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So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain (Read 95 times)
Tocsik
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So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
08/09/23 at 19:12:43
 
It's not a scary or dangerous sound to my ear. Not a rattle or anything. Best described is "I can hear the sound of a chain rolling in a relatively normal way", on the right side of the bike, near the top end. It does speed up and slow down with RPMs, and isn't really heard at idle.

The sound just started in the last few weeks and I'm at 28.6K miles. Most of my rides are about 50 minutes each direction commuting (27 miles or so; because traffic) with other rides going anywhere from 2-3.5 hours in the mountains. I don't do real short hops.

I know the best move, and likely the recommendation from ya'll experts, is to open it up and have a look. But if it's most noticeable from the top end, I don't know how much I can see. I've been in the lower right side a couple times. Once to install the 'slavy CCT at the #2 position (at 10K miles) and once to replace the clutch cam that broke. Other than adjusting the valves, I don't have experience with the top end of the motor. I'm hoping this doesn't mean I need to replace the cam chain and the guides.

Also hoping I'll hear, "Naw dog, you're cool. The cam chains get a little noisy later in life, but nobody has had to replace one earlier than 30K miles." Doubt that's what I'll get.

Thanks in advance for advice.
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'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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verslagen1
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #1 - 08/09/23 at 22:29:45
 
Judging from the miles (10k 2nd hole) 20k total would be expected if you rode the same way as the 1st life.
But you started doing long miles and you should get an additional 20/30K miles from that.

Really hard to judge what you should be getting as a total when most of the damage was acquired during the 1st life.

I would take a look at it, the failure mode for a verslavy is going to be different than stock as you're not going to hear the same death rattle.  The chain will become loose instead as the tensioner hits the stop.

So pop the clutch cover and take a peek.
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #2 - 08/13/23 at 07:40:41
 
I'm about to get inside the clutch cover to take a look. What info and pictures would be the most useful to get the best advice regarding the cam chain status?

I've been reading a lot of threads on cam chain replacement and frankly, those posts have me terrified of doing that job. The issues with clutch basket removal, the small pin that falls out, oil pump gear on backwards, etc. I'm not afraid to try stuff, but when I read these posts, I get a lot of doubts.

Some of the discussions have me believing the tensioner guides are more the issue than actual chain stretch. Has that been narrowed down to just the  main tensioner guide? And can someone direct me to what is considered the best thread on replacing the chain and that guide? I have my cardboard box prepped with the outline of the clutch cover for the bolts.
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verslagen1
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #3 - 08/13/23 at 08:24:32
 
Tocsik wrote on 08/13/23 at 07:40:41:
I'm about to get inside the clutch cover to take a look. What info and pictures would be the most useful to get the best advice regarding the cam chain status?

anything out of the ordinary
Quote:
I've been reading a lot of threads on cam chain replacement and frankly, those posts have me terrified of doing that job. The issues with clutch basket removal, the small pin that falls out, oil pump gear on backwards, etc. I'm not afraid to try stuff, but when I read these posts, I get a lot of doubts.

so you're aware of the stuff that can be screwed up, that's why we post them so you know what to check and check again.
Quote:
Some of the discussions have me believing the tensioner guides are more the issue than actual chain stretch. Has that been narrowed down to just the  main tensioner guide?

the front guide is straight and well supported... generally is not a problem.
the rear guide is curved, and covered in heavy plastic. I've only seen 1 report where the plastic has fallen off (and clogging the oil pump intake) but I've seen the chain wearing a path that's not straight on the guide. Best to inspect and ask.
Quote:
And can someone direct me to what is considered the best thread on replacing the chain and that guide? I have my cardboard box prepped with the outline of the clutch cover for the bolts.

the best? really they're all good.  each has different issues and deals with them.  best to read them all and follow the one that's best for you.
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #4 - 08/13/23 at 10:41:20
 
Huh. Could this be right? I can't find my post where I posted about the data when I installed the 'slavy cct mod. It was out 19.6 mm at 10K miles. I don't have a notation on where it was sitting with the CCT installed at the 2nd hole, but it's measuring 8mm at 28.6K.

I double checked the info here and it doesn't sound like it needs to be measured at a particular position in the cycle, TDC or anything.
Seems like I should just button her up and the ride the snot out if it!
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CCT_at_28_6K.jpg

'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #5 - 08/13/23 at 10:41:44
 
Here's the chain.
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timing_chain_at_28_6K.jpg

'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #6 - 08/13/23 at 10:42:03
 
One more.
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CCT_and_chain_at_28_6K.jpg

'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #7 - 08/13/23 at 11:03:02
 
Here's the back of the right side chain guide
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cam_chain_guide_28_6K.jpg

'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #8 - 08/13/23 at 11:04:15
 
and then just an overall
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inside_clutch_cover_at_28_6K.jpg

'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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verslagen1
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #9 - 08/13/23 at 12:18:10
 
Tocsik wrote on 08/13/23 at 10:41:20:
Huh. Could this be right? I can't find my post where I posted about the data when I installed the 'slavy cct mod. It was out 19.6 mm at 10K miles. I don't have a notation on where it was sitting with the CCT installed at the 2nd hole, but it's measuring 8mm at 28.6K.

I double checked the info here and it doesn't sound like it needs to be measured at a particular position in the cycle, TDC or anything.
Seems like I should just button her up and the ride the snot out if it!


Checked my records, looks like it's been in there 8 years.

From 19.6 @10k to 8.0 @28.6k sounds like you're doing great and good to keep going.

But since you got it open, I would consider checking the chain for any stiff links.
Remove the tensioner and feel the chain over the rear guide giving each one a flex.
Then rotate the crank a little to access a fresh section and repeat.
Stiff link would be an indication that it's time to replace.
It's rare that a chain breaks, but it does happen.
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #10 - 08/13/23 at 16:43:27
 
Gotcha. Thanks.

To remove the tensioner, I need to put a folded zip tie in the hole first, right? Same as when someone moves it from position 1 to position 2? I haven't found photos from the how-to guides. Probably that whole Photobucket Phiasco.
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #11 - 08/13/23 at 17:52:11
 
if you haven't yet, download the companion photos

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1199986392

yeah, stick something in the hole, but because of the pin and slot it won't shoot across the room.
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Tocsik
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #12 - 08/13/23 at 18:22:52
 
For the life of me, I could not expose any sort of hole to insert a zip tie, or anything else.
I released the pawl and compressed the plunger many times ( dang, that little spring is STIFF!) but never found an opening. So I had the distinct displeasure of fighting that plunger spring while attempting to get the shoulder bolt back in the threads, and the shoulder through the tensioner tab. I don't recommend this to anyone looking for a bit of fun.
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'08|Raptor|Dyna|Stock jets & no other carb changes @ 5280' alt|'slavy CCT|Kawa front pulley|130/90 rear tire|7" LED headlight|3" straight risers|FIAMM El Grande horns|Mutazu hard bags
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #13 - 08/13/23 at 19:01:53
 
The zip tie goes between the pawl and the aluminum tensioner body.  You have to compress the spring all the way and then let it relax just slightly while you push the plastic zip tie in between the pawl and the aluminum body.  That holds the pawl in place and locks the plunger so you can install the assembly.  Once installed, you pull the zip tie out to release the pawl.  The best position to check the CCT extension is when the intake valves are about half-way open.  Remove the intake valve cover and observe the rocker arms as you rotate the engine.  

This is where the zip tie goes to lock the pawl.
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Tensioner_Installation_Lock.jpg

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justin_o_guy2
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Re: So, I'm "hearing" my cam chain
Reply #14 - 08/16/23 at 19:10:41
 
Crankshaft direction is with the wheels.
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