SuzukiSavage.com - Clutch slip cure.

Gyrobob

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Re: Clutch slip cure.
Reply #30 - 09/12/12 at 18:03:24

arteacher wrote on 09/12/12 at 15:57:13:

"Another helpful thing with airplane engines is the practice of hand propping them over a few times before start attempts. It "limbers" them up, and also as a fringe benefit makes sure there isn't a hydrostatic lock."
To the best of my knowledge, which is limited, this is only necessary if the engine is a rotary, or inverted. This is because some oil will settle in the cylinders and cause hydro lock if you don't first cycle the motor to get the oil out of the cylinders. This is one of the reasons that these engines smoke like mad when they are first started up- the oil is burning off in the exhaust manifold.

This is one time when your limited knowledge is correct. Wink

BTW, the term is "radial" not "rotary",.... unless you are talking WWI. Some of those dudes flew behind engine/prop assemblies where the entire engine rotated with the prop,... yep, a "rotary" engine... the prop was fastened to the crankcase, and the crankshaft was fastened to the firewall. Think of the gyroscopic loads!!!!

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buffyporson YaBB Newbies Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 13	Re: Clutch slip cure. Reply #31 - 09/13/12 at 18:27:02 Still using cheap 20/50. But now the clutch works great. Kinda thought this might help others with slipping savage clutches rather than become a debate on engine oil.
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Gyrobob Serious Thumper Offline Posers ain't motorcyclists Posts: 2571 Newnan, GA Gender:	Re: Clutch slip cure. Reply #32 - 09/13/12 at 19:41:38 Why does it work great now?
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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Clutch slip cure.
Reply #33 - 09/13/12 at 21:11:21

buffyporson wrote on 09/09/12 at 06:54:53:

I have tried numerous ways to stop clutch slip on my Savage. Stronger springs, 'performance' plates, washers under springs etc. I finally think I have found something which works long term. I placed an additional plain (not friction) clutch plate in the basket. This results in a slightly thicker clutch pack which pre-tensions the springs more when everything is assembled. I put the extra plate between the inner most friction plate and the pressure disc. Shouldn't really matter where it goes though as long as it has a friction disc on one side. Results in a slightly heavy clutch action but really makes a difference during hard acceleration. I found a bunch of plain clutch plates on ebay. You only need one and they never wear out.

Here is your source material.

Sounds like he used the "wrong" 20w50 oil, had slippy clutch issues, did fixes (several) and is telling others who follow the same path a way out of the woods that only requires tearing the side case down and adding "Stronger springs, 'performance' plates, washers under springs etc. I finally think I have found something which works long term. I placed an additional plain (not friction) clutch plate in the basket. This results in a slightly thicker clutch pack which pre-tensions the springs more when everything is assembled"

The alternatives are:

1) use the right oil in the first place (easiest)
2) tear the plates out of the clutch, clean and sand them, then use the right oil from then on (tough, but tough love is tough)
3) continue using the wrong oil and do all of the above in blue text as he has discovered a way to use the wrong oil and keep the clutch from slipping.

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SALB

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Re: Clutch slip cure.
Reply #34 - 09/13/12 at 21:18:19

Oldfeller--FSO wrote on 09/13/12 at 21:11:21:

buffyporson wrote on 09/09/12 at 06:54:53:

I have tried numerous ways to stop clutch slip on my Savage. Stronger springs, 'performance' plates, washers under springs etc. I finally think I have found something which works long term. I placed an additional plain (not friction) clutch plate in the basket. This results in a slightly thicker clutch pack which pre-tensions the springs more when everything is assembled. I put the extra plate between the inner most friction plate and the pressure disc. Shouldn't really matter where it goes though as long as it has a friction disc on one side. Results in a slightly heavy clutch action but really makes a difference during hard acceleration. I found a bunch of plain clutch plates on ebay. You only need one and they never wear out.

Here is your source material.

Sounds like he used the "wrong" 20w50 oil, had slippy clutch issues, did fixes (several) and is telling others who follow the same path a way out of the woods that only requires tearing the side case down and adding "Stronger springs, 'performance' plates, washers under springs etc. I finally think I have found something which works long term. I placed an additional plain (not friction) clutch plate in the basket. This results in a slightly thicker clutch pack which pre-tensions the springs more when everything is assembled"

The alternatives are:

1) use the right oil in the first place (easiest)
2) tear the plates out of the clutch, clean and sand them, then use the right oil from then on (tough, but tough love is tough)
3) continue using the wrong oil and do all of the above in blue text as he has discovered a way to use the wrong oil and keep the clutch from slipping.

3) continue using the wrong oil and do all of the above in blue text and see how long it takes to start slipping again.

I wonder how many extra clutch plates will fit in the pack???? Roll Eyes

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Clutch slip cure. Reply #35 - 09/13/12 at 23:15:58 Ill wait for the " My clutch throwout broke" report.
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Cavi Mike Serious Thumper Offline Thumper n00b Posts: 1005 Rochester, NY Gender:	Re: Clutch slip cure. Reply #36 - 09/13/12 at 23:52:44 Gyrobob wrote on 09/13/12 at 19:41:38: Why does it work great now? x2
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JohnBoy

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Re: Clutch slip cure.
Reply #37 - 09/14/12 at 11:28:02

Quote:

Chalk up another car oil 20-50w "clutch slipper" on my list of Why Clutches Slip

Oldfeller wrote extensively on clutches including adding additional plates a couple of years ago. I consider him to be very reliable.
OF what was your informed opinion about adding an additional plate to a clutch pack? Did you have to make any additional mods?

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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Clutch slip cure.
Reply #38 - 09/14/12 at 11:53:25

Stock, relatively unworn, there is enough room for an extra steel plate (barely). But remember, this is your throw-out stroke room you are using up with that extra steel plate thickness.

(thus Justin's comment about over stressing the powdered steel throw-out eccentric as he is hitting a solid metal-to-metal lock up with his clutch lever motion)

You cannot put in the steel and a fiber until you go through the longer Suzuki rod and at least one custom cut longer rod. This takes a LOT of miles, more miles than I have done yet anyway. When your current rod is longer than the stock rod by the combined width of a steel and a fiber, you have enough working room to put them in.

So, discovery is pending ..... for now anyway.

The stock clutch when used with an appropriate oil and the appropriate push rod replacement is proving to be VERY DURABLE and long lived.

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