Has it occurred to you, how much wilful ignorance is required, to believe in God?...
Evolution, astronomy, biology, geology, carbon dating, and on and on...
And all this, is based on belief in a God that has been determined by where in the world you were born more than any other factor.

In a hundred years, Christ and Allah will be looked upon as much myths as Zeus, Odin, Isis, Horus, or Mithra..
Many of which, including Jesus share the same stories.
Virgin birth, rise from the dead, the flood, healing the sick, restoring the blind, born on the solstice, died for your sins...
All repeats of myths long before.

So, what do you really believe in?...
Pagan myth wrapped in a Jewish man...

It is undeniable fact, that these myths pre-date Christ.
So, do you believe because of, or in spite of these stories?...
To believe the stories is Pagan,.. to disbelieve is sacrilege...

...to tell me I just can't possibly understand because I'm ignorant,... is delusional, false patronization...

 I don't think you can prove faith.  You can prove faith exists.

 I don't think anyone can answer all riddles.

My father in law, a former fanatic priest, "know" that God exist and he "knows" that Jesus died for our sins. If not, he claims, there would be nothing; no univers, no life, no meaning. He doesn't even want to play with the idea that he could actually be wrong. Not even as a thought experiment.

I do not respect him for that. I respect that people believe, that they have convictions. But when faith escalate into absolute "knowledge", I am lost. You can believe you have found what is right for you, but - like every other living human being - you cannot prove anything, hence you only hold an opinion like everybody else.

If having faith makes you feel better, then it is right for you. Personally, the more I study and discuss religion, the more I am convinced the religious are heading off in the right direction. Still, I am aware that I know nothing more - or less - than them and that I also believe when I think there is nothing god-like out there.

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 12:41:40:

What sustains you?

Life, I guess. And myself.

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 12:41:40:

Is it predicated on what others say or do?

No, I have never followed anybody, never had a hero, never had a mentor I would follow without question. That goes for everybody from authorities to family.

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 12:41:40:

What do you think the final outcome of your thoughts, actions, belief will be?

If you by final mean after I die, I expect to be permanently dead. My actions are generally good because I'm guided by my conscious and not my ego the majority of the time. And like those who believe in a god I hope to open eyes and be rational  

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 12:41:40:

Based on what?

Not quite sure what I should make of that question?

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 12:41:40:

What do you think you need to be happy?

As I sit here today, with wife, kids and grand children, I can say that I have done a lot to try and be a good husband, father and grandfather. I can also say, with the knowledge I have today, that I would be happier on my own. My life would have been very different, with far less focus on material values and far more focus on immaterial values. But my conscious will not allow me to leave the family behind, so I'm kinda stuck. Not that I have anything to complain about, with people generally valuing me well higher than I deserve.

Why do you come to this site and post?

raydawg wrote on 07/13/18 at 13:56:55:


Because I enjoy it would be the short answer.

MShipley wrote on 07/13/18 at 13:55:48:



Well, I am going to set myself up for ridicule here and say that one thing that make sense to me, is us being "created" or influenced by extra-terrestrial life. I am not saying this has happened, but it does fill in a lot of the missing dots.

If you read how cargo cults described aeroplanes and radio communication as well as the religions and rituals that followed, you will see that they are pretty familiar to descriptions found in the bible as well as the - to me - meaningless rituals upheld by various churches to this day.

This can also explain the missing link as well as our very rapid evolution pointed out by Hawking.

It can also explain the big number of huge construction/figures only visible from the air, as well as many other things difficult to explain.

Let's say Jesus was from another part of the universe. And let's say that he had the technology to fly to the edge of the Milky Way and back in 60 years - for him. That would mean 4 million years have passed here. So he has only aged a couple of weeks over the past 2000 years here on earth. So even if he plans to come back every annual vacation - for him - it is still a looooong time before you will see him on this grounds  

Of course, this is folly thoughts that are unlikely to be true, but they still make far more sense to me than the idea of a creating god.

PS! Whether you believe the human race is a couple of thousand or a couple of million years old, we are still very young compared to the universe. Now think how far we have developed over just the past century and imagine someone being at our stage 5 billion years ago - what would they be capable of today? Mind blowing, isn't it