MMRanch, engines started to last longer when they separated the gearbox from the engine (because it beats the hell out off the engine oil).  The viscosity of gear oil and engine oil is very different from each other gear oil is much thicker than engine oil. Now the both last longer!
T6 oil in your gearbox would not perform as good as gear oil.

Again, keep us posted!

Batman, how many miles do you have on this 1995 Savage?
Did you made any improvements on it over the years?
We like to know more about it!

FlyingH wrote on 08/04/19 at 11:54:18:


I don't agree with this philosophy......old Triumphs/Nortons had the gearbox and engine oil seperate, and they were lucky to go 20,000 miles without needing engine work.

Most modern motorcycles share the engine sump and gearbox, with the same oil being used to lubricate both.  These modern engine/gearbox combinations can last for hundreds of thousands of miles......extreme examples can go 200k and still be running without a rebuild (a courier in the UK got 500K on his Honda ST1100 without a rebuild.....and some ST forum members have more than 400K without a rebuild).
https://www.st-owners.com/forums/threads/highest-mileage-st1100.115490/

The secret is using a good oil, changing on a regular schedule.....and going on long rides on a regular basis (vehicles that are used exclusively for short trips around town will never reach those high miles).  The Honda Goldwing, Yamaha FJR, BMW boxers, Harley's and other large touring motorcycles can get very high mileage on a regular basis.  One Kawasaki 250 Ninja member got 86,000 miles out of his original engine until the cam chain just got too long and the tensioner was out of travel.......the engine still ran fine except for the cam chain rattle.  Well maintained motorcycles can go a very long time without issues....poorly maintained motorcycles can be broken in very short order (I bought a 3,800 mile Savage that needed the cam and rockers replaced).

It could be that gear oil might work better in a gearbox than motor oil - but the motorcycle gearbox was designed to use engine oil for lubrication, and gearbox failures are extremely rare.  The metal/metal contact of the gears might create more "junk" in the oil as the gears wear - however once they are broken in the gears really don't show that they are wearing or rubbing off metal to any degree.  On Youzguyz 160,000 mile Savage engine everything was in spec but the valve guides - the piston/cylinder, cam, rockers, etc. was all in spec and reused - the valves,guides and piston rings were replaced.

I post something.. (which I don't do often anymore), then turn around and Dave just mentioned me.
So, I'm sure the next questions will be about my oil "habits".

Rotella T6
Sometimes as often as every 5,000 miles, sometimes as much as 10,000 miles.   Usually around 8,000 miles.
And... it looks like I am overdue. again.. CRAP.
On both bikes.. DOUBLE crap.

This is beginning to sound like , kinda sorta with a newbie and all a

                                 OIL WAR

Reply #34  Dave,

Honda and other brands still using special gear oil and for similar reasons as I stated.
For your info: one of the many links regarding gearbox oils.
 https://www.motosport.com/pro-honda-hp-transmission-oil?variant[PHO000G]=PHO0...

Seems like we all have our own experiences and opinions.

Life is good!  ;

   Me, provoke or aggravate an oil war that was inadvertently started up by a newbie?  

 "Nevermore", saith the Raven.

Surely you jest ......

Rotella T6 is good oil, good enough for an annual or yearly change interval especially if backed up with special filtration (supermagnet ferrous separation).  

The base oil and the additive packages contained in T6 are not weak, and some of us bump T6 up some anyway because we like enough additives sitting in the sump to replace whatever gets scrubbed off even very late in the oil change cycle.

I really don't think we need another oil war, as we do have correct Recommended Oils http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344471565 sitting over in Technical Documents which has everything in it that a newbie needs to know.

Now, if the newbie was saying something silly, we'd correct it, but he is not saying anything that isn't pretty much gospel (seems to have better common sense than many of the new persons come in with).

Dave is beginning to think that because of the carbide inserts Suzuki put in the most modern tappet followers, we might could back off on the old oil recommendations, but I keep pointing out we have lots of bikes here on the list that PREDATE those fancy tappet followers and those older style valve trains are running simple case hardened steel parts that certainly DO NEED need the higher levels of oil additives that are included in Recommended Oils  http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344471565

And there is a point where you have to say yet again, putting in the full T6 packages and bumping on top of it may NOT be needed in every case, but "the old specs" so far has not shown any harm being done to the fancy new parts --- and it helps keep those thrashy gears in the tranny all happy to boot as they got no fancy hard stuff added to them.    

Plus having lots of ZDDP logically makes our cam chains run a bit longer as they are 100% case hardened steel and they too need the heavy additive package to live relatively longer.   So, protecting the oldest bikes still gives some benefits to even the newest production bikes and we still lack any form of sensor that would be damaged by the larger doses of ZDDP.

Plus, you really can't get a Savage hot enough to jell a gearcase full of full synthetic T6, the engine simply doesn't ever get hot enough to cause the full synthetic Rotella base oil much damage.

You know, back when the Savage was a puppy it wasn't a value bike at all, it was a Suzuki cost reduced take on a 350 Honda, nothing special, just a very minimal motorcycle.

It cost $1999 list when it first came out, and got sold for as low as $1500 new fairly regularly in the first years.

Suzuki wanted you to trade it in after the first year, so they made it as cheaply as legally possible and Suzuki had some 450s and 650s for you to trade up to.

It didn't need to last a long time ----- but it did anyway.

We puzzled out the fixes for most of the remaining issues and now they don't die at all unless you accidentally run them out of oil (#1 cause of death).