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Retro Thumper project (Read 1976 times)
Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #120 - 02/19/22 at 17:26:29
 
The other project was to see what I could do to back cut the intake valves and provide a 30 degree cut underneath the existing 45 degree cut for the seat.

I tried using my drill press - but the chuck would only hold the cam end of the valve and it wobbled as it spun.....so that would not work.

I made a tool holder that would allow me to mount my Dremel and put the valve in the lathe.....it will work just fine!
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TheSneeze
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #121 - 02/19/22 at 20:32:16
 
I love making special tools!  Nice work!
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DragBikeMike
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #122 - 02/21/22 at 21:06:25
 
Necessity is the mother of invention.  Pretty cool setup Dave.
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #123 - 02/22/22 at 03:59:43
 
Funny how we can spend an hour or so building a tool that we will use only once or twice.  On YouTube I saw several guys that just used a hand drill and bench grinder to back cut their valves.......I just wasn't willing to be that primitive about the work on the valves.  I really do love having nice tools and a warm, well lit shop.  For years and years I worked with just hand tools in a dark, cold garage - when we built this house 14 years ago I was able to get the garage I always wanted!  My hours in the garage is my therapy time!

I am at a little bit of a standstill right now on the work on the chassis, as all the nuts/bolts and axles for the bike are at the plating shop getting a new shiny coating.  That is why I have been doing engine work for a chassis that is not yet ready for an engine.
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #124 - 02/22/22 at 11:22:53
 
I'd like one of those!   Cool
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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #125 - 02/27/22 at 10:28:58
 
Since all of the nuts/bolts and other hardware to work on the chassis are at the plater - I can't work on the chassis as I have nothing to hold it together!

So....the work on the head continues.

Yesterday I assembled the Wiseco piston, the head, the DR650 cam, the rockers and cylinder head so I could check clearances.  Even with the 0.030" shaved off the head the valves were a long way from the piston.  I could rotate the crankshaft and watch the valves open and see the piston coming up and going down while the valves opened and closed.  On the intake stroke the valve is open while the piston is coming up, and you can see when the valve starts pulling away faster than when the piston is rising - so I pushed down on the rocker shaft against my "test" springs and I found so much clearance I didn't even bother setting up a way to measure it.  Same thing with the exhaust valve.....as the piston was coming up on the exhaust stroke you could see the rising piston coming toward the valve - but as the piston neared the top of the stroke the valve started to close and move away from the piston.......and there was plenty of clearance.

I measured the ring end gap on the rings supplied by Wiseco, and both the top and 2nd ring measure 0.012".   I need to file the top one to provide 0.015" and the 2nd ring to provide 0.019" of gap.

I called Lani at Copper Gaskets Unlimited and I am getting a 0.042" thick copper head gasket and a 0.32" base gasket for the cylinder.  This will get me right back to the cylinder height that would have existed prior to taking off 0.030" from the head, and a compression ration of around 9.5:1.....that will be just fine for the long distance touring that I hope to use this bike for.  

I installed the new Viton valve seals.
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« Last Edit: 02/27/22 at 12:10:47 by Dave »  

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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #126 - 02/27/22 at 10:31:50
 
This is the valve spring compressor and wood block I made to allow me to use my drill press for removing or installing valves.

The tube is a piece of electrical conduit that has elongated holes cut in the side.  The upper piece is just a weird shaped washer with a bolt and nut inside...the bolt goes into the chuck of the drill press.

The wood block supports the bottom of the valve and is at a height that makes the valve stem vertical.
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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #127 - 02/27/22 at 10:32:18
 
Here is what it looks like when being used.
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TheSneeze
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #128 - 02/28/22 at 18:42:45
 
I like it!!!  (But I bought a valve spring compressor)
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Every twenty minute job is a stripped thread away from being a three day ordeal.

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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #129 - 03/01/22 at 08:12:51
 
Smart!
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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #130 - 03/10/22 at 17:57:55
 
I got my copper gaskets in various thickness and began the task of figuring out what would restore the compression to a desirable level.....I wanted to correct for the 0.030" amount that was milled off the head (if I had done nothing and just bolted the shaved head on the compression would have been 10.2:1.....that would have run great but I want this engine to be able to run on regular if I even get in a place where I can't buy premium).

After using DragBikeMikes method for calculating the combustion chamber volume - I found the stock 56cc combustion chamber volume was now 51.5cc on my head.  With the stock paper base gasket and a 0.026" head gasket the compression ratio of the 97mm Pop Top Wiseco is 9.5:1.  I want to be near that ratio on this engine.  I have occasionally used 87 octane in my Cafe' bike that has the 95mm Wiseco and a 9.4:1 compression ratio - and it ran fine on the lower octane.

If I use a 0.032" base gasket and 0.032" head gasket I will end up with a 9.44:1 compression ratio - a 0.026" base gasket with a 0.032" head gasket and I will have a compression ratio of 9.56:1.  I might be better off with the lower value on a bike that I intend to use for long trips.

This morning I applied Cerakote to the piston crown - it is a heat barrier that folks apply to high performance engines to help prevent heat damage to the pistons when running high boost pressures....it likely won't do much of anything in this engine (but it looks really nice and it may help prevent some carbon deposits).
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TheSneeze
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #131 - 03/10/22 at 18:10:12
 
It does look good, even if its only until you button up the motor.  I am going to be at this stage in a matter of weeks now.  I confirmed my engine builder has started on the head and cylinder.
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Every twenty minute job is a stripped thread away from being a three day ordeal.

'87 LS650h Savage Street Tracker
'86 LS650g Savage (parts bike)
'81 Kawasaki KZ750e ELR tribute
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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #132 - 03/14/22 at 19:00:57
 
The upper end is together.....ported head, 97mm Wiseco, 9.56 compression ratio, DR650 cam, new cam chain, new valve seals and new valves.

As soon as my nuts/bolts get back from being re-plated I can start working on the chassis again.
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badwolf
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #133 - 03/14/22 at 19:19:34
 
Dave, What are you going to do about the cam chain tensioner? Stock, Versy, or pawl free/with spacer?
A new chain and follower would go a long way without the pawl. You would get to see how much the chain really "wears" rather than how fast the stock set-up destroys the follower.
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Dave
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Re: Retro Thumper project
Reply #134 - 03/14/22 at 19:35:11
 
I am going to remove the pawl and put a spacer in to limit how far the plunger can move backward.

On the Cafe' bike I allowed 1mm of travel.....it is working just fine.
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