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No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charged (Read 168 times)
DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #15 - 09/23/22 at 18:25:37
 
Would this be the box in question?  Was it located directly above the carburetor?  Five wires going to the box (ooops, six wires on the older models)?  If yes, that is the decompression relay.

Howzabout posting pics of your igniter unit spades?  I can see you have a pic of the box in the earlier post, can you shoot a pic of the spades and socket?

What year is your bike?  I must be confused.  Thought you had an 87 model.  I think I have you mixed up with another member.
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Decomp_Relay_001.jpg

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Yazman
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #16 - 09/23/22 at 19:08:36
 
DBM, I think you may be right, it does look like the decompression relay you picture. Which is odd, because I don't even have a decompression solenoid with the RYCA conversion. The corroded box in question has a black wire with a white stripe, a red wire with a white stripe, a yellow wire with a green stripe, a black wire with a red stripe, and a yellow wire with a black stripe. It's 1.5 by 1.5 x 1 in.

I have a 2011. I've attached a picture of my igniter connector below:
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IMG_20220923_220312856.jpg

2011 RYCA - 94mm flat top Wiseco, stage 3 cam, PWK38, open exhaust, UNI filter, 14/52 chain drive
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Yazman
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #17 - 09/23/22 at 19:12:14
 
Here's a picture of the back side of my igniter connector. It has two holes plugged, a black wire with white stripe, a black wire with yellow stripe, an orange wire, a green wire, an orange with white stripe, and a black wire:
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IMG_20220923_2209366642.jpg

2011 RYCA - 94mm flat top Wiseco, stage 3 cam, PWK38, open exhaust, UNI filter, 14/52 chain drive
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #18 - 09/23/22 at 21:49:19
 
Yazman wrote on 09/23/22 at 18:13:31:
The box that has the crusty connectors is actually a small box a bit larger than a 9v battery. It's not the CDI ignitor that has the corroded stuff. I'm not sure what that small box is.

I think that's the side stand relay, not sure but about the right size.
And you said it was about the size of a 9v battery.
Located on left side under the tank.
I does handle the igniter power so could be cause of low voltage/no spark.
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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #19 - 09/24/22 at 02:11:31
 
Thanks, I obviously had you confused with another member.  You can ignore my comments in reply #11, #12 & #14.  Those pertain to the early model ignition unit that utilized 9 pins.  Your 2011 model has the late model ignitor unit that utilizes 8 pins, just like your picture shows.

Yes, your picture in reply #8 shows the connector for the decompression controller, six pins, five wires (red/white, yellow/black, black/white, yellow/green & black/red).  That controller has two relays inside, one to energize the decompression solenoid, and one to energize the starter relay switch.  So, I suspect that the starter will still function even if the decomp solenoid has been removed.  Your engine cranks so I suspect you can rule out the decomp controller.

Versy, the side stand relay only has four pins.  It does hot up the engine "stop" switch, but the engine "stop" switch then hots up the starter button.  So, if the side stand relay was interrupting power to the ignition system, it would also interrupt power to the starter button.  If that's the case, it shouldn't crank.   Do I have that correct?  

Is this a Ryca cafe?  Do the Ryca kits change out the switch assemblies on the hand controls?
 
This sketch of the late model igniter unit pins may be useful.  It will show you which wires go to which pins, and tell you where the wires go to on the other end.
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Igniter_Pins_1996_thru_2019.jpg

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Yazman
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #20 - 09/24/22 at 04:23:50
 
I appreciate the help man! I'll have to trace those wires and make sure they're good. So it looks like maybe 3 possibilities:

1) Ignitor (bye-bye $300-500)

2) Pulse thing inside right cover (I can drain oil, ohm it out)

3) Shorted/cut wiring between ignitor and whatever things it goes to

Sounds right?
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IMG_20220923_1705338842_001.jpg

2011 RYCA - 94mm flat top Wiseco, stage 3 cam, PWK38, open exhaust, UNI filter, 14/52 chain drive
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #21 - 09/24/22 at 07:50:09
 
Yazman wrote on 09/24/22 at 04:23:50:
I appreciate the help man! I'll have to trace those wires and make sure they're good. So it looks like maybe 3 possibilities:

1) Ignitor (bye-bye $300-500)

2) Pulse thing inside right cover (I can drain oil, ohm it out)

3) Shorted/cut wiring between ignitor and whatever things it goes to

Sounds right?


1) 2011? used TCI's should be available on fleabay.
2) you don't need to drain oil, the connector is near the TCI box.
3) check the wiring coming up near the belt, that's where it usually get eaten.
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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #22 - 09/24/22 at 10:51:58
 
These checks might be helpful, but you need a multi-meter to do them.  If you don't have a multi-meter, spring a few bucks and buy one.  Digital display is generally safer than analog.

Ignition coil:

Primary windings, spade connector to spade connector, 1 to 7 ohms

Secondary windings, sparkplug lead to spade connector, 10K - 25K ohms


Igniter Unit Connector Plug:

Black/white wire pin to engine case, zero resistance

Orange/white wire pin should show 12V when key is on, clutch pulled in, sidestand down, trans in neutral

Black wire pin should show 12V when key is on, clutch pulled in, sidestand down, trans in neutral, starter button depressed

Orange wire pin to green wire pin (ignition pickup) 200 - 240 ohms.  Don't try and crank the engine with your meter hooked up to these pins.  Just check the static resistance.


This picture shows the connector plug.  Just unplug it to do the checks outlined above.
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Igniter_Plug_Wires.jpg

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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #23 - 09/24/22 at 10:53:16
 
Connect your meter to these female terminals in the connector plug.  When checking voltage at the orange/white wire and at the black wire, the black lead from your meter should be connected to the engine case, and the red lead from your meter should be connected to the connector plug terminal under test.
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Igniter_Unit_Plug_Female_Terminals.jpg

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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #24 - 09/24/22 at 12:26:39
 
Thanks again for the help!

Here are the readings for all of the above, keeping in mind the resistance of the meter itself measured at 0.8 ohms

Coil (all 3 checked out good)

4.8 ohms primary
21,100 oms secondary

Plug

202 ohms orange to green (same further down at the other connector)
0.08 ohms black w white
12.08v orange w white
10.28-10.46v black wire while cranking

Battery

12.7v

I found a dealer 4 hours away that has an ignitor box for $800. No joke. Half the vehicles I've ever owned have been purchased for less than that! I pray that is not the part I need. I called the tri-state area at every part and salvage store I could find, and nobody has one. Not a single used one to be found. There's a roached out one on fleabay that's like 200 bucks. The case is cracked wide open and it doesn't say if it works or not.
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2011 RYCA - 94mm flat top Wiseco, stage 3 cam, PWK38, open exhaust, UNI filter, 14/52 chain drive
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #25 - 09/25/22 at 15:20:47
 
The starter relay, positive cable end, and negative cable end looked gross. So, I cut them back and cleaned up all the terminals. The black wire on the ignitor connector now has 10.71-10.89v, but still no spark.

It must be the ignition box at this point, right?
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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #26 - 09/25/22 at 18:48:21
 
You might wanna try measuring the voltage at the igniter plug orange/white pin while you crank the engine.  See how low the voltage goes at that pin while cranking.  Key on, clutch pulled in, sidestand down, trans in neutral, starter button depressed.

That will tell you how much voltage is being provided to the igniter box and the coil while cranking.

You're in a pickle.  You have pretty much checked everything you can.  I can't recall if you tried a new sparkplug.  It's a long shot but I have seen it before.  Even with a new plug.  The plug looks perfect, but it won't fire.  Had an experience last year with a Honda Grom.  Brand new plug, had spark when you laid it on the cylinder head, but screw it into the plug hole and subject it to compression and it wouldn't fire.  Had me and a buddy pullin our hair out for a while.  Brand new plug solved the problem.  Seems too good to be true but it's worth a try.  Have you tried a new sparkplug.

If I recall correctly (something I have difficulty doin), this thing was running.  What all did you do to it since the last time it ran?  Did you have the alternator cover off?  Is there a chance that the igniter pickup got damaged or has too much air gap?
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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #27 - 09/25/22 at 19:02:57
 
Ah, I see it was running and then you power washed it.  Did you direct the high-pressure water at the pulley cover, into the pulley cover, onto the pulley, or the underside of the bike below the pulley?  You may have forced water into the wire bundle for the magnetic pickup.  That seems like a longshot since your continuity reading is good, but you may have an issue with insulation resistance to ground.

Check your insulation resistance to ground for the magnetic pickup.  Connect the black wire from your meter to the engine block.  Then connect the red meter wire to the orange pin in the igniter plug.  Resistance should be infinity or very, very high (like megohms high).  

Same thing for the green wire in the igniter plug.  Meter black lead to engine block.  Meter red lead to the green wire pin in the igniter plug.  Resistance should be infinity or very, very high (megohms high).
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #28 - 09/25/22 at 19:17:23
 
I power washed it when I first got it (a month or so ago), and it wouldn't start for a day, and then cranked up the next day. After that, I never had a problem again. I rode it for weeks everywhere and it was flawless. I tidied up some wiring on the left handlebar, went to start it up, and all of a sudden, no spark. I've tried a few different plugs, and well as the old screwdriver in the boot. I'm gonna bite the bullet and shell out $200 for a used ignitor. I don't know what else to do but throw parts at it.
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DragBikeMike
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Re: No spark, good coil, 12v @ coil, battery charg
Reply #29 - 09/25/22 at 19:19:17
 
Here you can see the bulkhead packing for the alternator stator wires and the mag pickup wires.  You may have forced water into the packing, or into the wire bundle running to the igniter unit and voltage regulator.

Your brother-in-law had trouble when he washed it, now you have the same trouble.  I would be lookin hard at places you might have forced water into electrical connectors, plugs, packing, components, etc.

Did you direct high-pressure water at the igniter unit?
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