SuzukiSavage.com - Adventures in carb land

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Adventures in carb land
03/30/09 at 06:54:55

Well Sunday I decided I would install the jets I got. My bike is an 88 LS650, stock airbox and harley muffler. I think the baffle may be missing from the harley (never had a harley muffle before). I can look right through it. Seems to have some mesh stuff around the inside walls. Taking the carb off was a real PITA, had to remove the whole battery box to get enough room to pull it back and out.

Once the carb was apart I realized it was a miracle the bike ran as well as it did. There was junk and gunk everywhere. Horrible, I should have taken pictures. Anyway what was going to be a simple rejet turned into a strip and dip. I had to it was wicked nasty Sad

On re-assembly I went with a #55 pilot, a #155 main, and three washers (in place of the white spacer). Put it all back together and the bike wouldnt run for crud. Had to hold the throttle open to get some wretched running. I shut it off and dropped the bike, literally lol. The kickstand wasnt down Tongue

I head back inside and flip through the manual to figure out where I went wrong. WHOOPS! I put the diaphragm on the side in wrong! I went cover, diaphragm, spring. It was supposed to be cover, spring, diaphragm Sad

I ran outside, swapped it around and the bike sounded much better. It was late so I couldnt mess with it much more and went inside. This morning I adjusted the mixture screw and rode the bike to work. Sounds better, I think it may be rich, needs some tuning. I have almost no popping and good throttle response but idle isnt the best. I am having one little problem.

Bike wont run on "on" only "Pri", I put on all new fuel, vacuum lines. I checked them and they look ok. If I put it on "on" the bike sounds like it is not getting any gas and then dies out.

Any ideas?

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

diamond jim

Serious Thumper

Offline

Posts: 1425
North Alabama
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #1 - 03/30/09 at 07:14:30

Asssuming the petcock is fine, it sounds like your vacuum line is leaking. Either a hole along the hose or a crack on the end. Dirt and grime was probably keeing it sealed and moving/cleaning the hose opened it up. Get a new one. But to test it you could pull it, wrap the last inch on each end with electical tape, rub vaseline into the rubber really good to seal any pinholes, wipe it off and try it again.

Did the new #55 pilot jet have little bleed holes?

Yes, your muffler has had the baffle plate removed.

Back to top

IP Logged

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #2 - 03/30/09 at 07:27:48

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:14:30:

Asssuming the petcock is fine, it sounds like your vacuum line is leaking. Either a hole along the hose or a crack on the end. Dirt and grime was probably keeing it sealed and moving/cleaning the hose opened it up. Get a new one. But to test it you could pull it, wrap the last inch on each end with electical tape, rub vaseline into the rubber really good to seal any pinholes, wipe it off and try it again.

I put all new lines on including vacuum when I put it back on. I think I will pull it off the gas tank and put my thumb over the end to see if I am getting any suction.

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:14:30:

Did the new #55 pilot jet have little bleed holes?

Hmmm, not sure. I got them from Lancer.

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:14:30:

Yes, your muffler has had the baffle plate removed.

Yea thats what I figured.

Thanks!

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

diamond jim

Serious Thumper

Offline

Posts: 1425
North Alabama
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #3 - 03/30/09 at 07:33:37

Did the new line fit the nipples suggly? I ask cause I hade gotten some new line last week to change mine out and it fit but was not quite as snug as the stock line. My stock line is back on til I can find some better fitting line.

Next freebie is to tighten the 4 screws on the back plate of the petcock. This has helped some members.

Back to top

IP Logged

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #4 - 03/30/09 at 07:49:16

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:33:37:

Did the new line fit the nipples suggly? I ask cause I hade gotten some new line last week to change mine out and it fit but was not quite as snug as the stock line. My stock line is back on til I can find some better fitting line.

Hmmm good call on that one. Its clamped nicely at the carb but not at the tank cause there is no friggin room. I will check that out tonight thanks. The tank is the worst design for these bikes ever. Its to small it doesnt hold enough gas and its a real PITA to get off and on Sad

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:33:37:

Next freebie is to tighten the 4 screws on the back plate of the petcock. This has helped some members.

Cant hurt to give it a whirl if the clamp doesnt solve the problem. Thanks!

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28780 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Adventures in carb land Reply #5 - 03/30/09 at 07:58:21 Thanks for not taking pictures of horrifying creeping crud. You might need hose clamps, tie wraps work. Also, if the carb was that bad, maybe the petcock is full of crud too. Remember, the diaphram is not a replaceable item, be very gentile.
Back to top	Versey's Place Tech Section Index IP Logged

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #6 - 03/30/09 at 08:03:41

verslagen1 wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:58:21:

Thanks for not taking pictures of horrifying creeping crud. Grin

You might need hose clamps, tie wraps work.
Also, if the carb was that bad, maybe the petcock is full of crud too.
Remember, the diaphram is not a replaceable item, be very gentile.

Yea I am going to give that a shot tonight. Or maybe I will run to the hardware store on my lunch break and see if I can add a clamp without moving the tank.

I checked on the Diaphragm and they are both still available, 35.74 for the little side one and 89.37 for the big one. Or were you talking about a different one?

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28780 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Adventures in carb land Reply #7 - 03/30/09 at 08:25:50 [quote author=7C7E63657065787E7F110 link=1238421295/0#6 date=1238425421]verslagen1 wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:58:21: I checked on the Diaphragm and they are both still available, 35.74 for the little side one and 89.37 for the big one. Or were you talking about a different one? diaphram in petcock
Back to top	Versey's Place Tech Section Index IP Logged

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #8 - 03/30/09 at 08:47:27

[quote author=293A2D2C333E383A316E5F0 link=1238421295/0#7 date=1238426750]Mortation wrote on 03/30/09 at 08:03:41:

verslagen1 wrote on 03/30/09 at 07:58:21:

I checked on the Diaphragm and they are both still available, 35.74 for the little side one and 89.37 for the big one. Or were you talking about a different one?

diaphram in petcock

Ahh yes true. But now that I looked into it for $60 I may just swap it out for a new one if I cant get the clamp to solve the problem. I can run on Pri for a couple weeks till I can spare $60

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

Max_Morley Serious Thumper Offline LT650 Luxury Touring & sidecar rig Posts: 1490 Moses Lake. WA Gender:	Re: Adventures in carb land Reply #9 - 03/30/09 at 09:12:07 Any chance you have switched an overflow vac line with the one on the manifold? Valve wouldn't work if that happened. As I recollect they are the same size and unless you still have the original line with a wound wire cover they would be easily confused. Max
Back to top	Max at Thumper Acres. '96 Savage bagger, '03 Savage w/Cozy sidecar for wifeni. IP Logged

Mortation

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 205

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #10 - 03/30/09 at 09:14:07

Max_Morley wrote on 03/30/09 at 09:12:07:

Any chance you have switched an overflow vac line with the one on the manifold? Valve wouldn't work if that happened. As I recollect they are the same size and unless you still have the original line with a wound wire cover they would be easily confused. Max

Good thought but nope. They are all connected properly, I double checked them. I am thinking Jim is right about it not being sealed so I am going to try that first.

Back to top

1988 LS650 - Candy Apple Red w/ Ghost Flames, Harley muffler, S40 seat, white spacer Mod, #55 pilot, #155 main.

IP Logged

marine5317

Full Member
Alliance Member

Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 181
Lecanto,FL
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #11 - 03/30/09 at 18:05:15

Hope this helps. Mine is an 07 and I got my jet kit from Lancer. I got rid of the white spacer and used the 3 little washers from the kit. Here is where I made my mistake. I OVER-JETTED! I talked with Lancer and he told me to go back to the oringal pilot and down to the#150 main. I follwed his instructions and it runs perfect. I stay up at 60-62 mpg. And like you I am running a H/D Dyna muffler

Ride Safe
Marine 5317

Back to top

IP Logged

diamond jim

Serious Thumper

Offline

Posts: 1425
North Alabama
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #12 - 03/30/09 at 19:26:34

Speaking of over-jetted, I went back to my 52.5 pilot. I was running a 55 pilot with bleed holes. It seemed too rich. But the 52.5, although it seems to idle and decel better, it also brings the backfire back. I mentioned a few times here about trying a 55 with no bleed holes. I've been having trouble finding one that I was "certain" would work. I can find them for Mikuni carbs but they are always listed for VM carbs. Will those work in our CV carbs?

Back to top

IP Logged

LANCER

Serious Thumper
Alliance Member

Offline

Savage Beast
Performance Parts

Posts: 10606
Oklahoma
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #13 - 03/31/09 at 04:46:26

diamond jim wrote on 03/30/09 at 19:26:34:

Speaking of over-jetted, I went back to my 52.5 pilot. I was running a 55 pilot with bleed holes. It seemed too rich. But the 52.5, although it seems to idle and decel better, it also brings the backfire back. I mentioned a few times here about trying a 55 with no bleed holes. I've been having trouble finding one that I was "certain" would work. I can find them for Mikuni carbs but they are always listed for VM carbs. Will those work in our CV carbs?

A #55 pilot jet for a VM carb will flow more fuel than a #55 pilot jet made for the stock CV carb. A while back I accidently put some of the VM pilots in the JETSETS and caused a bunch of folks problems with tuning their engines.
It is now quite apparent that many people are having difficulty in figuring out whether to use a #52.5 or #55 pilot, since many engines seem to be on the proverbial fence between the two. Because of that I have started to include a new #52.5 pilot in the JETSET to help make the tuning job a little easier. Having new jets on both sides of that fence makes for a more level playing field. It is possible and not uncommon to find that an engine will need the pilot air adjusting screw set at 2-2.5 turns out with the #52.5 pilot, while it needs only .5-1 turn out with the #55 pilot. It is possible to have equivalent fuel flow from both setups and good engine operation. Of course, for correct tuning it is necessary for all passageways in the carb to be clear and functional, otherwise correct tuning is impossible.

Back to top

IP Logged

diamond jim

Serious Thumper

Offline

Posts: 1425
North Alabama
Gender: male

Re: Adventures in carb land
Reply #14 - 03/31/09 at 05:20:40

Yep, that's exactly what I experienced- pilot air adjusting screw set at 2-2.5 turns out with the #52.5 pilot (occasional light decel backfire still present), while it needs only .5-1 turn out with the #55 pilot (just a tad too rich at idle).

Lancer, do you have any #55 jets for the stock carb with no bleed holes? PM and I'll paypal you.

Back to top

IP Logged