SuzukiSavage.com - opinions on white spacer and richening carb

slavy

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #15 - 05/01/05 at 09:06:53

Russ,
There are couple of rules about the carburetor operation.
1.The mixture screw under the plug and the pilot jet determine how the bike works at idle. The Savages are set as lean as possible just before the bike starts to missfire. Enrichenning this cirquit helps with the cold start and reduces the backfire when You descell .
2. The redusing of the spacer thickness will help 1/4 trottle - 3/4 trottle / basically the most usable range/.
3. The main jet will determine how the bike is running at "open trottle".
This is a simplified explanation of the carb operation. In the real life this is not a full truth, because this cirquits overlap.
Anyway- if You don't think You ride the bike at full trottle- You might not change the main jet. If You don't care about the lean missfire at descell or for You the bike is idling perfect and responding to the trottle from idle RPMs the way You want - don't touch this cirquit.
If You concider that it is too complicated to deal with the white spacer and You just like a nice slow cruise with a jentle acceleration - then just leave the bike alone.
I have found only one post against the mods- John D claimed "stock rocks".
So far everybody here agrees that the carb mods are well worthed the time /and the $3 for the bigger main jet/.
For me the wistling sound of a stock 96 exhaust sucks, but You like it , so everybody has an oppinion. If You are a very busy person and if You like the bike the way it is-don't touch it.

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Russ

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Reply #16 - 05/01/05 at 15:47:28

Well i wasn't brave enough to grind down the existing white spacer or anything, so i used a rubber O-ring that is about half the thickness. Put that in place and turned out the air mixture screw 2 full turns. I was leary as to wether this mod would actually do anything, but after a quick burn i definetly notice a difference in 2nd and 3rd gears. Especially when leaning on the throttle after just shifting into 2nd. It now sounds like it's getting the gas it was missing but it really sounds like it's thirsty for more air. Maybe i'll change my mind and do the exhaust and put a k&n in.....or maybe i'll just start by changing the jet to a 150 and see what happens. Anyway, for the 20 minutes it took to do it was worth it. Isn't any worse that's for sure. Hardest part of anything on this bike is that darn tank. I don't have to remove the "pet-thingy"

on mine but I do have to hop on one foot and bite my tongue while i lift and pull at just the right place on the tank.

Anyway thanks for all the help everyone. Think I'll just enjoy the week riding before I start in with 100 questions on mufflers........what did people do before the internet and boards like this anyway????

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Russ Guest	Baron's tachs Reply #17 - 05/01/05 at 15:51:14 Forgot - can anyone clarify the "single fire ignition" on the Baron's tach? Are extra components needed for the Savage? thanks
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bentwheel

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #18 - 05/01/05 at 20:10:20

Good job on your carb tuning Russ. Did you get that warm, fuzzy feeling after you shut her down?
As far as the single fire ignition is concerned, I am not entirely confident my answer is correct, and if not, I am sure someone will confirm or correct me. I think it refers to ignition systems that fire only once on compression stroke during the four cycle process. Some engines fire twice during the cycle and the second spark is considered a wasted spark as it occurs when the exhaust valve is open. Harley Davidson uses this method and it adds to their distinctive exhaust note. I may be wrong here but I think the Savage also has a wasted spark. This second spark interferes with the tach signal unless it is processed electronically.

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LANCER Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Savage Beast Performance Parts Posts: 10606 Oklahoma Gender:	Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb Reply #19 - 05/01/05 at 20:21:07 When I bought my tach something was said about the possibility of needing some kind of electronic adapter, so I bought it along with the tach. When I hooked the tach up it worked OK so did not need the adapter.
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Reelthing Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Fish or ride that is the question Posts: 5397 Houston,Tx Gender:	Re: Baron's tachs Reply #20 - 05/02/05 at 04:42:08 russ wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:05: Forgot - can anyone clarify the "single fire ignition" on the Baron's tach? Are extra components needed for the Savage? thanks Nothing is needed for the tach to work on Savage - you may end up needing to shield the wires at the coil if it bounces around enough to bother you
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Reelthing

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #21 - 05/02/05 at 05:07:12

bentwheel wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:05:

As far as the single fire ignition is concerned, I am not entirely confident my answer is correct, and if not, I am sure someone will confirm or correct me. I think it refers to ignition systems that fire only once on compression stroke during the four cycle process. Some engines fire twice during the cycle and the second spark is considered a wasted spark as it occurs when the exhaust valve is open. Harley Davidson uses this method and it adds to their distinctive exhaust note. I may be wrong here but I think the Savage also has a wasted spark. This second spark interferes with the tach signal unless it is processed electronically.

My understanding that is correct - and true of most singles anyway - they fire like a 2-stroke engine because of the pulse trigger off the crank they fire each time the piston goes to tdc (or 8-12 deg before whatever the advance) and the spark box is not built to skip a beat - so the tach is.

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Reelthing Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Fish or ride that is the question Posts: 5397 Houston,Tx Gender:	Re: Done Reply #22 - 05/02/05 at 05:38:22 russ wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:05: ........what did people do before the internet and boards like this anyway???? We broke a lot more stuff some really expensive stuff
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russ_g Ex Member	Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb Reply #23 - 05/02/05 at 07:37:36 Thanks for the info on the tach guys. Think I'll see if i can get them to ship one to Canada. As far as the "warm fuzzy feeling".... ya felt good.
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mornhm - FSO

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #24 - 05/02/05 at 07:59:26

Kinda highjacking this thread back to asking for opinions. I have a 2004 Savage (almost new). It seems to start fine when cold (32 degrees last week & 39 degrees this morning - fired right up - couple of seconds on full choke - then down to 1/2 choke and then done with choking). It also hasn't backfired at all. It does kinda "putt putt" when backing off the throttle while shifting but nothing major. Accelerates fine in all gears up to 65 mph (fast as I've ridden it). I would have thought the lean mixture problems for starting would have been more severe the colder the air/engine temperature. Will backfiring only show up when the weather gets warm or after riding the bike hard?

Did I get lucky? Did something change recently in the factory tuning? Or am I just not real picky (I'm not looking for snap my head back power)? What are the efficiency ramifications of the mods being discussed here (what will it do to my gas mileage)?

Thanks

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Reelthing Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Fish or ride that is the question Posts: 5397 Houston,Tx Gender:	Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb Reply #25 - 05/02/05 at 08:38:54 how much elevation you have to go with that 32deg?
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russ_g

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #26 - 05/02/05 at 09:35:43

mornhm - you pretty much described my bike. Mine rarely backfired. Usually only when warm and only when letting off the throttle fast. Sometimes when I turned off the bike I'd get a quiet "thwoomp" from the pipe. But if you weren't on the bike or close you probably wouldn't have heard it.

I was more interested to see if the mod would help performance at all. And I agreed with a post from the board a while back, that an engine is an engine is an engine and if it's tuned right for it's environment then there should be no backfiring.........so anyway backfiring aside, I have noticed an improvement in performance as i described above. Plus I just like to tinker. One of the main reasons I've decided to keep a relatively simple bike like the Savage. 2 months ago I knew what a carb did but had never looked at one in detail or heaven forbid taken one apart. Now I have a much better understanding of what goes into making one work.

Try the mod. If you're worried, keep the white spacer aside and use an O-ring like i did. Don't even have to remove the carb to get at the white spacer. Worst case scenario is you put the spacer back in. It's pretty obvious by how the engine runs at idle if you're making the right adjustments on the mixture screw so that's an easy step there as well.

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mornhm - FSO Serious Thumper Offline HMMM Posts: 1105 Gender:	Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb Reply #27 - 05/02/05 at 10:32:48 Reelthing - 750 ft (Central Illinois) Barometer 30.1 Russ_g - did you pay any attention to your gas mileage? Do you have before/after mod data?
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russ_g Ex Member	Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb Reply #28 - 05/02/05 at 10:39:07 No - i've only been riding it for a day. But, to be honest at $8 (~ 89 cents/litre.....you imperial guys will have to do the math) to fill, it could halve it and i would still be happy.
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Mr 650

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Re: opinions on white spacer and richening carb
Reply #29 - 05/03/05 at 14:20:27

I read here (Greg, I think) that the Savage is a "wasted spark" ignition and a tach will read wrong.
I believe you have set it to "2 cyl".

bentwheel wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:05:

Good job on your carb tuning Russ. Did you get that warm, fuzzy feeling after you shut her down?
As far as the single fire ignition is concerned, I am not entirely confident my answer is correct, and if not, I am sure someone will confirm or correct me. I think it refers to ignition systems that fire only once on compression stroke during the four cycle process. Some engines fire twice during the cycle and the second spark is considered a wasted spark as it occurs when the exhaust valve is open. Harley Davidson uses this method and it adds to their distinctive exhaust note. I may be wrong here but I think the Savage also has a wasted spark. This second spark interferes with the tach signal unless it is processed electronically.

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SilverBlue '01,K&N,Snorklectomy,125mm NOS carb, 1/2 spacer & 155, 'Trapp, NC flyscreen, Suzy GelSeat, Osram H4
later..putt. Putt, PUtt, PUTT! 8)
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