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AMD & others --- Intel dominance in 2022 (Read 9739 times)
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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #15 - 08/22/20 at 03:17:14
 

https://liliputing.com/2020/08/lilbits-microsoft-brings-new-windows-subsystem...

One of the most surprising things Microsoft did when the company introduced Windows 10 was to include a Windows Subsystem for Linux, which allows users to install Ubuntu or other GNU/Linux distributions and run them within Windows.

The optional feature lets you open up a terminal window and run Linux commands without the need to reboot, switch computers, or launch a full virtual machine using software like VirtualBox.

This year the Windows Subsystem for Linux got faster with the launch of WSL 2, which brings speedier file system performance, among other things. But not everyone is ready to update to the latest version of Windows 10 — so Microsoft has announced it’s making WSL 2 available for Windows 10 versions 1903 and 1909.

That could come as good news for enterprise users or anyone else who may want to take things slowly when it comes to major operating system upgrades… but who would like speedier performance when running Linux commands within Windows.




Ubuntu is starting to act like it considers itself a proper sub-set of Windows now-a-days.   Microsoft flat relies on Linux in general for a lot of different forms of functionality now, between the Google browser functions and all the various pieces of Linux that MS has sucked up you can see where MS is going as they discontinue piece after piece of the old MS product and shut down and Linux replace these functions by updating them at night.  

MS intends to charge you a LOT of money over the years to repackage other people's stuff for you to use as "MS Windows 365".

Hey, enjoy defragging your hard drive and fighting your nightly update installations and doing your bi-weekly anti-virus scans .......     Tongue


REMEMBER, running plain pure Linux Mint Mate is faster by a lot.  

Carrying all the historical MS freight up on your shoulders is quite a load and it makes everything (including you) run slower ........
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« Last Edit: 09/06/20 at 01:48:45 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #16 - 08/25/20 at 12:40:00
 

https://www.amazon.com/PNY-CS900-120GB-Internal-Solid/dp/B0722XPTL6?ref_=Oct_...





$16   is a hell of a good price for a solid state 120 gig SATA III hard drive.   It is a limited time sale at Amazon, if you think you want one order it NOW (with a fall back plan to return it if you change your mind).

https://www.amazon.com/PNY-CS900-120GB-Internal-Solid/dp/B0722XPTL6?ref_=Oct_...

This drive is SATA III natural but is 100% back compatible to SATA II (automatically no less) which means you can plug it in as a boot drive on just about any SATA equipped computer that has SATA cabled drives in it already.   This drive works in stuff going back 10-15 years or more, but you can check your old machine specs on the internet fairly easily if you feel doubtful.  

Look for your drive specs and look for SATA II or SATA III.

YOU WILL FEEL THE SPEED if you are coming off a spinning platter hard drive.

I have personally used one of these (mine cost a bit more a year ago) for almost a full year now and I have nothing but complements to say for the cheapest best easiest performance upgrade to an older PC that I have ever done.

YOU CANNOT BUY A SPINNING PLATTER DRIVE THIS CHEAP period, so maybe it is time to go get a bit more modern with your boot (OS running) drive.   You can keep your old platter drive as Drive D: or E: or whatever, keeping all the access to programs and data that is on the old drive.

It acts just like a SATA drive, plugs in with the same cable and everything.   It was intended as a laptop drive, so guess what, it fits laptop mounting points.

In a big desktop unit, I simply velcro'd mine on top of my old drive bay.  So thin tiny, small and light is easy to put in the big case machines with velcro, screws or whatever.   Being solid state, orientation is meaningless and duct tape would be enough to hold it up (if you had to fall back on duct tape just because you love the stuff).



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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #17 - 08/27/20 at 04:07:41
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTzUAdUx3T4      it is a YouTube, click on it


Today, we take a look at what you can do with a Raspberry Pi 4 using the TWISTER alternate operating systems (yes, there is more than one Apple based OS clone look-a-like  that is able to be switched between MAC OS types at will that is built into this particular Raspberry Pi 4 OS).

This alternate does MAC for those who think they would like to try a MAC OS clone.   What struck me was how complete the clone was and how FAST it ran on the Raspberry Pi 4.

We get all get stuck on trying to use Windows for comparisons ---- and Windows is always notably slow on a Pi.  

MAC is much faster anyway, so the Pi cone for MAC is much much faster --- it looks pretty useable actually.

WHY IS THIS WORTH WATCHING?    You need to expand your mind as far as MAC and Raspberry Pi 4 goes ......  this TWISTER stuff is approaching the realm of full Mac on PC functionality.


Everything you see here is actually Linux showing the facade of something else -- Linux and Mac are very close to each other anyway so this level of speed and functionality should not be a surprise to anybody.  What surprised me was the response speed and performance coming off of just 4 each A-72 style Amlogic cores .....
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« Last Edit: 09/06/20 at 01:51:47 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #18 - 08/27/20 at 17:36:46
 

As you read Intel press releases about Tiger Lake, remember Tiger Lake is inefficient, hot running and very power hungry compared to AMD's new laptop chipsets.

Also remember Tiger Lake has half the physical cores of a current competing AMD APU chipset.


Intel will want to compare its newest Tiger Lake against an AMD APU from this past spring if it compares itself to the competition at all.

Also remember any Intel benchmark comparisons are based upon Intel boosting its processor to 80 watts during overclocking runs using very non-laptop cooling methods.

What is needed is independent tests using same same screen size, chassis and battery in a real laptop to do a model to model comparison if you want to talk real graphics power comparisons ...... and any laptop performance characteristics must run the same exact programs off a charged unit battery in a loop length that is long enough to end any Intel "magic minute" tricks.

Roll Eyes

In short, Intel can only win by cheating and this has been true for 6 months now ......



===================================================



Watching the tame Intel reviewers on YouTube going over Tiger Lake is like an exercise in propaganda management.

How they dance and weave to avoid the negatives is almost like artistry -- never do they mention that AMD has twice as many processor cores as Tiger Lake and that Tiger Lake sucks a third more power out of the battery to simply run at equivalent graphics levels to AMD, and note that Tiger Lake is never compared to a current AMD Renoire APU chipset, although that is what it is selling against.

A favorite trick is to compare Intel to an AMD unit that has the same core count (if that is possible to find that is).   In lots of cases the reviewers have to go back in time to find an older AMD unit to get that core count equivalency.

And who wrote the rules for this "core count equivalency" BS anyway?  Do  you remove cores from your processor when running programs?  AMD uses its higher physical core counts and doubles that physical core count with 2x threads per core in order to offer the end user more speed and more power for roughly the same money (or less).

And the whole "core count equivalency" exercise is completely asinine as AMD has really got twice the physical cores of Intel comparing the two companies up and down the current line ups.   AMD Has better graphics.  And AMD COSTS LESS to buy.

Intel's Youtube shills continue to work hard to con their Intel fanboys into paying half again more money for inferior Intel performance --- Intel's Youtube shills work even harder to con them even more to get them to feel good about having "Intel Inside".
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« Last Edit: 08/31/20 at 21:50:05 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #19 - 08/29/20 at 07:51:04
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYqG31V4qtA

Here is an old Intel fanboy named Linus who has converted to being an AMD fan ---- why?  Because he simply had to.   Inescapable hard facts drove him to it.

Grin

Here is another somewhat older fact based analysis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V3uB12mRrU


Take one of these as a temporary "antidote pill" for when you get blindsided by some blatantly biased Intel pre-release propaganda.

Then, you will need to wait a day or five until the non-intel people can weigh in on the specific dose of Intel BS you were just fed by Intel Marketing.


REMEMBER, nobody has seen the actual hardware yet --- just some Intel patronage "testing reports" from little bitty paid shill companies (or from some really stupid YouTube people who are just reading Intel spec sheets and reporting it as news, some of which aren't even getting paid by Intel ---- they are just so stupid they actually believe Intel's propaganda as written).
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« Last Edit: 09/02/20 at 20:38:45 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #20 - 08/31/20 at 21:05:24
 


Whoever built the new chipsets and re-packaged them on the smaller daughterboard did a "better than Intel" job of it .......  (Samsung ????)

Looks like an improvement in packaging and construction, but soon we will have real production bult units out in the wild for real independent testing to begin.

Intel has lost all credibility lately and has people lined up to debunk all their BS claims about this one  just like all the other Intel innovations of the last year ----- innovations that were not what was promised at all.



===================================================



Tiger Lake has landed.   Tiger Lake is the best Intel laptop chipset ever.   Tiger Lake can actually try to compete with AMD's latest and greatest ---- but can it win in any clear fashion ????

Folks doing testing are seeing a very close match up using the existing "real world" functional tests as proposed by Intel but only one thing still rings true ---- due to more cores doing more work AMD is being very hard to beat on any form of data crunching in these tests.  

AMD is more energy efficient and gives better battery life.  Intel runs hotter and drains a laptop battery faster.   Intel remains hard to beat on laptop gaming where Intel owns all the metrics libraries and BIOS drivers that are all used by popular games (but this is really murky ground as you can't really see past the metrics/BIOS software aspects of things).

Pro-Intel pundits are saying you can't really use existing benchmarks as the new Intel compute structure apparently moves more data per clock cycle and most all of the existing benchmarks assume a set of comparatively steady old throughput per cycle numbers and that is an invalid assumption now a days.

Both AMD and Intel have increased instructions per clock cycle structurally (intel is using AI functions calls do this, AMD has better lithography and more cache memory) AND both have sped up their clock speeds accordingly as well.   This "functional compute swell" is worth more than the current lithography downsizes (for right now, anyway).

Now you can see even Intel is now saying some sort of unbiased group effort is needed by inference to make up a new set of performance benchmarks .......  


===================================================


COMPETITION between Apple vs Intel vs AMD  has caused the world to MOVE appreciably in the good direction.

This last Intel progress will supposedly fire across 150 different laptops over a dozen brands by Christmas time of this year.

Apple will release new very expensive competitive products at this new level.

AMD already has equivalent products that are already released months ago, with new structure and new lithography levels outcoming every six months or so.
AMD is making progress at the same rate as the phone boys do --- or roughly twice as fast as Intel does.

Apple and AMD will step down to 5nm shortly, new turf where Intel currently cannot go.

Because of Samsung and TSMC are acting as foundries for Intel, expect Intel to be at 6nm within a year and a half going with laptop chipsets first.

Intel has gotten off their dead asses and moved ..... finally.

Now expect Intel to move to 6nm with their entire product line, using laptop chipsets as their entry wedge.

An eight core (two threads per core) is now the new minimum in computing.


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« Last Edit: 09/16/20 at 14:11:59 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #21 - 09/03/20 at 06:07:50
 

https://liliputing.com/2020/09/qualcomm-snapdragon-8cx-gen-2-5g-is-designed-f...





According to Qualcomm, its new chip can power fanless PCs with more than 25 hours of battery life, while offering “up to 50% greater total system performance than the competition” according to the company’s own internal testing.





Qualcomm says compared to an unspecified 10th-gen Intel Core i5 processor running at 15 watts, its 7 watt Snapdragon 8cx Gen 2 5G chip offers up to 18-percent better performance and up to 39-percent better efficiency.

Things look even better for Qualcomm when the company pits its chip against a 7 watt Intel Core i5 chip with Hybrid Cores (most likely a Lakefield processor). In that case, Qualcomm says the Snapdragon 8cx Gen 2 5G is up to 51-percent faster and up to 58-percent more efficient.
Qualcomm has also updated the AI engine from Hexagon 685 to Hexagon 690, which could bring a small performance boost in some tasks.

Both the Snapdragon 8cx 5G and the Snapdragon 8cx Gen 2 5G feature:

8-core Qualcomm Kryo 495 processors
8-channel LPDDR4x RAM
Support for NVMe and UFS 3.0 storage
Qualcomm Adreno 680 Extreme graphics
Qualcomm
Qualcomm Spectra 390 image signal processors (support for 32MP single cameras or 16MP dual cameras)
Qualcomm Snapdragon X55 5G modems (mmWave and sub-6GHz support)
Qualcomm Snapdragon X24 LTE modems
Qualcomm Quick Charge 4+ support
The company says the first devices with a Qualcomm Snapdragon 8cx Gen 2 5G chip should ship in late 2020 and if you’re wondering what they’ll look like, Acer’s got you covered. The company’s upcoming Acer Spin 7 (SP71) is the first PC announced to feature the new chip.



Qualcomm is not really seen as actually leading any industry wide groups lately, but they do point out that when you want to talk quiet & light (fanless) laptops (the ones that last well over a whole day between charges) Qualcomm is the current technology leader.

Apple and Qualcomm are both using modified versions of ARM Cortex N-1 cores so ARM is in the technological center of the low power high performance side of things.    

AMD is using some ARM technology as well, but AMD has reworked theirs significantly over towards the x86 side of things.
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« Last Edit: 09/03/20 at 10:40:54 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #22 - 09/04/20 at 16:59:21
 

https://www.pcmag.com/news/intels-tiger-lake-laptop-cpus-slightly-faster-much...

......  this grinning goon Intel guy apparently thinks it is all pretty funny, to him anyway.



Some of the smoke and mirrors is beginning to clear finally ---- Tiger Lake isn't really any faster than AMD Renoir or Apple or Qualcomm, Tiger Lake just carefully uses a lot more of the newest AI function calls that have been quietly built into the systems libraries behind the test software that is being run in these comparisons.    These are new AI calls that really only play well for Intel right now (and notably not at all for AMD or APPLE) until AMD and Apple decide to actually implement these new AI function calls in their base softwares.

Harsh folks will say Intel has simply gotten caught at widespread background cheating BIG TIME yet again ....... me, I think that is too simple an explanation.   Intel cannot move their lithography base like the others have done, so Intel is attempting to change the entire conversation completely into something that Intel can actually do.

Intel releases new versions of its Core laptop processors every year, and most years the company tends to talk up how much faster they are than the previous generation. But Wednesday's launch of its newest silicon, the 11th generation “Tiger Lake” chips, is different. Intel’s main claim with Tiger Lake is not that it’s faster than the 10th generation “Ice Lake” family (though it is), but that it’s faster than the latest Ryzen laptop processors from AMD.

Why Intel's shift, deigning to mention competing silicon from its archrival? The obvious answer is that the latest Ryzen 4000-series “Renoir” chips have been trouncing Ice Lake in raw performance on classic benchmarks ever since the first Renoir laptops went on sale earlier this year. So regaining the lead is important, though we’ll have to take Intel’s word for it since no Tiger Lake laptops are available for independent tests just yet.

But the more interesting answer is that the persistent delays in the research, development, and manufacturing of Intel silicon that helped AMD get a leg up in the first place have led Intel to explore other ways of making their processors faster that don’t rely on pure silicon-muscle improvements. Perhaps the most significant of these methods is adding artificial intelligence (AI) capabilities, which are responsible for much of what backs up Intel’s claim that Tiger Lake is once again the best-performing processor family for thin-and-light laptops.

Speeding Up Those Crops and Blurs

Enabling AI capabilities on a PC or Mac is a team effort involving the chip maker, the computer manufacturer, and the developer of the app that stands to benefit from AI. In Tiger Lake’s case, Intel has added support and optimizations for numerous AI platforms that manufacturers and developers can use to speed up the performance of their apps.






As Intel dumps bunches and scads of AI speed up calls into the various benchmarks tests and into the BIOS library functions that they know the competitive tests will use --- so look to see AMD and the others simply start intentionally using these AI speed up calls as part of their own arsenal.  

Intel does not have a lock on AI functions, arguably Apple and AMD are just as far along in implementing AI in hardware as Intel is, actually.

Intel has simply made an early user play as the first mover and has identified a new way to make significant benchmark "progress" in a way that is somewhat sneaky, but is arguably worth pursuing by everybody.

And these AI functions and calls are very real right now and should be used more by all softwares anyway ......



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« Last Edit: 09/08/20 at 08:32:14 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #23 - 09/08/20 at 00:32:20
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFHBgb9SY1Y


Ok .......   Reviewers are beginning to post debunks of Intel's Tiger Lake smoke and mirrors.

You can watch while this while the guy goes over various Intel BS smoke items and the inverse reflections of the same things that are also being claimed by Intel as "yet another Intel victory".    

He stumbles a lot over what he is trying to say because it is all so confusing and obtuse, but that is what is going on in reality with Tiger Lake's BIG Progress.

Point was made by the dude that Intel was repeatedly bashing AMD as being "an imitator"  when actually the opposite is true.   Intel is well behind AMD and Intel is the one imitating AMD's advancements and is actually cheating to do it.

Shocked      ...... once AMD starts using all these cute AI calls in their own test runs, only then will AMD be acting as an Intel imitator.

Once you back out Intel's much greater use of AI background functions (support for these calls were just recently installed in the benchmark's support libraries by Intel) then all Intel has in Tiger Lake apart from AI is a WHOLE LOT of hot air and PR and advertising.



Intel makes a lot of noise about "not using benchmarks" ---- instead they use AI calls to their recently installed background library resources to greatly speed up the execution of SOME of the old benchmark function items that they say they are not using ......  somewhat confusing, right ???

Roll Eyes

Point being proven is that the AI being actually used is very very fast (but the phone boys have known this for years and them phone boys can cheat much better than Intel can, trust me on that one).

I also dis-liked the fact that Intel has just jumbled up all their existing chip naming nomenclatures on all their old chipsets so they can now present an old existing 14nm product as being a brand new product that is "a whole lot faster now" because the cheating AI metrics calls make it appear that way.

In short, AMD is doing all their stuff by the rule book and actually is using increased hardware speed to make the real progress that they show, while Intel has blown so much AI smoke up everyone's arse that by now all the reviewers are simply choking on the smoke as they burp it up .......

Yes, AI is neat, but Intel's saying their use of new AI calls "is your Tiger Lake processor being faster" is simply false logic --- well, actually that's just Intel lying out their arse a bit, lying yet again.

Tongue




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« Last Edit: 09/13/20 at 20:58:01 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #24 - 09/09/20 at 04:37:11
 

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3573774/intel-piles-on-the-benchmarks-to-show...

Mark Hachman, Senior Editor of PCWorld magazine has written a short piece reminding everybody that NOTHING IS KNOWN until Intel actually ships real units that can be independently tested.





Whenever Intel, AMD, or Qualcomm launch a chip, the first question anyone asks is, how fast is it? We won’t know how Intel's Tiger Lake performs until we test it ourselves. But Intel certainly believes its 11th-gen Core chips are much faster than AMD’s mobile Ryzen 4000 parts—because Intel has made claim after claim to that effect.

Intel talked aggressively about Tiger Lake’s performance early on, but the comparisons that accompanied the formal launch of the Tiger Lake family Wednesday were, well, sort of wishy-washy. It wasn’t until later in the day, during deeper-dive press briefings, that Intel began hammering home Tiger Lake’s performance compared to AMD’s mobile Ryzen.

Let’s be clear: These are Intel’s claims, using its own microprocessors, laptops, and benchmarks.

Are they objective? No. We’ve already seen crazy-cheap notebooks like the mobile AMD Ryzen-powered HP Envy x360 13 perform exceptionally well for their price and weight. Intel has a big stake in reclaiming its dominance in notebook PCs—even though AMD’s mobile Ryzen 4000 is now about nine months old.


Mark goes through the long list of "Intel victory claims" noting in passing just how useful (or not) the AI performance boost being talked about may be to real laptop users.

It is clear that AI is claimed to be useful in carefully tuned situations but we all have to agree with Mark that Intel's intentionally confusing carefully tuned "certain item only" AI boosts with their new processor's actual general overall real performance is simply an attempt to sell yellow snow to skeptical Eskimos.

And all the skeptical Eskimos are ALL PROMISING that real testing will take place with purchased units just as soon as any become available.  


And pray tell, why again are the independently produced Tiger Lake units not here yet?

Having some problems with Intel's first real production runs,  eh ........  speak louder --- say that again Intel boys?

Roll Eyes

We are all very curious to see a real laptop that can cool and support an 80 watt loading during these benchmarking runs on a mobile chipset laptop.
     

Roll Eyes




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« Last Edit: 09/09/20 at 07:39:56 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #25 - 09/09/20 at 06:11:45
 

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3573639/why-intels-tiger-lake-cpus-will-make-...



How it can be that two Intel 11th-gen Tiger Lake notebook PCs, with exactly the same chip inside, can offer performance that differs by up to 37 percent? And more importantly, how can you, the buyer, tell the difference?

The short answer is:   You can’t.       An unfortunate side effect of how Intel develops processors like Tiger Lake will make it more difficult for consumers to determine the actual performance of a laptop just by reading a list of its features, and it will probably get harder over time.

The problem is that Intel is designing mobile microprocessors like Tiger Lake to allow laptop makers greater flexibility in how they choose to “clock” them, or at what frequency they’re assigned to run. A laptop that uses a specific processor could run 37 percent faster than a second laptop that includes exactly the same chip, Intel executives say.

That means laptop buyers will have to look harder at actual performance reviews with comparative data to understand what they're getting.

The problem actually cropped up earlier, as Intel moved into its prior (10th-gen) Ice Lake chips. But Intel executives highlighted it during its Tiger Lake launch as something to watch out for.
        How, you ask?   By downplaying it and then obliquely lying about it .....

Roll Eyes

So ....... Intel is saying that the laptop housing's total heat removing capacity determines everything about its builder's relative performance choices compared to AMD based units that are simply much cooler running ????    

That Intel's HEAT shutdown limits are the builder's choices when he sets the Intel processor's maximum output level for all time.     Once picked by the builder, the shutdown limits remain forever.    

Next, during the same run of the same model laptops the different machines can get hot differently, so they each can have different limits set for them individually.


Tongue       ...... so, are they saying that some Tiger Lake machines are lemons and will always suck?


So, Tiger Lake runs just that hot in normal day to day use, huh?

Folks are now thinking that a Tiger Lake Intel based laptop machine's "watt rating" has more to do with the laptop housings ability to dump heat based upon this new understanding of "watts as heat dumped"  -----  and not any "normally rated" Tiger Lake power usage can be expected to play across the board.

And we are also sensing a great deal of in processor performance variation is going on with Intel's 10nm Tiger Lake product.   Both a huge potential run-to-run variation and a quite large  ~40%~  level variation part to part within the same wafer.
 
Intel has also used AI selectively to speed up certain functions used in the common benchmark tests, then has reported this as "increases in processor throughput".   It is not, it is hidden use of AI that was in essence staged since Intel controls many of the background x86 libraries that all softwares utilize.   It is interesting that these speed ups only work for certain Intel machines since Intel does not want competitors to look good, just them.

WHY HAS INTEL PAINTED THEMSELVES INTO THIS NETWORK OF LIES ????

Watch the video below again and realize that Intel CANNOT COMPETE with AMD Ryzen 4000 mobile processors at any given cross over level.   That the midrange AMD mobile unit can kick the ass of a full bore i9 Intel processor running in a specialty cases that has TWO FULL SIZED DESKTOP CASE FANS TUCKED INTO THE LAPTOP CASE (yes you have to slide the laptop case open laterally to expose the two giant fans and you have to hit a special turbo switch to spin the fans up and get the thing running up at full speed).


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYqG31V4qtA     ......  it is a YouTube, so click on it



==================================================



Let's be charitable and simply say that these are all just Tiger Lake PRE-PRODUCTION teething problems.

But this litany gives you a hint why the full production of introduction laptop units have now been delayed until October-November.


Some of these issues need fixing before you go make 10's of thousands of machines that you will then need to perform expensive reworks upon ......


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« Last Edit: 09/16/20 at 14:18:29 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #26 - 09/10/20 at 01:43:38
 

https://tekdeeps.com/why-inteltiger-lake-is-disrupting-the-notebook-market/

Source: ITWorld Korea by www.itworld.co.kr.

*The article has been translated based on the content of ITWorld Korea by www.itworld.co.kr. If there is any problem regarding the content, copyright, please leave a report below the article. We will try to process as quickly as possible to protect the rights of the author. Thank you very much!





“The TDP is the same on the specs even though the system is different, but the actual performance can vary greatly depending on cooling, OEM tuning, Intel partnership, target users and system use cases, and workloads,” Schrout said. We don’t think one design is the best, and we see that different designs may have different focus. Product design is ultimately the manufacturer’s choice.”

The problem is that consumers and notebook manufacturers have different interests. Laptop makers get manufacturing flexibility, but consumers can’t know whether the laptop they’re buying will run at a lower or higher performance state. “Tiger Lake’s power lies in its scalability and dynamic diversity of products,” Schlaut said. We do not enforce branding, thermal design, or performance delivery design. Therefore, it is only possible to judge how well the performance is through performance reviews and explanations.”




This chart is showing the same processor applied to different functional scenarios (always limited by the chipset exceeding the cooling capacity of the laptop).

According to Schlaut, Intel has no plans to classify the chip by its operating power state. “With the Core i3/i5/i7/i9 brand, we’ve launched the ’Evo’ brand for premium notebooks, letting consumers know about the performance they can expect from these product lines. Consumers and reviewers have a variety of software tools. We can use it to freely decide the power setting of our laptop, and we hope that our customers are interested in these advantages. After all, performance is the most important.”


So, Intel says EACH Tiger Lake processor installations must be treated as an individual vis a vie the cooling system of the individual laptop.  

Intel can indeed do some benchmark tests at up to 80 watts (for extremely short periods of time) causing the chipset to throttle way down to 5 watts during a protracted thermal recovery period.  

This is considered by Intel to be "normal usage" not hyper clocking (cheating out their arse) as everybody else sees it.

You (as the purchaser) do not get to know what you are buying any longer, except that it falls somewhere inside the considerably broad ranges that are now advertised.    

Note please:   any sub-optimal members of a run of Tiger Lake chipsets are still considered "within spec" for certain use ranges in other words ........


Tongue                   So what if a Tiger Lake is missing a completely dead core or has two "damaged" cores, that's OK ---  it still fits inside the UP-4 7-15 watts classification just as it is ......


RECOMMENDATION:    AVOID TIGER LAKE PROCESSORS ALONG WITH THE REST OF INTEL 10nm++  PROCESSOR EQUIPPED PRODUCTS.  

ALSO AVOID THE EVO BRAND DESIGNATION, AS THE AI TRICKS AND THE HYPERCLOCKING TRICKS ARE INCLUDED IN THE EVO DESIGNATION.





DO:    Buy the latest gen AMD laptop products for the best, most honest and the most knowable and the most stable laptop and desktop performance --- and save yourself a chunk of money too.    



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« Last Edit: 09/11/20 at 06:16:28 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #27 - 09/10/20 at 16:35:55
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp3xW4uncbk     it is not a long video  ...... just watch it



Back in May of this year, some people who remember the several times in the past when Intel got just plain "nasty acting" during a short period of time when they WERE NOT COMPETITIVE and Intel had actually let their black bag boys go off on a little rampage.

Intel was specifically warned in May against the sort of bad black bag stuff that is currently going on with Tiger Lake introduction.

Earlier this year (in May) Intel got WARNED not to do this sort of stuff since Intel got so non-competitive early this year and it was sensed that another black bag incursion was coming as the massive angry flashback from the industry on a TOTAL LOSS OF TRUST  on two past occasions was SO severe that it took Intel literally YEARS and YEARS of proper behavior (and a management change) to get that trust back again.

Intel still hasn't recovered their image from the huge freon cooled mainframe motherboard that was actually running the test software down in the soundproofed enclosure that was hidden under the skirted display table during the CES show 2 years ago.

Tongue

Do you think it strange that pundits are actually WARNING Intel right now to restrain their black bag boys for Intel's own good?


==================================================


So far to be a Tiger Lake "winner" for Intel you have to have a laptop with excellent heat dispersion construction, a fully functional FAST Tiger Lake chipset (some aren't so completely fully functional NOR are they all specially selected to be EVO speed level fast).  

You will also need a really really fast internet connection to allow the current as of today Intel tweeked libraries fast and full access during the testing runs and most importantly you need to only use the exact copies of the exact benchmarks that Intel "approves" (the ones that they have tweeked with to interface with the libraries to enable a lot of biased AI secret usage (used just during the testing of the Intel processor of course, but definitely not during the competition's test runs).

Watch out for gross hyperclocking during the Intel test runs .......   i.e. watch out for several seconds of 80 watt power draw (note that your oversized laptop power supply has to be always plugged into the machine if you want Intel to really shine test after test, or you can just run it off the battery if you want a little more FAIRNESS injected into the mixture.

Intel is already saying "You can't accurately predict the performance of a Tiger Lake laptop as it changes according to thermals reported from the motherboard" to give them the big out they will start needing in a couple of weeks.

There will be more niggling little items discovered while the reviewers are actually running these comparisons and the pundits will quickly show us which pundits are in Intel's pocket and which ones are not.

Tame Intel paid reviewers are pushing the company sponsored viewpoint that Intel wants you indoctrinated to accept ----- that you Can Never Really Know what you have bought because Intel Tiger Lake always reacts differently to different situations.   They want you to BELIEVE Tiger Lake is always superior and to think that "benchmarking" is obsolete in the Tiger Lake era.

Tongue

If you are mullet enough to buy into this thinking, then you deserve the Intel processor that you just paid MORE FOR, and are going to get less from.
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« Last Edit: 09/13/20 at 16:35:29 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #28 - 09/11/20 at 11:01:41
 

https://liliputing.com/2020/09/acer-revives-the-gateway-brand-for-a-line-of-w...

Do you remember the cow boxes from Gateway Computing?   I do, I bought one.   It was my first 64 bit Athlon 1 ghz single core AMD desktop chipset from way back in  the day.

Well, what was old is new again.   Acer who bought the corpse of Gateway Computing has revived the name as their Walmart Exclusive Only brand name.

So , say goodby to Onn (who did not do well against Amazon Fire tablets for features or price) and say hello to Gateway Computing .......   all coming to your local Walmart by Christmas 2020 with some having already arrived.

Here’s a run-down of the Acer/Gateway/Walmart launch lineup. Note that some models aren’t yet available for purchase, and while the MSRP prices are listed, some models are already on sale for as much as $300 off the list price.

Android Tablets
8″ Android Tablet (MSRP: $70) 800X1280 IPS, A50, 1GB/32GB
10.1″ Android Tablet (MSRP: $80) 800X1280 IPS, A50, 1GB/32GB

Windows Laptops
11.6″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $200) w/AMD A4-9120e, 4GB / 64GB
11.6″ Windows 2-in-1 Laptop (MSRP: $300) w/Intel Celeron N3350, 4GB / 64GB (Includes 1 year Microsoft 365 Personal)
14.1″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $240) w/Intel Celeron, 4GB / 64GB (Includes 1 ysome models are already on sale for as much as $300 off the list priceear Microsoft 365 Personal)
14.1″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $430) w/AMD Ryzen 3 3200U, 4GB / 128GB
14.1″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $460) w/Intel Core i3-1005G1, 4GB / 128GB
14.1″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $600) w/Intel Core i5, 16GB/ 256GB
15.6″ Ultra Slim Laptop (MSRP: $650) w/Intel Core i5-1035G1, 16GB / 256GB
15.6″ Laptop (MSRP: $900) w/AMD Ryzen 5 4600H / 8GB / 256GB, NVIDIA 1650 GTX GPU
15.6″ Creators Series Laptop (MSRP: $1200) w/Intel Core i5, 8GB / 256GB, NVIDIA 2060 RTX GPU


Just for an example so you can see one      https://gatewayusa.com/GWAT10-1.html
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Re: AMD & others --- post AMD dominance in 202
Reply #29 - 09/11/20 at 22:15:53
 

Grin      ....... yeah, folks are still getting sorta hot at Intel for their Black Bag BS ........


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuaiqcjf0bs&t=435s


Why show this again?   It is the first time Intel attempted to ring in tuned AI usage as an illicit  "processor performance boost" and reported it as "processor advancements".

Ring it forward 6 months and you can see the current Tiger Lake Black Bag tricks shown in light of their origins.

When this video was filmed, they did not understand completely what Intel was doing with AI, just that this processor performed EXACTLY like the last one in lots of tests, but showed better results on the AI tweeked benchmarks that were approved by Intel.  

It was a curiosity and a puzzlement .....  Intel cheating was suspected, but since AMD Threadripper so totally overwrapped it in the next few weeks the entire thing went into the "past history, water over the dam" trash bin.

I predict that the first real production unit shipments of Tiger Lake will make up a nice "tear Intel a new one" moment from the non-Intel computer press and then will be quickly swept off the stage by Intel's backing off the Black Bag Boys bogus pronouncements and finally by AMD finally getting irritated and releasing a REAL product to "threadripper" it with lots of real raw performance that Intel can't cheat enough to overcome.
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« Last Edit: 09/13/20 at 21:04:06 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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