SuzukiSavage.com - Lab or natural?

WebsterMark

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Lab or natural?
05/11/21 at 04:59:58

Long and complicated read, but worth the effort.

The CliffNotes version is the source of SARS-CoV-2 is more likely to be from the lab as opposed to a natural jump from animals. Couple the science facts outlined in the article with the political objection to any possibility the lab was the source and it seems highly likely that’s where it came from.

The last few paragraphs bring a familiar name into the conversation so it will be interesting to see our defenders of Democracy provide cover for their chosen one.

https://thebulletin.org/2021/05/the-origin-of-covid-did-people-or-nature-open-pa
ndoras-box-at-wuhan/

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Eegore

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #1 - 05/11/21 at 06:09:58

It is good that more information is coming forth.

Here are some of the references in full from this article as well as some of my own research.

Original grant information and requests.

https://grantome.com/grant/NIH/R01-AI110964-06

https://grantome.com/grant/NIH/R01-AI110964-04

Shi's NLM document:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7097006/

Easy breakdown by Yuri Deigin:

https://yurideigin.medium.com/lab-made-cov2-genealogy-through-the-lens-of-gai...

An older, but yet to be refuted analysis of the lack of natural transfer chain.

https://arxiv.org/abs/2005.06199

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MnSpring

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #2 - 05/11/21 at 09:16:49

(From the link originaly posted)

The best was:

Quote:

“…Chinese authorities. China’s central authorities did not generate SARS2, but they sure did their utmost to conceal the nature of the tragedy and China’s responsibility for it. They suppressed all records at the Wuhan Institute of Virology and closed down its virus databases. They released a trickle of information, much of which may have been outright false or designed to misdirect and mislead. They did their best to manipulate the WHO’s inquiry into the virus’s origins, and led the commission’s members on a fruitless run-around. So far they have proved far more interested in deflecting blame than in taking the steps necessary to prevent a second pandemic….”

“… The worldwide community of virologists. Virologists around the world are a loose-knit professional community. They write articles in the same journals. They attend the same conferences.
They have common interests in seeking funds from governments and in not being overburdened with safety regulations….”

“…Virologists knew better than anyone the dangers of gain-of-function research. But the power to create new viruses, and the research funding obtainable by doing so, was too tempting. They pushed ahead with gain-of-function experiments. They lobbied against the moratorium imposed on Federal funding for gain-of-function research in 2014, and it was raised in 2017…”

“… This seems to mean that either the director of the NIAID, Anthony Fauci, or the director of the NIH, Francis Collins, or maybe both, would have invoked the footnote in order to keep the money flowing to Shi’s gain-of-function research. … “

“… In conclusion. If the case that SARS2 originated in a lab is so substantial, why isn’t this more widely known? As may now be obvious, there are many people who have reason not to talk about it. The list is led, of course, by the Chinese authorities. But virologists in the United States and Europe have no great interest in igniting a public debate about the gain-of-function experiments that their community has been pursuing for years…”

Nor have other scientists stepped forward to raise the issue. Government research funds are distributed on the advice of committees of scientific experts drawn from universities.
Anyone who rocks the boat by raising awkward political issues runs the risk that their grant will not be renewed and their research career will be ended.
Maybe good behavior is rewarded with the many perks that slosh around the distribution system. … “

Golly Gee Wally,
Is that not what a WHOLE BUNCH of people
have been saying since day ONE!

Oh, but wait for it.
(Just like the Vicar of Dibley and the ‘duck’)
The SPIN is coming !

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Eegore

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #3 - 05/11/21 at 09:59:28

I think the difference is people on day one knew the answer before they knew the question which is a convenient way to go about knowing things.

People on day 365 are providing evidence that people from day 1 never needed, but are using now to prove how right they were. Good thing that somebody else went out and got something useable beyond conjecture.

If only nobody ever wanted proof of anything then we could just save all this time using real things in the real world and instead just go back to assigning blame without evidence.

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WebsterMark

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #4 - 05/11/21 at 10:31:36

Just watched Fauci redefine terms in an effort to claim US Government funding played no direct role in the research that seems to have a high probability of being the source of this particular virus.

Look, I don’t believe anyone intended for a designed and engineered virus to escape particularly since those most likely to be infected would be the researchers themselves and Fauci, for all his faults, wouldn’t want to be linked to this. But based on the article (which I haven’t seen factual objections to) it appears perhaps at best US officials were foolish to trust a Chinese lab to do work they funded and at worst, wanted the data but purposely looked the other way, maybe with fingers crossed.

Will we ever conclusively find out? Hard to say. As the article points out, because President Trump repeated the logical assertion that the virus probably originated in Wuhan lab, and the media, hell-bent on destroying Trump, immediately championed the natural infection route through a bad theory. As we know, the main stream media is not going to admit they were wrong so it’s guaranteed that this article will get shut down as quickly as possible.

Thank God for Tucker Carlson and a few other honest media types not afraid to put information out.

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Eegore Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 8006	Re: Lab or natural? Reply #5 - 05/11/21 at 11:34:21 Can you reference the article?
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MnSpring

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #6 - 05/11/21 at 12:23:22

Quote:

Eegore wrote on 05/11/21 at 09:59:28:

I think the difference is people on day one knew the answer before they knew the question ...

I think many people knew the answer, on day one,
BECAUSE OF:

…seeking funds from governments…
…awkward political issues runs the risk that their grant will not be renewed…
…led the commission’s members on a fruitless run-around…
...Fauci redefine terms...
…media, hell-bent on destroying Trump…
...did their utmost to conceal the nature of the tragedy and China’s responsibility for it...
... designed to misdirect and mislead...
...did their best to manipulate the WHO’s inquiry ...
...led the commission’s members on a fruitless run-around...

The truth has taken this long.

But hey,
get a 'shot'
and watch a farting duck on TV,
all is good.

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .

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Serowbot

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OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #7 - 05/11/21 at 12:49:42

WebsterMark wrote on 05/11/21 at 10:31:36:

Thank God for Tucker Carlson and a few other honest media types not afraid to put information out.

Fox News won a court case by 'persuasively' arguing that no 'reasonable viewer' takes Tucker Carlson seriously
https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-karen-mcdougal-case-tucker-carlson-2...

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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh

...

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Eegore

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #8 - 05/11/21 at 13:11:03

I think many people knew the answer, on day one,
BECAUSE OF:

…seeking funds from governments…
…awkward political issues runs the risk that their grant will not be renewed…
…led the commission’s members on a fruitless run-around…
...Fauci redefine terms...
…media, hell-bent on destroying Trump…
...did their utmost to conceal the nature of the tragedy and China’s responsibility for it...
... designed to misdirect and mislead...
...did their best to manipulate the WHO’s inquiry ...
...led the commission’s members on a fruitless run-around...

The truth has taken this long.

That would make sense if the claims were made after, not before these things happened or were researched.

Maybe someday we can get rid of needing evidence for all those claims and just go back to holding people accountable by opinion alone.

Anyone can claim every virus that makes the news is manufactured, and then when evidence is found by people who do not think conjecture is equal to truth, they just use that evidence and say they were right all along. This is equal to saying everyone has a dead father named John and then using obituaries other people put together to cherry-pick the ones that fulfil that prediction.

Even now we don't actually know. But at least there is evidence that has a direct nexus to the virus.

Media that is anti-Trump is not proof of a manufactured virus.

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MnSpring

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #9 - 05/11/21 at 14:10:46

Quote:

Serowbot wrote on 05/11/21 at 12:49:42:

Fox News won a court case by 'persuasively' arguing that no 'reasonable viewer' takes Tucker Carlson seriously...

I See, so your view is:

... no 'reasonable viewer' takes Tucker Carlson seriously ...

YET,
I am to believe, and take seriously,
Colbert, Kimmel, Maddow, Maher, Matthews, Sharpton, Anderson, DeGeneres, (and a subject of a Monarchy), just to name a few,
as if it was God’s word.

Opps, the word God does not work for the people that believe in, not believing.
OK let’s try, ‘Gospel’,
Opps again, another, ‘bad’, reference.

So I am suppose to believe them
(and others like them),
simply because I have been, TOLD TO !

OK Got It.

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .

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eau de sauvage Serious Thumper Offline Posts: 2565 Queensland Gender:	Re: Lab or natural? Reply #10 - 05/11/21 at 14:50:43 Welcome back Mark. lol.
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WebsterMark Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 12846 Gender:	Re: Lab or natural? Reply #11 - 05/11/21 at 16:07:40 Eegore wrote on 05/11/21 at 11:34:21: Can you reference the article? What article? I saw online, Cspan I think. I’m sure it’s on the news.
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WebsterMark

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #12 - 05/11/21 at 16:10:23

Serowbot wrote on 05/11/21 at 12:49:42:

WebsterMark wrote on 05/11/21 at 10:31:36:

Thank God for Tucker Carlson and a few other honest media types not afraid to put information out.

Fox News won a court case by 'persuasively' arguing that no 'reasonable viewer' takes Tucker Carlson seriously
https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-karen-mcdougal-case-tucker-carlson-2...

That’s not true, a false allegation that’s been disproven.

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MnSpring

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #13 - 05/11/21 at 17:20:23

Quote:

Eegore wrote on 05/11/21 at 13:11:03:

"... Maybe someday we can get rid of needing evidence for all those claims and just go back to holding people accountable by opinion alone ... "

Already their.
Read any, 'RED', laws,
or proposed 'RED' laws. ?

One person hates Firearms, also hates a person,
POOF, that person's guns are GONE,
On the OPINION, of one person.

(As the, 'experts' all side on the accusers side,
because they all are of the, OPINION,
Firearms are bad)

How did that saying go;
If you were accused of being a Witch, you were thrown in the water.
If you drowned, you were not a Witch.
If you did not drown, then you were a Witch,
and burned at the stake !
LOLLOLOLOLOLOLOL

But let the Spin, Spin !

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .

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Eegore

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Re: Lab or natural?
Reply #14 - 05/11/21 at 20:01:27

Already their.
Read any, 'RED', laws,
or proposed 'RED' laws. ?

I mean the examples you provided about the topic in this thread and specifically those examples.

I can bring up any other topic and say it's "like" this. In this case it would be like a neighbor calling in a Red Law event, the cops come take a guy's guns and then the guy goes and stabs his girlfriend to death. The person who called in the Red Law then uses this event to say how right they were about him not having guns, an then says the proof was mainstream media being anti-Trump.

In context of C-19 and people saying they "knew" it was manufactured using the research of people that needed evidence to form an opinion is literally something anyone can do. Anyone can claim things with no evidence and then use the work of others to validate their stance.

At best it's a guess. News programs that are anti-Trump are not proof that a disease is manufactured.

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