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Finn Hammer's Savage (Read 2291 times)
FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #300 - 06/04/24 at 12:24:23
 
If any of you are a bit like me, you dread the time when the valve lash needs to be adjusted. And why is that? You may disagree with me on this, but the access to the tappets is not exactly generous, I would call it cramped .
And fiddeling with a set of feeler gauges, a 10mm ring spanner and a screwdriver all at once is a hassle.
I find it a lot easier to work the lash procedure after I made these custom feeler gauges. It is just 2 lengths of brass rod, turned tapered in one end, slotted with the hacksaw, and short ends of feeler gauge soft soldered into the slots. The "go" one is 0.1mm thick, the other, the "no go", is 0.15mm thick
I find it a lot easier to adjust valve lash this way, with these tools.
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #301 - 06/04/24 at 12:30:35
 
But so far so good, I adjusted the lash, there was perhaps around 2 thou to take up, thought it was a good idea to quieten up the top end, to better evaluate the pesky noise from the engine.
The cam lobes look much like when the cam went into the engine, that blackish surface, well oiled. I must have done something right
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #302 - 06/04/24 at 12:41:00
 
Then let's cut to the chase and get to the point, the noise from the engine:
I pulled the left side cover from the engine to probe the flywheel, hoping it was ratteling about behind the starter gear.

No dice.

I had also considered the main bearings, so I hooked the dial gauge up to check for radial play in the main bearing, prying the generator rotor with a screwdriver from below,  bingo.

I think the video says it all. Rats! that means a total dismantlement of the engine and probably not a lot of time on the road this summer.

I will let you be the judge of the state of the main bearing from viewing this video, what you see (and hear) is 0.11mm of radial play:

https://youtube.com/shorts/iWyXzwO_32M

One good thing is I get more learning by doing, that is always worth while.
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ThumperPaul
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #303 - 06/04/24 at 13:47:40
 
Is there a tolerance for this?  The 0.11mm seems very small.

Glad you’re seeing it as an opportunity.  I wouldn’t be so interested in the enlightenment provided.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #304 - 06/05/24 at 01:39:07
 
That clunking noise sounds terrible, but it's actually typical of a Savage left side main bearing.  If that is a metric test indicator, your excursions are right at .004".  Given where you have the indicator located, that's just a little bit more than a brand-new bearing.  To get any sort of reasonable measurement, you need to have the indicator located right next to the inner race of the bearing.  With the indicator located way out on the alternator rotor, your readings are about double, so you actually only have about .0020" to .0025" radial play.

A new bearing has about .0015" clearance (.0381mm).

Why didn't you check that bearing clearance when the alternator rotor, starter gear, and flywheel were removed.  With that stuff off the crank, you can get the test indicator right next to the bearing race.

Also, you can't check the flywheel by simply grabbing it with your hand.  The nut has a Belleville washer behind it, so the flywheel can feel tight even when it is loose.  The only way to check is to get a socket wrench on the nut and verify correct torque (somehwere on the order of 110 ft-lbs).  You need a flywheel holding tool to verify proper torque.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #305 - 06/05/24 at 01:41:40
 
Pretty cool feeler gages.  Nice job.  I hate adjusting valves on this engine.  You need three extra hands.
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #306 - 06/05/24 at 09:56:44
 
Mike, thanks for your never ending attention and support.

The reason for not checking the clearance closer to the actual bearing is that I did not get that far in disassembling the engine. When I , perhaps erronously, concluded that the flywheel was seated solid on the crankshaft, I went along and tested the clearance. The sound was enough to leave me with the impression that I had found the culprit. My lack of actual experience with cumbustion engines, and their associated bearing clearances led me to conclusions learned from my knowledge about machine tools, where such clearances are unheard of. Machine spindles, for example, run hot but still have pre loaded bearings with zero play. (In fact, the pre load is often evaluated by measuring the temperature rise over time at a rated RPM)
So live and learn, I will now dig my way into the flywheel and retorque the nut to make sure it is not the reason for the clonking sound, and then perhaps the chase goes on.

I got the RycaShawn front brake mounted, and tested a bit. It works great and looks the part. Only connoiseurs will notice it. When the pads bed in totally, and I get a fresh break hose mounted, it will be perfect.
The 2 holes where the bracket mounts to the fork has to be threaded and that aircraft allu is tough as nails. A fresh tap that has not yet cut steels is recommended.

Cheers, Finn Hammer
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #307 - 06/06/24 at 10:36:55
 
The extractor for the alternator rotor.

I called the local Suzuki dealer if they have one, and if I could perhaps rent it for a couple of hours.
Considering his prompt NO!, that was probably a stupid question.
He checked with Suzuki Denmark, if they had it in stock, another negative, but then the price was an alarming 642USD, so I would have passed on it anyway.
Instead I found this one on Ebay, they seem to ship real fast, so I will only have to wait a bit over the weekend to get it. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124564606776?itmmeta=01HZQ62JVKKH22FDFEM33VY3GC&ha...

Btw, I got the carburettor (36mm Mikuni from Lancer) jetting dialled in nicely, so that I can now even drive downhill, in a city environment and close the throttle with confidence, meaning that the crackle, sputter and kaboom is now a thing of the past, just the deep rumble from the exhaust. The way it is supposed to be.

Idle jet: #17.5
Airscrew 2.5 turns out.
Needle all the way up: clip in the lowest groove
Main jet #200

Cheers, Finn Hammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #308 - 06/06/24 at 11:29:13
 
I'm surprised you don't need a bigger main jet on your hotrod.  The clip in the lowest position (richest) isn't surprising, but it is interesting that you had to go that far.

Did you try a 210 or 220 main jet with the clip moved up a groove?  It just seems like you should need a bigger main jet for the beast!
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #309 - 06/06/24 at 12:09:52
 
Paul,

That may be the way to go in the future, but for now I am mainly concerned with the behaviour of the bike when toddeling around town. If I get to do prolonged mileage at higher speeds, then I can start to evaluate the need for a bigger main jet.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #310 - 06/06/24 at 12:10:49
 
ThumperPaul wrote on 06/06/24 at 11:29:13:
I'm surprised you don't need a bigger main jet on your hotrod.  The clip in the lowest position (richest) isn't surprising, but it is interesting that you had to go that far.


Fuel in different parts of the world can have entirely different specifications and act entirely different.

Jetting for US gasoline may (or may not) be what works in Denmark.  

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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #311 - 06/28/24 at 02:02:49
 
All,

The tedium of waiting for the right tools proved to be a prolonged ordeal, due to customs intercepting of the parcel from now no longer EU England.
However, with the tools at hand, the challenge had just started.
The bolt holding the generator rotor seemed to be impossible to unscrew. The impact driver was unable to loosen the bolt.
In the end I grabbed the most sturdy spanner I have, the Cross Wheel Wrench I use when I change wheels on the car, and extended one of the perpendiculars with a 1 meter long pipe, and finally the bolt budged, but remained very tough to turn untill finally all the way out, and it is a very long bolt!
Turns out, it was given liberal amounts of locktite.
I cannot understand why this should be necessary on a keyed taper joint, but what.
From this point it was easy to get to the nut holding the flywheel in place, and this nut was solid.
The tool to test this was made from a short 50mm socket, which I first faced on the lathe, to remove the generous chamfer, so that it could get a full grip on the nut. This big socket needs a 3/4" driver, so I welded a 30mm 1/2" socket to it, but before that, I turned the 3/4" hole up  to fit snugly on the taper of the crank journal, which is a benefit because then the spanner does not tilt or kink, but sits solid on the nut when applying torque to it.
Lesson of the day: Unlike the delicate internals of the right side engine cover, on the left side, the cover conceals some rather crude stuff, where the heavy tools come into play. I have been here, I have seen the size of the starter clutch set, and it is not a place I wish to revisit anytime soon.

So the hunt for the clonkin' continues, but since the engine is running strong still, and has neither seized nor blown up, I guess I'd better get accustomed to it.

One big benefit would be the possibility of purchasing the flat top piston in oversize so that it could be fitted to a pristine freshly bored and honed cylinder, instead of to the odd already worn stock 94mm bore.

Cheers, Finn Hammer
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FinnHammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #312 - 06/28/24 at 02:52:09
 
The winter tuning effort is being planned.
There is for a small fortune of tools in this hand, but it is what needs to be purchased in order to test the validity of claims that a 5 angle valve job is really all that better than the standard 3 angle job.
What you also see is one of the 35mm inlet valves I intend to fit, and the copper template cut to be able to measure the  bottom relief angle of the stock valve job, which turns out to be 75 / 45 / 30deg.
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #313 - 06/28/24 at 02:52:47
 
I am proposing a 75 / 60 / 45 / 30 / 15 deg. job.
Here is a comparison of the 2 valve jobs, the proposed one highest on the drawing.  The blue line shows the 30deg back cut, the green line is the stock valve seat, the magenta line is the new, hopefully much better job.

I overlay the green stock valve job to show the differences, including that although the new valve is bigger, it will not sit higher on the seat.
Given the amount of shrouding around the stock seats, which I think sits at least 1 mm too deep in the casting, I am considering fitting new seats, to advance the valves one millimeter into the combustion chamber. Clay tests will be mandatory, but then, they would be anyway.

Cheers, Finn Hammer
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Re: Finn Hammer's Savage
Reply #314 - 06/28/24 at 04:26:29
 
I'm very curious what your fllowtester thinks of the 5 angele valve seat. I expect quite a lot from that. Smiley

I would grind the rear cut of the valve like this first:



Then the airflow is pointed a bit less frontal on the valve seat and that could benefit the flow.

And you can then remove a little more to see whether the situation improves or not.
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Do what you know is right. (you can always use fear as a counselor later)
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