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Poll Poll
Question: What's you psi? If you have access to a gauge.

more than 170 less than 190  
  0 (0%)
more than 160 less than 170  
  0 (0%)
more than 150 less than 160  
  2 (40%)
more than 140 less than 150  
  0 (0%)
more than 130 less than 140  
  1 (20%)
more than 120 less than 130  
  2 (40%)
more than 110 less than 120  
  0 (0%)
more than 100 less than 110  
  0 (0%)




Total votes: 5
« Last Modified by: eau de sauvage on: 04/23/18 at 02:25:39 »

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Cylinder PSI (Read 253 times)
eau de sauvage
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Cylinder PSI
04/23/18 at 02:17:18
 
Mine was 125 with 20k kms and well looked after so I'm now wondering how many bikes are actually above the min spec.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #1 - 04/23/18 at 07:44:00
 
I'm never gonna know.
I can't get caught up with stuff that needs done.
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DragBikeMike
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #2 - 05/06/18 at 13:59:21
 
2016 LS650, 1150 miles, 155 psi
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #3 - 05/06/18 at 19:09:02
 
Might want to ask more specifics, such as stock or hi compression piston?
Carb off?
Stock carb?
With a CV carb, even with the throttle open all the way, the slide sits down. Prob get a lower reading than with a slide carb.
Warm or cold?
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #4 - 05/06/18 at 21:42:00
 
What Me Worry ? start your bike ,does it pour out smoke or fuffs when you shift? if the answer is no,  you have compression. Clymer gives the range of acceptable pressure as 140to 200 psi (a 29% swing) ,and there are to many things that can change your results ,battery charge /condition, valve settings ,air cleaner ,exhaust , intake ,oil weight/temperature, cam wear , camchain age,to name a few . I don't sweat if I have compression and I don't waste time checking it . If your bike runs normally but you do a test and the pressure doesn't measure up to what the book said ,are you really going to waste the time and money to rebuild the top end? I rather be riding!
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eau de sauvage
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #5 - 05/07/18 at 00:32:36
 
@Batman, still you'd think that a bike that's just done 1000 odd miles would be at least in the high end of the spec range rather than the bottom end.

@Armen, good point about the slides, however the specs would certainly be for a stock slide.

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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #6 - 05/07/18 at 01:00:36
 
Good point about the CV carb and slide not opening during cranking.  If the spec is genuine Suzuki, then it should take that into account.  If the spec is something Clymer just pulled out of their XXX, then the spec is worthless.  I generally don't worry too much about the spec because my scooters don't remain stock much more than a 1000 miles or so.  I use the compression test to keep track of my personal setup, and to also evaluate changes to that setup.  For instance, if I change my cam I am usually concerned about the effect on cranking pressure.  If the intake valve closes later then cranking pressure may go down.  How much?  Will it hurt my low end power?  If the intake closes earlier the cranking pressure may go up.  How much?  Will I have a problem with starting or detonation.  Its a good tool that will help you understand your particular engine setup and also diagnose problems.

I posted my cranking pressure on this survey because I took the reading on a basically stock engine with very low mileage.  I figured it might help some members evaluate their own engine condition compared to essentially a brand new engine.

The comments about listing all the details about a particular engine are excellent.  I should have elaborated on my post and went on to state that it was a stock engine.  My apologies to all.

Never look a gift horse in the mouth.  If used properly, compression readings can be very beneficial.  The key is to know all the specifics on the engine under test (stock, modified, what mods, mileage, etc.).  And of course, if you are taking the readings on your own engine, and keeping track of them, and recording all the mods and conditions at the time of the readings, you can learn a whole bunch of good stuff.
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #7 - 05/07/18 at 16:28:22
 
DBM with a DR cam I would expect to see a compression test with lower pressure, with valve overlap the exhaust valve is also open. I don't think you'll notice any less low end torque/hp  , if your using the DR cam with a stock piston, the cam dino's for the DR still show the torque peak at around 3400-3500 just like the stock cam . I think you would have to go to a larger piston (with 10.5 ; 1 compression) before you see a higher peak torque , somewhere between 3500 and 4000 rpm, and some low end losses.  
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« Last Edit: 05/07/18 at 21:15:45 by batman »  

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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #8 - 05/08/18 at 02:54:11
 
FWIW, I always do a leak down test along with a compression test. Had a few times where tired rings allowed oil to sneak by, carbon up the top end, and make for a 'high compression' motor. Leak down test then shows that the rings are pooped.
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eau de sauvage
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #9 - 05/08/18 at 05:12:40
 
@Armen,

If a motorcycle is barely using any oil, say 300ml over 6000kms, would that indicate that rings are OK? Or can they still be a bit worn.
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #10 - 05/08/18 at 08:15:44
 
EDS ,Chances are the oil that's missing went to your air box via the crank case breather tube , where it gathered or was ingested by the carb.  losses of this nature are greater as speed increases (Highway speeds) but is quite normal for the Savage. and your doing a compression test on your bike with barely 1000 miles on it ,perhaps your not aware that your rings aren't considered to be fully seated until you pass 1500 miles. you need to ride more and sweat the small stuff less.
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« Last Edit: 05/08/18 at 09:22:39 by batman »  

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DragBikeMike
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #11 - 05/08/18 at 12:14:28
 
Quote:
DBM with a DR cam I would expect to see a compression test with lower pressure, with valve overlap the exhaust valve is also open.


I'm not sure what you are getting at Batman.  Valve overlap occurs at the end of the exhaust stroke.  It should have no effect on cranking pressure.  Intake closing point determines how many degrees of crank rotation are left to compress the fresh charge of air.  Close the intake at BDC and you have 180 degrees of crank rotation to compress the charge.  Close the intake at 20 degrees ABDC and you have 160 degrees of rotation to compress the charge.  Close the intake at 48 degrees ABDC (stock cam) and you have 132 degrees of crankshaft rotation to compress the charge.  Close the intake valve at 42 degrees ABDC (DR cam) and you have 138 degrees of crankshaft rotation to compress the charge (6 degrees > than stock).  How does the valve overlap event that occurs at the end of the exhaust stroke affect the compression stroke?

Regarding low end torque, my stock engine dyno run showed 30.5 max HP, Suzuki says it makes 31 HP so I'm pretty comfy with the results of the dyno pull.  I think it was accurate.  The stock engine made 30 ft-lbs at 2000 rpm.  The guy in Finland with the DR cam in a 692cc engine and 10.?:1 compression makes 25 ft-lbs at 2000 rpm.  That's 5 ft-lbs less low end torque.  I attribute that to the valve overlap.  The intake & exhaust are swappin holes at low speed.  Fresh charge is running out the exhaust.  Also, he runs a straight pipe so there is most likely quite a bit of reversion during overlap (sonic wave running back up the pipe, through the open valves, and back out the carb).

I put that DR cam in my engine over the weekend and have been fiddling around with it.  Of course I checked compression before and after.  It was interesting.  To my surprise, it didn't change a bit (155 psi before, 155 psi after).  Since I had the head cover off and the cam out, I checked the stock cam timing.  It's a bit different than what I recorded when I checked it through the valve covers with everything together.  That's understandable since you have to fight the valve springs and alternator, and access doesn't permit optimum placement of the measuring instruments.  I will be posting an update to the valve timing data I previously posted.  For this discussion, we only need to know the intake closing point, which is 48 degrees ABDC for the stock cam, and 42 degrees ABDC for the DR cam.  The 6 degrees of additional rotation did not increase compression pressure.

Keep in mind that as the piston moves further up away from BDC, the movement accelerates (the piston moves further for each degree of rotation).  At some point, the intake valve closing is going to start having a significant effect on compression pressure.  That point is obviously somewhere past 48 degrees ABDC.

I can tell you this much for sure, the DR cam does not produce low end torque like the stock cam.  The stock cam pulls harder at slow speed on surface streets.  The DR cam comes into its own on the freeway.  I'll post the results shortly.
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #12 - 05/08/18 at 21:46:43
 
Mike , your right ,there is no neg. sonic wave in the exhaust at cranking speeds ,so it would have little or no effect on a compression test(my bad). but I agree that the DR cam is going to do it's best work at higher rpm due to the overlap which allows the neg .wave to pull the last remaining exhaust gases from the cylinder as well as helping to pull a fresh charge in, something the stock cam can't do because it has no overlap.reversion is only caused by the piston moving up for the compression stroke and the intake valve still open .
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #13 - 05/09/18 at 09:49:42
 
It seems everyone knows more about this than I do, but it seems to me that turning the crank 90* from BDC gets it to TDC,
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Re: Cylinder PSI
Reply #14 - 05/09/18 at 12:07:05
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 05/09/18 at 09:49:42:
It seems everyone knows more about this than I do, but it seems to me that turning the crank 90* from BDC gets it to TDC,


I would be more apt to bet on 180 degrees of the crank (90 degrees on the cam).
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