SuzukiSavage.com - America post Trump, it can never be the same.

Mavigogun

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #15 - 11/03/19 at 19:40:59

oldNslow wrote on 11/03/19 at 19:27:12:

250 or so years. Done. Over and over.

Please- there are schools older than our Nation. When some folks get old they get a little too resolved to the world ending with them. It's a trial- with a little effort, we'll get past it stronger, ready to face the next challenge. Your moment in time is passing - that's natural. Someone else is already stepping up to fill the vacancy.

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raydawg

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #16 - 11/03/19 at 20:31:16

oldNslow wrote on 11/03/19 at 19:27:12:

Quote:

Not even close to the Civil War.....

It doesn't have to be a shooting war. Often isn't. 250 or so years. Done. Over and over. We're not special at all it historical terms.

http://people.uncw.edu/kozloffm/glubb.pdf

Democracy is historical and not beholden to other failed systems...
I think that is the beauty of it, its not stagnant and rigid, yes, we have a founding foundation that supports the pillars, that hold us up.....
But it allows change, growth, etc, or they would never have allowed free speech, assimilation, religion, or right to arm.....etc.
They wanted the people to choose its path, not those that can easily be corrupted by that power.....
Just as we are seeing, and watching, as all this anger, division, is being fueled by those who are on the brink, of losing that power.....

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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)

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oldNslow Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 2685 Rochester, NY Gender:	Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same. Reply #17 - 11/04/19 at 04:09:01 Quote: When some folks get old they get a little too resolved to the world ending with them. That's just pop psychology nonsense. Did you even bother to read the essay?
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oldNslow

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #18 - 11/04/19 at 04:14:23

Ray: same question.

If you do take the time, pay attention to the part where the author talks about the different stages that empires go through. Which one do you think the US is in right now. Most of the characteristics of that particular stage are things that you yourself have decried about the state of our nation.

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Mavigogun

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #19 - 11/04/19 at 05:30:31

oldNslow wrote on 11/04/19 at 04:09:01:

That's just pop psychology nonsense.

Wishful. It's a direct observation. 'All the signs are there- the end is coming.' Etc, etc, ad nauseam.

The Persians, the Spartans, the Herules, the Romans- that ancient beacon of democracy, Athens, suffered one abuse after another... yet endured. While history provides lessons, it is not prophetic. We suffer the symptoms of all sorts of challenges; whether we fare better or worse than the Greeks depends entirely on our determination and the culture that we build.

To follow purveyors of doom, such as the aptly named oldNslow, is to relegate ourselves to oblivion. Spent, he sees only the dwindling embers of a dying fire. I'll bank on those with energy to build and a future to look forward to any day over his ilk, sapping moral with their predictions of end times.

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oldNslow

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #20 - 11/04/19 at 20:37:09

Quote:

The Persians, the Spartans, the Herules, the Romans- that ancient beacon of democracy, Athens, suffered one abuse after another... yet endured. While history provides lessons, it is not prophetic. We suffer the symptoms of all sorts of challenges; whether we fare better or worse than the Greeks depends entirely on our determination and the culture that we build.

No, it doesn't.

Empires run their course and are replaced. The US that we are familiar with as a world superpower is just about done. What it wili become is anybody's guess.

[quote[ To follow purveyors of doom, such as the aptly named oldNslow, is to relegate ourselves to oblivion. Spent, he sees only the dwindling embers of a dying fire.[quote/]

That's a bit melodramatic, and a bit insulting, but I expect that from you now, so nevermind.

Anyway I'll be fine. I'm not as old, or as slow, as you apparently believe I am. My forum name is a reference to my motorcycle skills as they are now compared what they were in my racing days. And I'm as prepared as I can be for what I think is coming. And if I'm wrong, I'll still be fine.

You live near Huston, I believe. If you've been there long you should be no stranger to natural disasters of the weather related kind. How long does it take for the gas stations to run out of gas, and the supermarkets to empty out. when the weather man says "Hurricane coming. " Are you one of those folks that runs around with all the other panic stricken idiots trying to grab the last pack of bottled water, some flashlight batteries, a generator? What if for some reason that stuff didn't magically reappear in a couple of days, a couple of weeks. What if your ATM card stopped working, and you didn't know why or for how long, Do you have a plan for that?

Or would you rather just pretend it could never happen to you, and ridicule someone who is at least prescient enough to entertain the possibility.

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Mavigogun

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #21 - 11/05/19 at 05:15:07

oldNslow wrote on 11/04/19 at 20:37:09:

Empires run their course and are replaced. The US that we are familiar with as a world superpower is just about done. What it wili become is anybody's guess.

You've moved the football, Lucy. You've gone from impending civil war or disintegration of civil order and end of our Republic, now to merely the end of empire.

Ya, empires end. Surely you have the Romans in mind- a silly notion. The British, French, and Dutch empires all collapsed- leaving their parent states intact. Robust and thriving democracies, actually. We are not the Soviet Empire loosing control of vassal states.

That's a bit melodramatic, and a bit insulting, but I expect that from you now, so nevermind.

It's what you inspire; of course you expect it- it's the reaction you cultivate, then use as an excuse for dismissal.

If you've been there long you should be no stranger to natural disasters of the weather related kind.

Yes, we are confronted by many challenges, some unprecedented. Our world is changing, and we must change with it. That does not translate to the end of our Republic you prognosticate. You do not merely advocate for preparing for difficulty, but abandonment of our Union.

250 or so years. Done ... And I think it's grown about as much as we can stand already ... Buy the boat I showed you. Keep the fuel tank filled and the battery charged. Just in case ... This isn't going to end well. For any of us.

Any group effort depends on moral. Markets have tanked and people suffer for no other reason than fear and doubt. You are a peddler of fear, not pragmatic preparation. You are an oldNslow social termite. You are the sort that starts a panic rather than organize your community to action. You work against our Union.

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WebsterMark Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 13180 Gender:	Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same. Reply #22 - 11/05/19 at 05:27:20 .........so yea.....Mavi will be one of those people running around looking for water and prepackaged food to eat cause he won't start a fire because it will just add co2 to the air which he thinks is what caused the hurricane in the first place.....
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oldNslow

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #23 - 11/05/19 at 06:18:48

Quote:

You are an oldNslow social termite. You are the sort that starts a panic rather than organize your community to action. You work against our Union.

You know nothing whatsoever about My community. And I have worked on behalf of, and advocated for,our Union for my entire life.

But I can also see the writing on the wall. Scrawled there by foolish folks like you.

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Mavigogun

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #24 - 11/05/19 at 06:41:43

WebsterMark wrote on 11/05/19 at 05:27:20:

.........so yea.....Mavi will be one of those people running around looking for water and prepackaged food to eat cause he won't start a fire because it will just add co2 to the air which he thinks is what caused the hurricane in the first place.....

The topic here is the character of our Union after this political moment. I can understand why you'd rather not talk about that; you are, of course, free to not talk about it. Because of the lack of moderation in this space, you are also left to control yourself, Mark.

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Mavigogun

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #25 - 11/05/19 at 06:51:17

oldNslow wrote on 11/05/19 at 06:18:48:

But I can also see the writing on the wall. Scrawled there by foolish folks like you.

You know it's all just right up there for folks to read, right? Let's compare:

"I'll bank on those with energy to build and a future to look forward to any day over his ilk, sapping moral with their predictions of end times."

Vs

"250 or so years. Done ... And I think it's grown about as much as we can stand already ... Buy the boat I showed you. Keep the fuel tank filled and the battery charged. Just in case ... This isn't going to end well. For any of us."

The foolish writing is indeed "on the wall" for anybody to see. If, as claimed, you've worked your entire life for our Union, you do us all a disservice now. A strange and unlikely turn, that; I tend to believe more in the person you say you are now than the person you claim to have been then.

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raydawg

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #26 - 11/05/19 at 07:07:40

oldNslow wrote on 11/05/19 at 06:18:48:

Quote:

You are an oldNslow social termite. You are the sort that starts a panic rather than organize your community to action. You work against our Union.

You know nothing whatsoever about My community. And I have worked on behalf of, and advocated for,our Union for my entire life.

But I can also see the writing on the wall. Scrawled there by foolish folks like you.

Who said, "He played on our fears.......?"

It worked for him, he figgered out GW was a great fear monger, empowered him to much wealth. Grin

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #27 - 11/05/19 at 07:39:13

oldNslow wrote on 11/04/19 at 04:14:23:

Ray: same question.

If you do take the time, pay attention to the part where the author talks about the different stages that empires go through. Which one do you think the US is in right now. Most of the characteristics of that particular stage are things that you yourself have decried about the state of our nation.

Buddy....you are right about falling nations, and empires, its why I do not put much stock into man.....
How can I really expect a person(s) to provide my needs willingly?
Who can?

Will America fall.....who knows, however I do know many very wealthy folk, and entities, are heavily invested in her, and won't just shut up shop willingly, if capitalism comes under a great threat to its survival.....

I mean look, isn't that why the media is so active now, in this political/social arena.....???

They see their ability to gather that power, and wealth, is under attack and being minimized and challenge by other sources.....

Can you imagine the outrage, and defending, of/by the big wealthy giants in this global economy?

Anyway bro....
Here is some examples of biblical teachings I try to focus on, and gain the promises from understanding them....
Not preaching at ya, just sharing, its why I can be happy with a small boat Grin

From his prison cell, Paul wrote this message: "Don't worry about anything; instead, pray about everything. Tell God what you need, and thank him for all he has done. Then you will experience God's peace, which exceeds anything we can understand" (Philippians 4:6-7).

The psalmist wrote, "Enter his gates with thanksgiving; go into his courts with praise. Give thanks to him and praise his name. For the Lord is good. His unfailing love continues forever, and his faithfulness continues to each generation" (Psalm 100:4-5).

God's gates are always open to us. He's waiting for us, whenever we're upset and in need of a friend. We'll still feel the painful emotions. We don't just hand them over to God and expect them to disappear. But we can experience God's peace through prayer. Prayer is a useful tool to help us work through our problems. He will give us his peace, reminding us that he's there with us. For this, we can be thankful.

A life bathed in prayer is the best antidote for worry.

I don't need to worry over things I've no real knowledge of, or control....
For in reality, it might consume my attention away from the moment, as I stroll down the peaceful path out in the woods behind my house....
And so occupied, I didn't even see the mamma bear and her 2 cubs....
Which I shoulda be worried about and rightfully fearing Grin

Wish you well, hope you can find some relaxation bro....no need to hurry death, she'll get to each of us regardless. Wink

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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)

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WebsterMark

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #28 - 11/05/19 at 08:27:39

Mavigogun wrote on 11/05/19 at 06:41:43:

WebsterMark wrote on 11/05/19 at 05:27:20:

.........so yea.....Mavi will be one of those people running around looking for water and prepackaged food to eat cause he won't start a fire because it will just add co2 to the air which he thinks is what caused the hurricane in the first place.....

The topic here is the character of our Union after this political moment. I can understand why you'd rather not talk about that; you are, of course, free to not talk about it. Because of the lack of moderation in this space, you are also left to control yourself, Mark.

Stop....you're killing me Smalls....

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oldNslow

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Re: America post Trump, it can never be the same.
Reply #29 - 11/05/19 at 10:05:34

Quote:

Wish you well, hope you can find some relaxation bro....no need to hurry death, she'll get to each of us regardless.

I'll relax when I am dead. I'm too busy to concern myself about that right now. It hasn't snowed here yet, and it hasn't turned all that cold either; the motorcycles sitting in my garage aint gonna ride themselves.

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