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s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, cause? (Read 653 times)
DragBikeMike
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #45 - 06/29/20 at 11:35:59
 
OK, I give up.  Shocked

Dave, how did you get this picture???

"The flange broke off the back of the sprocket that goes on the crankshaft and holds the primary gear.
https://imgur.com/SXPtib"

Very interesting indeed.  So do we have a situation where the cam drive sprocket failed in a way that the flange broke off but the sprocket portion remained engaged....or.....did the entire sprocket fail?  Does Blake have a bunch of bent valves?

If the cam drive sprocket is the root cause (which seems plausible), how did the balancer drive gear pin end up falling out?  

I think it may have been a failure that was a long time in the making.  For instance, the flange fails on the cam drive sprocket, which relaxes the pinch on the balancer drive sprocket, which allows the balancer drive sprocket to start moving, which starts working on the pin, and the pin eventually gets worked loose from the constant pounding back & forth.  That round pin falling out plays a major role here.

How in the world did you get that picture of the fractured cam drive sprocket?????

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BlakeEM
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #46 - 06/29/20 at 11:45:48
 
@Dave

I didn't notice any freeplay side to side on the crankshaft, at least it wasn't enough to be noticable. I even tapped it on both sides with a dead blow hammer to check for movement after this was brought up previously.

@stewmills

That was the first thing I checked and what I assumed was the problem before I started disassembly. The chain tensioner was completely fine as was the cam chain.
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BlakeEM
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #47 - 06/29/20 at 11:49:40
 
@DragBikeMike

Valves are fine and made no contact with the piston. I turned the engine before disassembly and it felt like it made good compression. Everything in the top end looked great as far as I could see.
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #48 - 06/29/20 at 12:32:25
 
@BlakeEM, I knew you had already looked at the CCT stuff, I was mainly offering free parts (not technical advice) if I have anything you can use from a 95 that has a bad top-end. Got this motor free for parts, so just paying it forward if you can use anything for the cost of shipping. It has been partially disassembled by the previous owner, but if you can tell me anything you need I'm happy to dig around and see if it is there. I just don't know what off of a 95 you would, would not want to put on your year model...I don't know enough about the differences to answer that question for you.
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #49 - 06/29/20 at 12:57:54
 
@stewmills

We are just going to part it out. She really needs a more modern bike with fuel injection since it's a daily. It lasted her a good 5 years. Thanks though!
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #50 - 06/29/20 at 13:24:13
 
Well,, where are ya and what do ya want for the fork tubes?
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Dave
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #51 - 06/29/20 at 13:52:19
 
DragBikeMike:  The photo of the broken flange came from a previous post.  The sprocket is splined all the way through, so when the flange broke off the  cam would still be in time.....the loss of the flange does not allow the sprocket to spin on the crank and change the timing.

I do agree that you are likely correct in thinking the crankshaft gear and pin for the counterbalancer likely started moving around once it lost the clamping force when the sprocket flange broke.  It very well could be the pin broke and the counterbalancer shaft went out of timing and that is what happened when the engine blew the counterbalancer out the front of the engine.

BlakeEM:  The crankshaft is a snug fit in the ball bearing - so you won't be able to pull on the end of the crank and get it to move in the bearing and feel any side to side play in the crank.  The movement of the crank to the right side may have taken a while to occur......and that is likely why the failure didn't occur immediately.
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #52 - 06/29/20 at 18:17:09
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/29/20 at 13:24:13:
Well,, where are ya and what do ya want for the fork tubes?


If anyone is interested in any of the parts you can get more details and ask about them here. I don't want to clutter up this thread.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1593479677/0
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DragBikeMike
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #53 - 06/29/20 at 18:36:04
 
Whoah!  Shocked

Dave, is that busted sprocket picture from a previous post by Blake....or.....some other member's busted sprocket?

Blake, is that picture of the busted sprocket from your engine....or.....is all this stuff about the busted sprocket purely speculation?  Is your cam chain drive sprocket all in one piece or is it all busted up?

I appreciate your help on this as I have to make a decision based on your answers.  Please clarify.

Also, note that Blake submitted a picture of his right hand main bearing. It looks like it drifted to the left about 1/8" or so.  If that bearing controls the axial position of the crankshaft, what restrains the bearing outer race?  How do you control the axial position of the crank (right/left) if the main bearing isn't somehow locked in place?
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #54 - 06/29/20 at 18:39:03
 
Are you talking about this? That is what I found when I removed it.

https://imgur.com/SXPtibU
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DragBikeMike
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #55 - 06/29/20 at 18:55:58
 
Yes.  That's what I'm curious about.  Somehow, that picture didn't show up in the string of posts that I could see.  So, that totally failed cam drive sprocket is all yours.

Thanks very much.  I have no clue why that particular post wasn't in the string that I was looking at, but it clears up a whole bunch of stuff.

What a mess.  Really a spectacular failure.  Your wife is so fortunate.  Good luck with the fuel injected replacement and muchos mahalos for sharing all the great photos.

Best regards, Mike
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #56 - 06/29/20 at 19:01:09
 
Tale a close look at the nut on the end of the crankshaft - it sure looks to me like somebody hammered a while on this nut in the counterclockwise direction with an impact gun.
https://imgur.com/CCwkG9c
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #57 - 06/29/20 at 19:26:00
 
Dave wrote on 06/29/20 at 19:01:09:
Tale a close look at the nut on the end of the crankshaft - it sure looks to me like somebody hammered a while on this nut in the counterclockwise direction with an impact gun.
https://imgur.com/CCwkG9c


I noticed that as well...
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #58 - 06/29/20 at 20:02:47
 
Look at the case behind the gear.
It's been shaved by the teeth.

And yeah,, someone got down, rattling on that nut. If that's tightening, AND it's a place where over tightening is bad , somebody's got some explaining to do..
You might hold off on selling me those forks,, dangitt,,I need some forks..
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Re: s40 major failure, balancer hitting case, caus
Reply #59 - 06/29/20 at 20:40:15
 
That looks to me where the problem started.
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