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2026 HD sprint??? (Read 352 times)
MMRanch
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #45 - 11/10/25 at 19:50:37
 
Thats a nice looking bike !  Wink
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #46 - Yesterday at 08:08:02
 
[quote author=656B6863070 link=1761228835/30#44
What can a 2026 HD Sprint do that a Savage can not ? [/quote]


I like riddles!  How about:

Be less than 20 years old?
Have a spare parts supply that isn't steadily dwindling and increasing exponentially in cost?
Honestly wear an H.D. badge?

There's probably a lot more valid answers, but we won't know, until the H.D. actually exists.

To your point though, I think the Suzuki might be the best comparable for what H.D. claimed the Sprint is supposed to be.  The S40's MSRP was ~$5800 in the last year of production, which was 2019.

I wonder if perhaps Suzuki might not reprise the engine, in an EFI fueled form, like they did turning the GZ250 engine into the TU250.  Of course, first we'd probably need to see more success in this middle weight segment, like respectable sales performance after introduction of the HD Sprint.

And, there's a few other irons in the fire;

Rumors of a Honda half liter:  https://www.cycleworld.com/motorcycle-news/honda-gb500-retro-roadster-planned...

And Triumph is already selling their Speed 400 in the USA:
https://www.triumphmotorcycles.com/motorcycles/classic/speed-400/speed-400-2024
Triumph Speed 400: 398cc Single, 89 x 64 bore x stroke, liquid cooled, 39.5hp, 27.7 ft-lb torque @ 6500, $5500 and up MSRP

The Triumph may not be a long stroke tractor engine like the Royal Enfield 350, but it does have substantial torque output starting as low as 2000 rpm.  At 4000 rpms, the dyno result is showing us 21 ft-lb.  That's 28.5 N-m, more than the R.E. 350.
https://www.cycleworld.com/bikes/triumph-speed-400-dyno-test-2024/
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #47 - Yesterday at 10:19:54
 


MMRanch wrote on 11/10/25 at 19:50:37:
Thats a nice looking bike !  Wink



Thanks..    I don't think it's worth buying any new bike these days when used good as new used ones can be had for a pittance.    

I just bought this like new 2004 Honda Shadow with 5500 kms on the clock for $3700 Canadian.  






It would not be difficult to install a sidecar on it.  Wink


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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #48 - Yesterday at 12:03:59
 
Axman88 wrote on Yesterday at 08:08:02:
[quote author=656B6863070 link=1761228835/30#44
What can a 2026 HD Sprint do that a Savage can not ?


I like riddles!  How about:

Be less than 20 years old?
Have a spare parts supply that isn't steadily dwindling and increasing exponentially in cost?
Honestly wear an H.D. badge?

There's probably a lot more valid answers, but we won't know, until the H.D. actually exists.

To your point though, I think the Suzuki might be the best comparable for what H.D. claimed the Sprint is supposed to be.  The S40's MSRP was ~$5800 in the last year of production, which was 2019.

I wonder if perhaps Suzuki might not reprise the engine, in an EFI fueled form, like they did turning the GZ250 engine into the TU250.  Of course, first we'd probably need to see more success in this middle weight segment, like respectable sales performance after introduction of the HD Sprint.

And, there's a few other irons in the fire;

Rumors of a Honda half liter:  https://www.cycleworld.com/motorcycle-news/honda-gb500-retro-roadster-planned...

And Triumph is already selling their Speed 400 in the USA:
https://www.triumphmotorcycles.com/motorcycles/classic/speed-400/speed-400-2024
Triumph Speed 400: 398cc Single, 89 x 64 bore x stroke, liquid cooled, 39.5hp, 27.7 ft-lb torque @ 6500, $5500 and up MSRP

The Triumph may not be a long stroke tractor engine like the Royal Enfield 350, but it does have substantial torque output starting as low as 2000 rpm.  At 4000 rpms, the dyno result is showing us 21 ft-lb.  That's 28.5 N-m, more than the R.E. 350.
https://www.cycleworld.com/bikes/triumph-speed-400-dyno-test-2024/ [/quote]

I think you misunderstood the question. The question was what can a 2026 HD Sprint do that a Savage can not do ?


PS I see lots of spares for Suzuki Savages.    I don't see any for a HD sprint.
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #49 - Yesterday at 14:40:34
 
[quote author=454B4843270 link=1761228835/45#48
I think you misunderstood the question. The question was what can a 2026 HD Sprint do that a Savage can not do ?

PS I see lots of spares for Suzuki Savages.    I don't see any for a HD sprint.
[/quote]

I gave you three valid answers.  The 2026 HD Sprint is, of course, hypothetical at this point, and may never exist.  You won't find ANY parts for it, until it actually goes into production and is available for sale.

The Suzuki Savage was discontinued in 2005, when it was replaced by the S40 Boulevard, which was produced until 2019.

IF the Sprint comes into existence, it will be brand new, while any Savage will be at least 21 years old, hence my response, "be less than 20 years old" is true.  Flippant, perhaps, but true.

Parts supply for the LS650 may not be a problem now, 6 years after production ceased, but consider that the drive belt, which was only ever used on this model, is already $300 for a "new" one,  (Probably actually new old stock and sitting in a warehouse since at least 2019), and price is more than $150 for a used belt, taken off a parts bike.  Wear parts, or those prone to corrosion, that were used only on this model, will be the most problematic to find, ten years down the road.  Of course, the HD might be just as bad, or worse, it is entirely in the future.

And "Honestly wear an HD badge" is even more flippant, but also true.

Another likely difference, will be substantially superior fuel economy for the HD, since it will almost certainly be EFI.  Of course, this is just speculation until the Sprint actually exists, but consider that.
The LS650, with its 31hp, gets about 48mpg, on average:  https://www.fuelly.com/motorcycle/suzuki/ls650_savage

The Harley XG500 "Street", with 33.5 hp, gets about 57 mpg, on average:
https://www.fuelly.com/motorcycle/harley_davidson/xg500_street_500

And the Harley X440, rated 27 hp, manages around 76 mpg.

Naturally, we'd expect a larger cruising range, if fuel efficiency goes up.  The LS650 tank capacity is pretty stingy.  I'm lucky if I can get 100 miles before hitting reserve, but my riding is almost entirely city, stop and go.

How much did you spend on your LS650?  Is it indeed a Savage, or is it a newer Boulevard S40?  I certainly agree with you about not wanting to buy new, when so many good used bikes are available, but, I can't buy them used, unless they get manufactured and sold as new.
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #50 - Yesterday at 15:15:27
 
 At 4000 rpms, the dyno result is showing us 21 ft-lb.  That's 28.5 N-m, more than the R.E. 350.  

 Not True   !   The RE 350-J engine is 27 Nm at 4000 rpm  ,
https://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Royal_Enfield/royal_enfield_meteor_35...

https://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/triu/triumph-speed-400-2024.html

Lets keep it honest here guys.  Wink  It has 11 Nm more at that  "all wound up" RPM .

The RE 350-J engine is happy at 2000 ... HP rating = 6100rpm   No need to wind up more than 5000 rpm , like a milder/softer Savage engine .  5750 rpm = 75mph w stock gearing.




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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #51 - Yesterday at 16:02:29
 
Axman, you seem to differentiate the Savage and S40 from each other, and if so, you need to know that there is no difference. Suzuki simply made a name change.  In 2004 it was Savage, and in 2005 it was S40.  It was still the LS650 model.  All parts are exactly the same.
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #52 - Yesterday at 18:24:53
 
MMRanch wrote on Yesterday at 15:15:27:
 Not True   !   The RE 350-J engine is 27 Nm at 4000 rpm  ,

It's quite true.  The Speed 400 is making 21 ft-lbs, which is 28.5 N-m, at 4000 rpm.   28.5 is more than 27.  Did you look at the power curve for the Speed 400 I posted a link to?  Just because the Speed 400 makes even more torque at higher rpm, and gets rated at that higher rpm, doesn't mean it isn't making substantial torque down low.

I could have written my statement more clearly, but the comma was there for a reason.  Sorry for the confusion.

If you look on the RE forum, you can find a stock dyno curve for a "J" 350, although this info seems pretty scarce.

I honestly haven't ridden either model, but I own an RE Classic 500, UCE, which has quite a bit more low end torque than either the Speed 400, or the RE "J" 350.  That one is rated 41.3 Nm @ 4,000 rpm.   And, of course, I have my LS650, which is rated 50 Nm at 3,400 or thereabouts, so is the winner of the sub $6K MSRP singles in that regard.  Of course both of these are now out of production, which  generally takes a bike off the comparison list, at least from the perspective of professional reviewers.

If we don't take the old bikes off the list, we'll have to include Beull Blasts from 20 years ago, and BSA singles from 50 years ago, and it's very difficult to calculate torque ratings for bikes from back in the day, before manufacturers started publishing those numbers.

I do agree with what you are saying, torque from idle on up, is awesome.  And, according to what I've read, the Speed 400 has it, and perhaps deserves to be considered in company with this hypothetical, $6K Harley.   It definitely makes the price cutoff.
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #53 - Yesterday at 19:02:04
 
LANCER wrote on Yesterday at 16:02:29:
Axman, you seem to differentiate the Savage and S40 from each other, and if so, you need to know that there is no difference. Suzuki simply made a name change.  In 2004 it was Savage, and in 2005 it was S40.  It was still the LS650 model.  All parts are exactly the same.

I'd say that all parts are not "exactly" the same for all models.  Clearly something changed if the Height and Width specs. both change.  
https://bikeswiki.com/Suzuki_LS650_Savage_(Boulevard_S40)
The handlebar was changed, at some point the seat height was apparently changed, and there were various cosmetic changes.   I see different wiring diagrams and different jetting for different carb series numbers in the manual for different years.  And, of course, the earliest Savages were 4 speeds.  Suzuki was tweaking stuff.

But even if Suzuki changed nothing else, they DID change the name.  They were all LS650s, but, before 2005, Suzuki called them "Savage" and afterward "Boulevard S40", so that's what I do.  That's what is on the badge, that's what is on the title.  If it's OK to call a bike built 2005 or after, a "Savage", then I assume it is just as OK to call a 1986 an "S-40", and everything gets even more confusing.

Which is why I call mine,  "Suzuki LS650".
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #54 - Yesterday at 22:36:42
 
Axman88 wrote on Yesterday at 19:02:04:
LANCER wrote on Yesterday at 16:02:29:
Axman, you seem to differentiate the Savage and S40 from each other, and if so, you need to know that there is no difference. Suzuki simply made a name change.  In 2004 it was Savage, and in 2005 it was S40.  It was still the LS650 model.  All parts are exactly the same.

I'd say that all parts are not "exactly" the same for all models.  Clearly something changed if the Height and Width specs. both change.  
https://bikeswiki.com/Suzuki_LS650_Savage_(Boulevard_S40)
The handlebar was changed, at some point the seat height was apparently changed, and there were various cosmetic changes.   I see different wiring diagrams and different jetting for different carb series numbers in the manual for different years.  And, of course, the earliest Savages were 4 speeds.  Suzuki was tweaking stuff.

But even if Suzuki changed nothing else, they DID change the name.  They were all LS650s, but, before 2005, Suzuki called them "Savage" and afterward "Boulevard S40", so that's what I do.  That's what is on the badge, that's what is on the title.  If it's OK to call a bike built 2005 or after, a "Savage", then I assume it is just as OK to call a 1986 an "S-40", and everything gets even more confusing.

Which is why I call mine,  "Suzuki LS650".


PMSL  Grin
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #55 - Today at 07:49:29
 
  RE Classic 500, UCE, which has quite a bit more low end torque than either the Speed 400, or the RE "J" 350.  That one is rated 41.3 Nm @ 4,000 rpm.  

Hay Axeman

I'm regretting not getting one of the UCE 500cc  when they were new !  
 
I've been watching the Honda GB500 and hope it's the SINGLE CYLINDER , air/oil cooled engine.  That would be a bike to replace both the bikes I have now (Meteor and Interceptor).   Till Honda gets it to the market here in the States , I'll keep what I've got.   I suspect Honda will go with the twin engine ... then I'll just keep what I've got now for a long time.  

I might have to go look at the 440 Harley when it gets here ?  If the 350-J engine had just a bit more cruise at 70mph in it  then I'd have no need of the Interceptor ...  Where is that "Perfect Bike" ?  Grin

I was ridding with these fellers ( east TN) and was pushing the Meteor to keep up on the strait sections but making it up in the curves.  

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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #56 - Today at 15:38:18
 
MMRanch wrote on Today at 07:49:29:
[highlight]
I was ridding with these fellers........ 



From my experience in life.....I would say that one of those folks is not a "feller"! Grin
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #57 - Today at 17:14:58
 
Dave wrote on Today at 15:38:18:
MMRanch wrote on Today at 07:49:29:
[highlight]
I was ridding with these fellers........ 



From my experience in life.....I would say that one of those folks is not a "feller"! Grin


You can never be 100% sure these days.
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Re: 2026 HD sprint???
Reply #58 - Today at 17:45:14
 
The rest of the Story...

She was on the back of the Indian , and probably the reason I was keeping up with the Indian !  
But
It was a curvy road ride , The Guzzi was keeping up when we came up on the Indian and I slowed instead of passing (he did have a date with him and blowing past them would have been rude !)  Wink
After we hit an open Road we all stopped for a senic over view and howdy.


I knew the guy on the Guzzi from back when I had a couple Gazzi's .  His name is David from North AL.    He had one of the 411cc Himalaya bikes , a Road Glide , the Guzzi and a Suzuki-VanVan.    He kept the VanVan and sold the Himalaya.



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