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Carb tune advice needed (Read 12 times)
cmbmw
Ex Member
Carb tune advice needed
02/07/07 at 15:39:44
I am trying to cure the sluggishness/flat/poor throttle response condition on my wife's Savage. It pulls strong as long as the RPM's are up, and idles fine. I am also not chasing any popping on decel or shutdown. Just looking to improve power and driveability.
I am familiar with re-jetting, and members here have told me how to deal with the white spacer, so my questions are;
Is there a formula that's generally accepted as a good starting point? Say main jet X, pilot Y spacer Z?
Has anyone ever dyno'd their bike with an exhaust gas analyzer and gotten good results? Say a nice flat F/A ratio in the 12.3 range? If so, would you be willing to share the specifics of your set up? (jettting, spacer etc.)
I ride an EFI Harley that you tune with a computer. I might see if the custom shop down the street from me will give a 2fer deal on the dyno. If I do, and end up with a good tune, I'll post the results and specifics here.
Thanks to you all. This is a great forum.
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Reelthing
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Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #1 -
02/07/07 at 18:19:34
don't know that word expert may have run um all off!
We can give it try - first is the bike completely stock ? and was it made in '95 or later (older bikes had a different carb)
Are you near sea level or up in the hills?
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sparkett
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Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #2 -
02/07/07 at 18:20:05
look in the teck section for Lancers carb tuning thread. He is the best at carbs. I even got good at it from these guys
take off battery cover and air connection, twist , tilt and bing! its out.
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1987 pet thingy, dyna muffler,dyna jet carb,K&N cone filter, still working on her!
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cmbmw
Ex Member
Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #3 -
02/07/07 at 18:44:38
Reelthing wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
don't know that word expert may have run um all off!
We can give it try - first is the bike completely stock ? and was it made in '95 or later (older bikes had a different carb)
Are you near sea level or up in the hills?
Thank you for responding. I took your advice and changed the subject line.
Bike is stock, it's a '96, and I'm 30 miles from the Atlantic Ocean so sea level is close enough. I see some ideas in your sig line.
Thanks.
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cmbmw
Ex Member
Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #4 -
02/07/07 at 18:54:24
sparkett wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
look in the teck section for Lancers carb tuning thread. He is the best at carbs. I even got good at it from these guys
take off battery cover and air connection, twist , tilt and bing! its out.
Thanks for the suggestion. I have read pretty much all I could find already. Just looking for recommendations from people who have done it on where to start in terms of jet / spacer sizing.
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Brewbrother
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Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #5 -
02/07/07 at 19:04:03
cmbmw wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
Thanks for the suggestion. I have read pretty much all I could find already. Just looking for recommendations from people who have done it on where to start in terms of jet / spacer sizing.
my sig line says it all. I can generally see the gulf from my house.
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Opportunities multiply as they are seized.
No spacer,60 pilot jet, 155 main jet, plug door, sportster muffler, k&n drop in, iridium plug, brake pedal mod,de-badged, Dunlops, bullet turn signals.
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cmbmw
Ex Member
Re: Carb tune expert advice needed
Reply #6 -
02/07/07 at 19:13:38
Brewbrother wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
my sig line says it all. I can generally see the gulf from my house.
Do you think I'd be running rich if I used your set up with the stock muffler? I see you're running a Sporty muffler.
Thanks
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Reelthing
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #7 -
02/07/07 at 21:48:57
likely the 155 would be a bit much for stock - should have a 145 in it if no has changed it - going up to around a 147.5 or 150 might be where to start - but the main really feeds 3/4<>WOT - the height of the needle effects the midrange that we are adjusting by hacking the spacer in half because we no longer have multi groves in the needle to move the c-clip - unless you do the dynajet kit - and the mixture screw controls the low end - where a general starting place is 1.5 to 1.75 turns out from a light seat.
where is the flat spot?
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cmbmw
Ex Member
Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #8 -
02/08/07 at 05:14:35
It's pretty flat all the way through the low end and midrange. If you go through the gears easily it feels sluggish the whole way. If you keep the revs up and delay shifts a bit it pulls pretty good. Based on what you've told me I think it makes sense to start with the mixture screw and spacer and see what effect that has. What are your thoughts on the pilot jet? Best left alone?
Thanks for the advice.
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Dynobob
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #9 -
02/08/07 at 06:20:04
cmbmw wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
What are your thoughts on the pilot jet? Best left alone?
Since you're in there, I'd go up one size on the main jet (147.5), go with 1/2 spacer, and skip the pilot jet. The 1/2 spacer will take care of most of your performance issues.
What muffler and what intake mods you've done determine your starting point. Since you're near sea level, altitude isn't relevant.
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Savage_Rob
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #10 -
02/08/07 at 07:10:35
Reelthing wrote
on 12/31/69 at 16:00:02:
likely the 155 would be a bit much for stock - should have a 145 in it if no has changed it - going up to around a 147.5 or 150 might be where to start - but the main really feeds 3/4<>WOT - the height of the needle effects the midrange that we are adjusting by hacking the spacer in half because we no longer have multi groves in the needle to move the c-clip - unless you do the dynajet kit - and the mixture screw controls the low end - where a general starting place is 1.5 to 1.75 turns out from a light seat.
where is the flat spot?
My thoughts exactly.
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1998|MAC muffler|ceramic coated header|K&N air filter|Amal Mk2 carb|Odyssey battery|iridium plug|NC windshield|Dunlop 491s|Superbrace|EBC brake rotor|12.5" Progressive shocks|Kuryakyn ISO grips
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cmbmw
Ex Member
Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #11 -
02/08/07 at 18:48:43
I'm at sea level, intake and exhaust are stock. My plan going in, based on your collective wisdom, is as follows;
Main jet 147.5
Spacer 1/2
Pilot untouched
Mixture 1.5 to 1.75 turns out
Everybody concur?
Thank you all very much for taking the time to help me out. I'll let you know how this formula works out.
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Reelthing
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #12 -
02/08/07 at 19:52:52
Sounds like a good place to start - you'll have to adjust on the mixture screw maybe 1/8 a turn or less at time after it gets warmed up until you find the sweet spot
if your going to do the work your self - read very careful about it - those are very soft screws - they should be replaced with s/s allen head - and the little ones at the bottom of the slide are #1 phillips - use a new/good tip
and have the slide clean when it goes back in - also inspect the diapharm for any pin holes or rips,etc....
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Savage_Greg
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #13 -
02/08/07 at 20:25:02
Actually the generally accepted Fuel/Air ratio is 14.7 to 1.
I learned that as a jet engine mechanic in the Navy (way back when). Always stuck with me...
More info? Go here...
Fuel Air
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barry68v10
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Re: Carb tune advice needed
Reply #14 -
02/09/07 at 03:38:30
A fuel/air ratio of 14.7:1 is the ideal stoiciometric ratio as Greg stated for pure gasoline air mixture. However, max power is usually achieved between 13.1:1 and 14.1:1. Ratios above 14.7, up to about 16:1 will decrease power but increase mpg, but watchout...the leaner the mixture, the hotter the burn, and 16:1 can burn valves and cylinder heads. Again, richer is better, especially in an air cooled engine. If I can get an exhaust/gas analyzer, I'll try to tune to 13.5:1.
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petc0ck mod, white spacer removed, 150 main jet, 12.5" shocks, 16" turnout muff, oil cooler mod, chain conversion, Tkat brace, external fuel filter, fuel screen removed...
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