone know:
1/ The Ignition Advance Curve for the LS650
2/ The position of the Pickup Coil/Pulsor Coil relative to Top Dead Centre (TDC) e.g. maybe 36 degrees before TDC.
3/ Is the pulse from the Pickup coil positive then negative or negative then positive
4/ The rev range of the LS650
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