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If it's immoral to use a wall (Read 550 times)
WebsterMark
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #60 - 12/30/18 at 05:47:23
 
batman wrote on 12/29/18 at 08:01:30:
 I was trying to show how silly it sounded to be spending 5 billion + on a wall that someone will find a way to go over, under , or around .   What are we building Fortress America? what ever happened to "give me your poor ,or tired and your weak"  America has become a runaway train ,flying off the rails ,and Trump is the engineer. Did the Berlin wall stop people from escaping ? If you think a wall will stop a determined people from entering this country to seek a better life ,than I think the dumbing down of America must be nearly complete . It is the people who think this wall will solve the problem that are obtuse.                    


Did the Berlin Wall stop people from escaping? Does a bear $hit in the woods? Yes to both! If the Berlin Wall didn't work, you wouldn't even know the phrase Berlin Wall. (What's the phrase for obtuse squared?)

And the whole "give us your poor"...blah, blah, blah.... You know immigrants who came over were screened before they got on the departing ships, screen again when they got here and sent back if they didn't meet a predefined criteria.

But you'll ignore those inconvenient facts and stay secure in your house. You know, the property you keep secure and give permission before anyone can enter or live there.

Bat, you lock your house doors, you lock your car doors and maybe even have a fence around your yard knowing full well a determined thief could gain entry given the time and without being spotted. A wall across the Southern border accomplishes the same thing. It prevents widespread, uncontested crossings like we are seeing now.

And by the way, someone explain how an illegal alien can get arrested on DUI twice, have gang sign tattoos and not be deported? He stuck around long enough to kill a cop. WTF?....
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thumperclone
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #61 - 12/30/18 at 08:19:22
 
fact:
the berlin wall didn't stop escapes some 5,000 were  successful
it did stop a mass exodus
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #62 - 12/30/18 at 08:49:13
 
A poem, attached to a statue, is a contract to flood our country with people who are not vetted, demonstrated as necessary and beneficial TO our society?
A POEM is our immigration policy?
You wanna talk about SILLY?
Ohhh, golly, it's a shame we are unable to
MONITOR the wall with technology and stop tunnels.
Of course just a tunnel, in the middle of nowhere, would be obvious.
I wonder if that's why the tunnels that have been found start
INSIDE of a building and go
To
ANOTHER BUILDING?

You don't expect 100% out of anything.
Pretending that since it's unreasonable to expect perfect performance, it's not worth doing.
Seatbelts save lives.
People get killed wearing them,too.
We NEED a wall.
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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #63 - 12/30/18 at 08:50:32
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 12/29/18 at 22:43:54:
Wanna dance with the words again?
You want to pretend the answer to
Well, which is it?
Changes the fact that they are not effective in protecting America?
I SAID it was
Politicized.
A wall doesn't Change POLICY.
It's a wall, every day, regardless of the people in office.
We need a wall.

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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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MnSpring
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #64 - 12/30/18 at 09:04:43
 
WebsterMark wrote on 12/30/18 at 05:47:23:
"... And by the way, someone explain how an illegal alien can get arrested on DUI twice, have gang sign tattoos and not be deported? He stuck around long enough to kill a cop. WTF?....

Simple, It’s Calf.
Where a SNEEK in Illegal, is protected.
Where a SNEEK in Illegal, is given help.
Where a SNEEK in Illegal, is taken better care of than,
victims of a fire, who have paid Taxes all their life,
who now have absolutely NOTHING.

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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thumperclone
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #65 - 12/30/18 at 09:09:24
 
we don't NEED a wall we need to
stop the market for the drug runners
create economic opportunities in 3rd word latin America
track and expel visa overstays, over 700k in 2017
use cheaper barriers
5b is less than 25% of the cost for a complete wall
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MnSpring
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #66 - 12/30/18 at 09:21:19
 
thumperclone wrote on 12/30/18 at 08:19:22:
fact: the berlin wall didn't stop escapes some 5,000 were  successful  it did stop a mass exodus

Just a couple of things to chew on:
About 11 MILLION illegal immigrant population in the United States. (PEW)
About 85,000 per year, of ‘refugees’ are brought in.
The Berlin Wall was up for 28 years. and the 5,000 (+/-) crossings were mostly in the first couple of years.
Still that only equates to about 180 a YEAR.
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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #67 - 12/30/18 at 09:29:37
 
MnSpring wrote on 12/30/18 at 09:21:19:
thumperclone wrote on 12/30/18 at 08:19:22:
fact: the berlin wall didn't stop escapes some 5,000 were  successful  it did stop a mass exodus

Just a couple of things to chew on:
About 11 MILLION illegal immigrant population in the United States. (PEW)
About 85,000 per year, of ‘refugees’ are brought in. This is wrong.  There are - on average - about 40,000 per year.  Stop lying.
The Berlin Wall was up for 28 years. and the 5,000 (+/-) crossings were mostly in the first couple of years.
Still that only equates to about 180 a YEAR.

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Serowbot
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #68 - 12/30/18 at 10:15:38
 
The Berlin wall was about 60 miles long,...
Hadrian's wall was about 70 miles...
...both were heavily guarded...(it was the guarding that prevented most crossings not the physical barrier).
Guards on Hadrian's wall were there for so long they no longer considered themselves Roman,... they were English... many English alive today have some Roman blood.
They assimilated into the culture.

3,000 miles... whole different can o' worms...

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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #69 - 12/30/18 at 13:38:56
 
JOG , I don't support the building of the wall no matter who proposes it, There is no evidence to support the longevity of any fixed instillation. They can all be circumvented.  Locks only keep the good people out. Why not use our money to boost the economy of Mexico, do we have an open border with Canada because their rich and go home after sending their money , why can't we have the same with our southern neighbors .The only difference between a man and a thief is a job. If the Mexican people had  decent paying jobs and a more promising future they wouldn't be trying to sneak into the country. Maybe it's time our leaders in D.C. showed a little bit more vision, and made NORTH AMERICA GREAT! That's much better than building a jail cell with only one wall.
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #70 - 12/30/18 at 13:46:18
 
Serowbot wrote on 12/30/18 at 10:15:38:
 ...3,000 miles... whole different can o' worms...

What is 3,000 long ?
If you are implying it is the South Boarder between the USA/Mexico.
That boarder is 1,954 long.
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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #71 - 12/30/18 at 15:03:48
 
"It's a wall, every day, regardless of the people in office.
We need a wall."


 Again:

 CBP staff, US ARMY Corp of Engineers, many many third party studies, ICE, US Navy, AZ National Guard, USMC, DHS, DE all indicate that a large full-length physical wall is not cost-effective compared to modern means.  Even if nobody is there to maintain it.  The ability to circumvent stone and concrete is so rudimentary humans have been doing it successfully for centuries, but this wall will be different.

 Why are they all wrong, and why do people who have never been to the border get to decide?

 You state its because they aren't doing a good enough job due to policy and that a physical full length wall is a resolution to the political budget and order allocation for the CBP, even though the people doing the job indicate that a physical wall won't be a resolution.

 At least Webstermark is smart enough to say cost is no issue so that mitigates the efficiency of cost to return by simply saying cost means nothing.

 Why do people who are doing the job now wrong and the people who have never done it right?
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #72 - 12/30/18 at 15:16:41
 
MnSpring wrote on 12/30/18 at 13:46:18:
Serowbot wrote on 12/30/18 at 10:15:38:
 ...3,000 miles... whole different can o' worms...

What is 3,000 long ?
If you are implying it is the South Boarder between the USA/Mexico.
That boarder is 1,954 long.

Oh?,.. well that's different then...  Grin Grin Grin
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MnSpring
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #73 - 12/30/18 at 15:25:06
 
Serowbot wrote on 12/30/18 at 15:16:41:
Oh?,.. well that's different then...  Grin Grin Grin


I would definitely consider 1/3, of a distance, relative.
Especially when that one third, is over, 1,000 miles.

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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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Serowbot
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Re: If it's immoral to use a wall
Reply #74 - 12/30/18 at 15:26:14
 
MnSpring wrote on 12/30/18 at 15:25:06:
Serowbot wrote on 12/30/18 at 15:16:41:
Oh?,.. well that's different then...  Grin Grin Grin


I would definitely consider 1/3, of a distance, relative.
Especially when that one third, is over, 1,000 miles.


Yeah,.. it so much more relates to a 70 mile wall... Roll Eyes

Hadrian guarded his 70 mile wall with about 10,000 men...
Counting for shifts and time off,... I guess we could do a 2,000 mile wall with about 500,000 men...

Heck,.. with modern technology maybe 100,000 men.
...but that's using the technology that says we don't need a wall anyway.

... or, maybe we just need better immigration policies, and sensible borders.
We could pretend we're not in the dark ages...
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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