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1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking (Read 430 times)
verslagen1
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #15 - 09/10/08 at 20:29:52
 
Have you have sparky out of its hole yet?  and the end wasn't damaged?  like you had dropped something down into the piston?

My guess is you got a loose wrist pin, but the cam adjuster alot easier to check.

anyway, I'd concider trailering it to the dealer.
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #16 - 09/10/08 at 21:14:22
 
Sandy, that's a good one... I am taking this one to work tomorrow and let my other friend listen to it. He think it might have to do with cam chain tentioner.
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #17 - 09/10/08 at 22:04:59
 
Let me answer this way... if it is, and it's clacking that bad, every time you start it, every revolution, you're rolling the dice... are you going to roll 7 or are you going to crap out... every turn of the engine... you need a 7.

If you stop now and check it, you can stop rolling the dice.
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #18 - 09/11/08 at 00:44:59
 
Seattle_Savage wrote on 09/10/08 at 13:37:27:
Oh, by the way I post the same question on the motorcycle forum and I received response that might be the piston hits the cylinder head. Is this posible?
No, not in the Savage unless you have just rebuilt it with the wrong piston or conrod.  
There is 3.5mm of clear space between the top if the piston and the cylinder head.
Forget that line of enquiry - the guys on that forum must be smoking the same stuff as the mechanic you took the bike to.

You're only going to get the piston hitting the cylinder head in one of two circumstances:

A -  Your conrod had let loose, and the inside of the motor is an expensive mess of hot oily chunks of useless metal.  It wouldn't even turn over if the engine had blown like this.
B - The engine has had a custom rebuild using aftermarket performance components and somebody got his math wrong. Unless the bike has just been rebuilt in this way, this is not the case.

As for piston hitting the valves, B also applies.  
Piston/valve contact can also happen if a standard engine is assembled wrong with the timing chain out by a few teeth so the valves are opening at the wrong time, or if the chain has 'jumped' on its teeth (can happen on some motors).  But, if this were the case, the bike would be very difficult to start and run like an asthmatic donkey.  

If it runs fine apart from the knocking, the cam chain is in the right place and the valves are NOT hitting the piston.
If it's not just had some fancy but badly-planned rebuild, the piston simply CANNOT hit the cylinder head.

Trust us here.

Seattle_Savage wrote on 09/10/08 at 13:56:31:
I don't know how to do that, but it is obvious the knocking/tapping come from the piston area. Since the piston move up and down so fast and the noise is louder when you increase the throttle.
Now that does sound like a bearing, what we call the 'little end' in the UK, or as Verslagen says, the wrist pin.

Fingers crossed for you that if it's a bearing it's not the big end of the conrod - that would need a bottom end motor strip.


Possibilities:

Wrist pin
Big end bearing (mains tend to rumble, not knock)
Worn cam/followers
Cam chain tensioner
Broken piston ring (less likely)
Decompression mechanism
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #19 - 09/11/08 at 07:26:34
 
Thanks KwakNut,  Your info is very clear. I also cross my finger and hope it is not the bearing.  I will update the forum once the problem is identified.
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #20 - 09/11/08 at 11:40:48
 
As others said,  it would be a lot cheaper to open it up and look than to have it go bad.  

Going bad usually takes out parts that can normally be re-used.    Also, if it goes bad and parts break apart, the engine should be torn apart and checked for metal fragments.    That is very labor intensive and if you have to take it to a shop, would mean the bike is totalled…… .

First and foremost,  do a compression check on the engine.  

Next, what to open....  all these can be done in one day.....   first, right side cover.   Measure the cam chain tensioner (how far the rod is sticking out).    You will need a gasket to put it back together.    Also oil change is invoilved.

Next,  the Head cover (requires tank removal, but only uses gasket sealer, no gasket).  Look at rockers and the cam lob surfaces.  Also, if you can, look close at the cam journal (the surface the cam rides on).  It's only aluminum and if the Prev Owner mistreated the bike (oil wise) it might have excessive wear.  This manifests itself as a burr/bump of aluminum on it's edge by the chain sprocket. Will be hard to see.   I'm not sure if that would make it knock since the cam chain is tight enough to stop it from bouncing (normally  Huh ).

If they are good, then the connecting rod would be suspect....  but it's very robust.   If your oil is so bad as to take out the rod bearing,  the cam journal would have been disintergrated long before.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: 1998 Savage LS650 Engine knocking
Reply #21 - 09/11/08 at 11:56:51
 
I would pop the right side off & check the cam chain before I ever started it again. No comp check, nothing. It is time & if it falls apart, it can be fatal. Eevn if the problem is found NOT to be the cam chain, it needs checked anyway. I would certainly start with a known problem instead of running the engine, hunting a relatively rare one, when running it could prove fatal. Of course, it it does blow up, I know where you can sell the right side cover....


Best O luck!
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