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Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Install (Read 135 times)
DragBikeMike
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Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Install
03/24/20 at 20:16:39
 
Pop-top vs tight quench - Wiseco Piston Installation

There are two options for increasing compression on our LS650 engines.  One is to install a Wiseco pop-top piston.  The other is to reduce the height of the cylinder (tight quench setup).  Each has distinct advantages and disadvantages.

I had been running my engine with a tight quench setup.  It ran great but I got a little careless and melted the piston.  This was a good opportunity to compare the two approaches.

I installed a 94mm Wiseco.  It was easy.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #1 - 03/24/20 at 20:17:47
 
I used my original stock cylinder.  It was in excellent condition but the forged Wiseco 94mm needs a bit more clearance.  Wiseco specifies .0025” clearance but I run my hotrod pretty hard, so I opted to give it just a tad more.  I set it up at .0030”.   When finished, it was round and straight within .0002”, still not perfect but pretty good.  If you do this yourself, I suggest you use a rigid hone and torque plates.   If you don’t have the equipment, get it done at a machine shop.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #2 - 03/24/20 at 20:18:42
 
I know I will probably get an earful, but please don’t use one of these if you are re-sizing the cylinder.  Spring hones are fine for de-glazing, but any re-sizing should be done with a rigid hone.    The spring hone follows the existing bore, so any existing taper or out-of-round will just be made worse.  Use a rigid hone and torque plates to re-size.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #3 - 03/24/20 at 20:19:15
 
Same thing goes for ball hones.  Good for de-glazing, but don’t use to re-size.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #4 - 03/24/20 at 20:20:28
 
I monitor the cylinder size using an inside micrometer and a dial bore gage.  That way I can make sure I’m keeping it round and straight.  Then I verify clearance with feeler strips.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #5 - 03/24/20 at 20:21:04
 
When finished with the hone, you must wash the cylinder with hot soapy water.  You should be able to wipe the bore with a clean white towel and not pick up any evidence of honing debris.  No black stuff on the towel, it must remain white.  If the towel picks up anything, wash the cylinder again.

Since I had reason to suspect my prior failure was related to ring butt gap, I gave it a little more than specified.  I ended up with .022” for the top ring and .024” for the second ring.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #6 - 03/24/20 at 20:21:54
 
When you reassemble, it’s tough to support the piston while you drop the cylinder down over the rings.  It’s a juggling act.  The ring compressor can only do its job if the top of the piston remains exactly perpendicular to the cylinder.  That’s tricky with the piston wobbling all around on the wrist pin.  This simple piston support works great.  Just three chunks of mahogany (1”x 2”) held together with wood screws.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #7 - 03/24/20 at 20:22:36
 
With the piston support under the piston, both hands are free to work the cylinder down over the rings.  I love this piston support.  You want the base gasket adhered to the cylinder, not the crankcase.  That way you don’t damage the gasket.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #8 - 03/24/20 at 20:24:43
 
BTW, don’t get confused by those pics of the cylinder installation.  I forgot to take pics when I was installing the Wiseco piston, so I took some photos using spare parts.  I’m sure you get the idea.

Once the cylinder is in place, you can run the piston up to TDC and get a look at the deck height.  You can see that the Wiseco is situated well below the deck (.143” to be exact).  No effective quench on this motor.  With the Wiseco, you have to rely on port tumble/turbulence to get the mixture stirred up, not gonna be any squish working on it.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #9 - 03/24/20 at 20:25:28
 
In contrast, raising compression by machining the cylinder results in tight quench clearance.  There is no pop-top to impede flame propagation, and relatively tight quench clearance to generate turbulence and improve combustion.  Two different ways to skin a cat.
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #10 - 03/24/20 at 20:27:04
 
With the Wiseco piston, I installed the 340b cam on the factory timing marks.  The initial compression check showed 185 psi.  That improved to 195 psi after about about 500 miles of very easy break-in.  195 psi is right where I want to be.  I should be able to run 92 octane without ever having to worry about the dreaded spark knock.

Since installing the Wiseco, I have been able to do a lot of testing.  I have loads of comparative data.

One thing I noticed immediately is vibration.  The LS vibrates a lot more with the Wiseco piston.  The 94mm Wiseco is 52 grams lighter than the stock assembly.  The mirrors are blurred continuously, and long freeway hauls really put my hands and butt to sleep.   It’s manageable, but I think the 97mm Wiseco would be a better choice.  It’s only 11 grams lighter than stock and will most likely run much smoother.

In terms of performance, the tight quench setup kills the Wiseco.  The tight quench has a lot more compression and you really feel it.  It has torque that starts low and never stops.  Second gear acceleration from 4K to 7K is much faster (2.60 tight quench vs 2.90 Wiseco).  That’s a comparison using exactly the same cylinder head, camshaft, carburetor, airbox, exhaust system, etc., the only difference being the method of compression enhancement.   The additional compression is clearly an advantage.  I also believe that the tight quench setup yields much better combustion.  If you imagine that 0.3 second acceleration advantage over five gears, you start to see what a big difference it is.

From a practical perspective, you can’t beat the Wiseco.  You may not achieve the same all out performance, but the simplicity of installation makes it a better choice.  It’s still plenty fast, and you don’t need a machine shop to install it.  There are no cam chain tensioner hurdles, and valve-to-piston clearance isn’t a problem.  Installation is easy.  It really offers a lot of bang for the bucks.

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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #11 - 03/24/20 at 20:29:18
 
The details of the tight quench engine are in this old post.  It gives all the gory details plus an explanation of why I feel tight quench is good.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1567201633

I think the tight quench engine had too much compression.  With a DR650 cam timed to the factory marks, that engine pumped 245 psi.  It ran good, but I had to feed it octane booster.  I switched to a Web 340b cam (timing retarded 5°).  That brought the cranking pressure down to 220 psi, still too high.  I was able to run on 92 octane but was always conscious of the big squeeze numbers.  I really should have opened up the combustion chamber a bit and brought the cranking pressure closer to 200 psi.

Since I got the engine running again, I have been able to finish up testing on the Hayden KrankVent and also do a carburetor comparison test.  I hope to finish up those reports soon.  Plenty of time on my hands these days.

I hope this post gives you a little perspective on the two compression enhancement options that I have tried.  I’m sure there are others.

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Mike
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #12 - 03/24/20 at 20:41:52
 
Thanks so much for the detailed write up and sharing!
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #13 - 03/25/20 at 05:36:35
 
What is the maximum reasonable compression ratio that can be achieved? In Sweden the regular gasoline is 95 octane and premium is 98 and I even found something called ED95 which is 95 percent Ethanol and 5% "combustion enhancers" and I think it can safely handle 18:1 compression ratio. Are there benefits to be had with going higher than stock compression if 95 octane is available everywhere?
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Re: Pop-Top vs Tight Quench - Wiseco Piston Instal
Reply #14 - 03/25/20 at 06:48:38
 
Kamel
With all due respect, there is no way a simple carburated air cooled motor can run 18-1 compression.
My guess is that 10:1 is about as high as you'd want to go, unless you want a hand grenade.
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