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2020 -- new Intel failures & successes (Read 12299 times)
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successeshttp
Reply #210 - 03/24/19 at 21:27:16
 

https://i2.wp.com/static.techspot.com/articles-info/1613/images/Image_04.jpg?...



A new singing voice joins the Fat Lady Deathsong Auria, a worldwide rejoicing being sung at the demise of the Intel choke hold over the PC Industry

The Ryzen 7 2700 is marked down 25% on Amazon, making it possibly the best value CPU available right now. In games, AMD only a few percent slower than the Intel i7-9700K, which costs nearly double the AMD price at $410. The AMD Ryzen part looks especially good compared to the Intel i9-9900K, which costs 140% more.

Meanwhile, a 20% discount to the Ryzen 5 2600 means it annihilates the i5-8400, which performs roughly the same for $35 more. Thumbs up to AMD.

   Ryzen 5      Ryzen 5X      Ryzen 7      Ryzen 7X
MSRP          $200      $230      $300      $330
Amazon      $165      $190      $220      $290
Newegg      $165      $185      $250      $295

Zen 2 will offer up to 16 cores, faster speeds and PCIe 4.0, but it’s also expected to arrive at a bit of an initial price premium. If you already have a first gen Ryzen part and are looking for a high-end CPU upgrade for gaming, waiting is not a bad idea because the next generation will introduce performance levels Ryzen has never reached before. Professionals should also wait, as higher core counts will push productivity thresholds, too.

But for most people, buying these AMAZON discounted AMD processors could be a good idea.


Of course, that begs the question: how long do we have to wait?  Not very long, if new leaks are anything to go by.   Some Ryzen new product announcements will likely be made before Computex in May, but it is now clear that AMD has already told the Ryzen distribution channel to participate in some large inventory clearing events ASAP to move out their existing inventory as the new chips are already built and sitting in inventory awaiting the Computex release announcements.   And once the new AMD parts are available, anybody's old stock on hand at their warehouse isn't going to be so comparatively desirable.   Double ditto for the old Intel stock they may be carrying in warehouse stocks, as it will be 1) very very overpriced and 2) technically overlapped by AMD's newest generation at 7nm with wider faster internal data transfer pathways and multiple extra 7nm processor cores using much less power to run the AMD faster  more secure throughput .......

Intel is still acting somewhat arrogantly un-reactive expecting their Intel fanboys to pay over a 50% premium in addition to their old historically high Intel pricing just to have "Intel Inside" ---- this in an era where Intel is being run by a finance bean picker instead of a real CEO ---- Intel is being slowly eaten up alive with synthetically inflated overly high prices, some very serious production shortfalls and having to continuously run 3 required mitigation slowdowns due to being security risk contaminated by all the bad choices made by Intel's past management groups.    

Intel is not really even making a serious effort to reference off of AMD's much cheaper current pricing and higher relative performance levels, instead Intel simply says their processors are "better" when they demonstratively ARE NOT EVEN EQUIVALENT to AMD's best stuff any longer.  

Intel simply lies, in other words ......

This is all weakly excused on the plus side as acceptable by the excuse that "Intel is better for gaming" which is simply no longer true in a world that now has streamed gaming available that can run on a Chomebook just as well as it can on a powerhouse PC.

Remember, Intel does always require all three sequential slowdown mitigations for all three 3 major security issue groups (Spectre, Meltdown and Foreshadow).  Three (3) mitigations that depending on the task at hand can easily peel off 10% to 30% of the claimed Intel processing speeds when the processors are run in the real world.

And please remember, that the 3 Intel sequential mitigations ALWAYS takes at least a solid 10% off on all Intel processing speeds since you always have to run all of the 3 mitigations continuously all the time just to have "somewhat safe" computing on your Intel inside machine.

Tongue

So, AMD picks up a 10% to 30% speed boost relative to Intel because the Foreshadow exploit is not active against AMD at all and the mitigations for Spectre and Meltdown are both a lot less processor clock cycle consuming on AMD processors than they are on Intel processors.


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« Last Edit: 04/08/19 at 15:56:21 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #211 - 03/27/19 at 15:30:38
 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/99eebr/how_amd_triggered_a_core_race_by...

This refers to the last 12nm AMD release cycle, not the 7nm one that is upcoming in a month or so.  

The point to take here is that AMD has already thrashed Intel once just last year ...... and that was back at 12nm, not at 7nm which is the next EVEN BIGGER thrashing that AMD is getting ready to give to Intel.


   




These "predictive" graphs say that Intel is gonna get thrashed again like it is being done by a John Deere Combine during the second third and fourth quarters of this year .....
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« Last Edit: 03/29/19 at 07:00:37 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #212 - 03/29/19 at 05:38:51
 

 Are there larger timeframes of that data available somewhere?

 The largest span of change is only 30 days, has this happened before?
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #213 - 03/29/19 at 06:20:16
 

Top two graphs are in years, bottom set of 3 graphs cover the little tail end flip up at the very end of the top two graphs (for clarity).

Intel has never been quite this stupid before.   Way way out of date technologically, trying to compete by adding old tech cores to keep up with AMD's new 7nm stuff in a core count race that has extended to the point INTEL HAS RUN COMPLETELY OUT of old core production capability .....  and Intel's plans for their next "10nm lithography level" have crumbled under their feet due to Intel not buying new ASML current lithography machines.

You are looking at short term last quarter's German sales data in these graphs,  data that supposedly predicts market trends that are going to be becoming real world-wide in the next few months as AMD accelerates on ahead of Intel.   Mindware.de is supposedly a predictor of general worldwide buying trends .... so treat Mindware.de data with a grain of salt if you wish but they have had some past success in predicting building future trends.

Intel's bean picker CEO has got to get the finished production numbers of completely functional cores back up AND get those processor cores modernized and do both of these things fairly quickly.  

So far he has just maximized profit taking during a period of adversity ......  (he's a bean picker, what did you expect ?  He does what he knows how to do.)

Do I expect Intel to recover from this stumble?   Yes, they will change their CEO again,  spend some more money and time on new processes and eventually get to a competitive winning posture again.

However, right now I see Intel being currently sapped by multiple layers of bad past choices done by past managements, eaten up ongoing by the three large required security mitigations to cover the security risks they created by the extensive use of predictive calculation and lastly, hamstrung by the long lead times required to get into new production technologies (Intel still hasn't placed orders for any new ASML production lines).

If Intel doesn't show some clear steps in the right directions soon, they may indeed go down the toilet bowl whirlpool swirl yet even deeper .....
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« Last Edit: 04/17/19 at 19:26:32 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #214 - 03/29/19 at 19:39:04
 

https://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/2019/03/intel-lays-off-hundreds-of-...

"If Intel doesn't show some clear steps in the right directions soon, they may indeed go down the toilet bowl whirlpool swirl yet even deeper ....."

Gosh, no sooner than I type it, it takes place -- is it possibly magical or what, I ask you.

“Changes in our workforce are driven by the needs and priorities of our business, which we continually evaluate. We are committed to treating all impacted employees with professionalism and respect,”  Intel said in a brief statement acknowledging the cuts to The Oregonian/OregonLive.

The white collar layoffs numbered in the multiple hundreds, according to people with direct knowledge of the cuts who asked not to be identified because they were not authorized to speak about their employer.

Intel confirmed the layoffs but declined to specify how many people lost their jobs, what the jobs were or to describe the rationale for the cutbacks.

The cuts took place at sites across the company, including Oregon, Intel’s largest site with 20,000 workers. A person with direct knowledge of the cuts said the Oregon layoffs were in proportion to those elsewhere.   A grand total is not known at this time.

Cuts also took place at other Intel facilities in the United States and at a large administrative facility in Costa Rica, according to people familiar with the layoffs.

Though Intel forecasts flat sales in 2019, people inside the company said this week’s layoffs don’t appear to be strictly a cost-cutting move. Rather, they said the cuts appeared to reflect a broad change in the way Intel is approaching its internal technical systems.

Aa an example of this sort of consolidation/cutback,  Intel has previously used several information technology contractors. An internal memo obtained by The Oregonian/OregonLive said Intel will now consolidate operations under a single contractor, the Indian technology giant Infosys.


The Big Change as known stated in a nutshell ---- Intel is offloading "technical management" as a complete management function primarily to outsourcing folks like the Indian technology giant Infosys.  

Why?  Intel has no strong technical visionary at the helm any longer, just a promoted finance bean picker.  This CEO is somewhat contemptuous of the current crop of technological people that he manages.  They can't do what he asks them to do so who needs to pay them those fat salaries any more?  Get rid of them.  

Hire younger "currently skilled" less costly replacements from IBM and AMD.  This is seen as a simple non-visonary non-technical bean picker type of move as Intel battens the hatches down tighter for the next year's worth of market share losses.

If you wanted to see this as a "fall back and regroup" by Intel's bean picker CEO in the face of ever increasing competition, you could.   You could also see this as an attempt to co-opt outside company talent and strengths that Intel certainly no longer has internally.   If you were charitable, you could see it as the start of a "cut and build plan" (with the build part still pending).

It is hard to see it as any part of a roadmap that is actually leading out of the existing Intel tar pit that Chipzilla finds itself so firmly mired into ......    

It is a bean picker knee jerk reaction type move, nothing more.
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« Last Edit: 04/02/19 at 06:09:53 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #215 - 03/31/19 at 08:52:43
 

https://wccftech.com/amd-epyc-server-cpu-7nm-market-share-2020-report/

AMD All Set To Capture 10% of the Total Server CPU Market by 2020, Report Indicates – Will Secure Even More New Customer Deals With 7nm EPYC CPUs Due To Strong Price / Performance Leadership



AMD seems to be on the path to capture major server processor market share from Intel in the coming years. In the latest report from DigiTimes, it is stated that AMD is all set to challenge the blue team in server processor market dominance, capturing a major chunk of its market share by 2020.

The report suggests that Intel’s server processor market share is likely to fall below 90% by the end of 2020 which means that AMD would manage to capture at least 10% of the market share by that time. The reasoning behind this is that AMD’s EPYC processors continue to secure more deals and orders from server vendors and cloud service providers.

Intel’s server processor market share is likely to fall below 90% by the end of 2020, as AMD with its EPYC series continues to attract more orders from server vendors and cloud service providers, according to market sources.

Because of the EPYC series’ strong price/performance ratio and AMD’s plan of releasing its next-generation 7nm datacenter processors codenamed Rome later in 2019, demand for the AMD-based servers has been rising.

Cloud providers such as Amazon are continuously investing in more EPYC CPUs rather than Intel Xeon CPUs. Amazon recently announced new Amazon EC2 instances featuring custom AMD EPYC 7000 series processors. With AMD EPYC CPUs, these M5ad and R5ad instances run with higher CPU performance (2.5 GHz SKUs) and feature low latency NVMe storage subsystems.

Amazon EC2 instances now feature AMD EPYC 7000 series processors with an all core turbo clock speed of 2.5 GHz.

The AMD-based instances provide additional options for customers and may offer a better fit for many workloads that do not fully utilize the compute resources. By optimizing the balance between compute resources and utilization, these instances provide a 10% lower cost than comparable instances.

In addition to Amazon, Japan-based NTT Data will also be procuring datacenters with AMD EPYC processors. There’s also the upcoming Atos BullSequana XH2000 Supercomputer which will be using a total 3125 AMD EPYC Rome 7nm processors with around 200,000 cores and 400,0000 CPU threads and is expected to finish by 2020.

Considering the traction that AMD EPYC CPUs are getting, it’s reasonable to say that the 10% figure is very conservative as we could be looking at an even higher server market share by 2020 for AMD CPUs given that they land in more orders from server vendors. AMD’s market share for Q4 2018 was 3.2% and that was a huge gain from their 2017’s 0.8% market share and null prior to EPYC’s release.





AMD's hard work on the big iron chiplet system is paying off all the way down the AMD processor line up.   All the tricks AMD develops to make the big 64 core chiplets better and better simply leads directly into the smaller displacement consumer Ryzen chiplet sets carrying the big iron's improved higher efficiency numbers and the big iron's improved wide wide wide data pathways.  

In many cases it is thought that AMD's big iron 7nm chiplets ARE ACTUALLY ARE THE EXACT SAME THING as the A-4 size Ryzen 4-16 core 7nm consumer chiplets ......  as the big iron components were created first and were proven out first through extensive rack space testing.   Ryzen chiplets come from the faster end of the sorting pool as big iron runs much lower mhz speeds at much greater efficiency so the slower chips are fine to use in the Epyc rack space chipsets.

This also makes sense on a design and manufacturing viewpoint, as consolidation of the chiplet designs means MORE FLEXIBILITY in assembling what is needed when it is needed, simply pulling from a common pool of pre-sorted inexpensive mass produced 7nm chiplet wafers.  

When product differentiation is needed, it can be put into the 14nm I/O chip that is the center of each unique product.   This means the actual 7nm chiplets can be the same design whenever possible.

AMD can warehouse large amounts of the 7nm base components and assemble what is needed as either EPYC or as RYZEN right when they need to ship it.   AMD knows which 7nm chiplets can do faster mhz for consumer because every individual chiplet is tested --- big iron neither wants nor needs the high mhz speeds (the entire big iron rack space unit runs at lower frequency compared to a consumer unit) so AMD simply uses the faster end of the sorting spectrum to bash on Intel's finest Core i9 Consumer processors and at the same time AMD uses the slower end of the sort at their very highest efficiency settings to price/value bash Intel's big rack space monstrosities.

Please note:  AMD charges approximately 55% less money for a faster rackspace chipset, comparing against the nearest spec'd Intel processor pair.  Yep, this is because it takes two Intel processors on a special dual socket motherboard to run against (and fail against) AMD's single EPYC processor).    And 7nm EPYC uses approximately 65% less energy to run and to cool compared against current Intel rack space products.

Payback period for a 7nm EPYC rack unit is less than 2 years, based simply on reduced purchase cost and energy savings.   Increased throughput extends this benefit when expressed in processing dollars.

Big Iron racks units don't get ripped out and replaced all that often, older units get re-assigned less demanding tasks instead.   This 10% annual number is what generally turns over each year, and this means Intel is going to be really hurting in the rack space arena as between the new ARM custom built servers (AMAZON) coming on more and more and these faster value packed generic AMD EYPC servers, most folks simply don't see Intel selling in much more than Xenon failure replacements for this year and next year.




        Roll Eyes       Intel can't win for losing, in other words .......



====================================================



AMD EPYC Rome CPUs Were Designed To Compete Favorably Against Intel’s 10nm Ice Lake-SP Processors

It should also be pointed out that when AMD was designing their 7nm Zen 2 based EPYC Rome processors, they had internally estimated what the performance of Intel’s next-gen server part would be like. The next-gen 10nm part known as Ice Lake-SP is scheduled to launch for 2020 with Cascade Lake-SP and Cooper Lake-SP being offered as an intermediary solution based on 14nm (++) while the Cascade Lake-AP and Cooper Lake-AP would be designed as a multi-core HPC part.

“Rome was designed to compete favorably with “Ice Lake” Xeons, but it is not ever going to be competing against that class of chip because Intel has failed in that execution completely.   We are incredibly excited, and for us it is all coming together at this one point in time in just a few weeks.”  –--  Forrest Norrod AMD Senior vice president and general manager of the Datacenter and Embedded Solutions Business Group at AMD.

“Our plan for the Naples-Rome-Milan roadmap was based on assumptions around Intel’s roadmap and our estimation of what would we do if we were Intel,” Norrod continues.

“We thought deeply about what Intel is like, what they are not like, what their culture is and what their likely reactions are, and we planned against a very aggressive Intel roadmap, and really both Rome and Milan and what comes after them was designed against what we thought Intel could do. And then, we come to find out that they can’t do what we thought they might be able to. And so, we have an incredible opportunity laid out in front of us.


AMD has confirmed that their EPYC Rome processors have been designed to compete favorably against Intel’s Ice Lake designs, Ice Lake designs that will never arrive inside the next ~2~ years.

This only means that AMD would have an even greater edge versus the Intel 14nm++ server parts arriving this year and next year.   If/when the time comes that Intel's 10nm Ice Lake actually finally does arrive, AMD will have been actually shipping their next generation of 5nm lithography chiplets for at least part of an entire year.  

Yes, Intel is that far behind.




===================================================



https://wccftech.com/amd-ceo-computex-2019-keynote-ryzen-3000-cpu-and-radeon-...

AMD confirmed that they will be introducing the said next-gen products, offering key details as to what the general audience should expect from the respective CPU/GPU lineups. Now I’ve been stating this for a while that AMD’s Ryzen 3000 series and Radeon RX Navi GPUs always had their announcements planned for Computex 2019 but it looks like we may get a launch later in July as previously reported.

Looking at the current schedule and 7nm roadmap, AMD could push the launch ahead and go live with these products at Computex 2019 but if that doesn’t happen, we should still expect to hear some good details including a live demo of the final Ryzen 3000 series processors during the event.

Upcoming products include 7nm AMD EPYC datacenter processors, 3rd Gen AMD Ryzen desktop processors and graphics cards based on the next-generation “Navi” architecture – all of which are designed to create exceptional experiences for gamers and creators as well as help solve many of the toughest challenges in our lives. During the CEO Keynote, Dr. Lisa Su and other high-profile guests will highlight new details of upcoming products and showcase how the industry is building a new high-performance computing ecosystem that will push technology to the next level.

Here’s What To Expect From The AMD Ryzen 3000 Series Processors
The AMD Ryzen 3000 lineup is based on the new Zen 2 core architecture which is made possible with TSMC’s bleeding edge 7nm process node. AMD has reaffirmed that their Zen 2 based Ryzen 3000 series processors for the AM4 desktop platform will be available in mid of 2019. We are now hearing multiple reports of a possible launch in early July and that might be it as far as the launch day is concerned for the new desktop processors.

AMD has made significant changes to their CPU architecture which help deliver twice the throughput of their first generation Zen architecture. The major points include an entirely redesigned execution pipeline, major floating point advances with doubled the floating point to 256-bit and double bandwidth for load/store units. One of the key upgrades for Zen 2 is the doubling of the core density which means we are now looking at 2x the core count for each core complex (CCX).

Improved Execution Pipeline
Doubled Floating Point (256-bit) and Load/Store (Doubled Bandwidth)
Doubled Core Density
Half the Energy Per Operation
Improved Branch Prediction
Better Instruction Pre-Fetching
Re-Optimized Instruction Cache
Larger Op Cache
Increased Dispatch / Retire Bandwidth
Maintaining High Throughput for All Modes



Zen 2 also includes stronger hardware level enhancements when it comes to security. This further solidifies AMD CPUs against enhanced Spectre variants and these mitigations will be adopted fully by the Zen 2 architecture. When it comes to Zen 2, AMD already had strong software level support when it came to security and they have further enhanced it through low-level software mitigations.
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« Last Edit: 04/03/19 at 13:30:17 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #216 - 04/01/19 at 21:19:30
 

Wacky Prediction time .....

Intel really doesn't have a plan for expanding their 14mn production.

They realize that they are going to lose so much market share this year they actually have more than enough 14nm production capacity already, when all the furor and all the blood and dust finally settles.

Intel's 10nm plan is the same as it has always been -- it isn't a real plan, it never was and it  will never really happen -- new excuses and new delays will be made up as needed.  11-12nm is as good as Intel's current equipment can do AFTER it has been upgraded.

This is the Intel bean picker CEO's REAL executive plan for the next 2 years.   Protect the stock price by any means necessary.  Gouge the hell out of his installed base for every penny he can by heavy price gouging and lying.  Use delay and smoke screen freely as much as is needed.

Tongue

When this actually changes, we will actually see some Intel 5nm-7nm ASML production equipment orders hitting the ASML waiting list.   Watch this ASML waiting list -- it says plainly who is doing what for the next 2 years .....

You will see the very first 11-12nm Intel big-little cores and chiplet designs come out from Intel later this year as copying ARM Holdings and AMD's ideas is simply what Intel does now-a-days.


Some of these Intel runs may be at a real 11-12nm size, some will claim to be 10nm but take that with a grain of salt as current production Intel 10nm really isn't 10nm as Intel's installed lithography isn't really up to 10nm (as proven by the many many many failed 10nm trial lots).




===================================================



IBM and Google are actually showing some real progress on Quantum Computing, but nobody in the customer real world really seems to understand what Quantum Computing is or what "advantageous things" it will do for you.    

Here is a readable, easy to understand catch up on what Quantum is and what it can do for you .....  hint, it isn't going into your earbuds any time soon as it still fills up whole small rooms and uses liquid nitrogen for cooling (still primitive).

https://www.itweb.co.za/office/in2ittech/content/kLgB17eJPYzM59N4

Best explanation yet, very NON-technical and fairly easy to read and understand.

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« Last Edit: 04/17/19 at 14:18:27 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #217 - 04/02/19 at 14:49:03
 

https://liliputing.com/2019/04/periodic-reminder-that-you-drm-means-you-dont-...

If you ever bought anything out of the MS Store (programs, e-books, movies, or other content) please take a second and read this.

MS is shutting down that e-book portion of the MS store and they plan to SHUT DOWN your ability to use what you paid for.

Digital Rights Management -- in MS's world you don't own anything, remember?     Tongue

And them trying to give you a $25 credit amount because they are shutting down your access to what you bought is a crock since you originally bought something that was way overpriced as listed in the MS store originally -- and they had taken your full value dollars back then and are now just giving you something for your $25 credit that carries another way overly inflated price in exchange yet again..... which puts you on the short end of that particular stick twice now and likely owing some more real money once again ......

Undecided          Embarrassed         Sad
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« Last Edit: 04/02/19 at 18:58:49 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #218 - 04/02/19 at 19:20:46
 

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-cascade-lake-xeon-optane,6061-4.html



Intel trots out their new bean picker CEO to try to explain their proposed new dual socket Xenon-Optane motherboard plus co-processors plus other stuff package that also has to have three different types of separate special Optane memory boards and a separate FPGA processor and a HUGE Ethernet communications card involved in the mix -- all supposedly working together to compete against the new single chip AMD EPYC processors that are 1) faster and 2) take far less than half the energy that Intel needs (400 watts is just for the dual Intel CPUs and Intel is holding mum about how much energy the rest of the stuff requires).  The AMD EPYC single socket CPU has more and faster cores and COSTS WAY WAY WAY LESS THAN HALF OF THE TOTAL INTEL PRICE TAG.






Yep, that is a book sized Optane SSD in that lexan block and below it is a heat sinked Optane buffer card that is the length of a standard laptop just to get it all to go fast ......

You also have to fill up the RAM slots in your motherboard completely with lots of expensive Optane RAM cards.
 These Optane RAM cards by themselves costs $850 --- you can expect the other Intel items to run up to similar amounts of money.

OK, how do you get this Intel mishmash to try to work as a unit -- you need a HUGE separately programmable Ethernet communications card of course with super high speed Ethernet running in between the various plug in cards and memory buses.   This separate motherboard mounted communications card by itself dumps more heat and more wasted watts than the AMD EPYC processor takes period.  Ditto for the heat loving always watt sucking three separate types of Optane memory that are also required by the composite Intel system.



Intel's huge programmable Ethernet adapters don't draw as many flashbulbs normally, but in this case they serve as a key strategic asset for the company by acting as the glue that binds all the disparate Intel stuff together. Intel's new 800 Series adapters offer up to 100Gbps port speeds and support the new ADQ (Application Device Queue) feature that partitions network traffic into dedicated swim-lanes to boost performance significantly. The adapters also support Dynamic Device Personalization (DPP) profiles that enable smart packet sorting to route data intelligently. These adapters also support RDMA via iWARP and RoCE v2.

56 Cores, 112 Threads, 6 major components (some on separate boards) and a Whole Lotta current draw for the whole entire "you gotta buy it all on a new motherboard" Intel package.    

The AMD alternative is comparatively small, much lower cost, can run on your existing EYPIC motherboard using your old memory while being much more power efficient and simpler to implement.  AMD has already made some market share headway with its existing EPYC data center processors, but the company’s forthcoming 7m Rome processors pose an even bigger threat to Intel with up to 64 cores and 128 threads packed into a single socket and chip, wielding a massive 128 cores and 256 threads in a single server die instead of an entire rack full of Intel stuff.

The increased performance, and reduced power consumption of AMD EPYC purportedly outweighs Intel’s existing lineup of Xeon processors, so Intel has turned to a completely new line of "entire new system is required" Cascade Lake-AP co-processors to shore up its defenses in the high core-count space. These new co-processor heavy motherboard packages slot in as a new upper tier of Intel's Xeon Platinum lineup.

These new two 9000-series (with 2 sockets and 4 co-processing items required)  come packing up to a total of 56 cores and 112 threads in a dual-CPU die dual socket MCM (Multi-Chip Module) design ---- meaning that the two processor sockets and processor dies come together with four other major components in order to form a "single chip".  

Intel claims the disparate co-processor system offer the highest-performance available for HPC, AI, and IAAS workloads. The co-processors also offer the most memory channels, and thus access to the highest memory bandwidth, of any data center processor. Performance density, high memory capacity, and blistering memory throughput are the goal here, which plays well to the HPC crowd. This approach signifies Intel's embrace of a disparate multi-card multi-chip design, similar to AMD's EPYC processor's single die, for its highest core-count models.
  Yeah, it takes all that huh?

If this doesn't read like it is actual or real or even really very technically feasible, remember it is being put out there by a brand new Intel bean picker CEO who is just reading the teleprompter slides -- he is contemptuous of his own people with the required technical expertise as he only believes in PR and stock price protection activities.   And that is what he is doing -- using an improbable wad of BS PR announcements over several disparate Intel products to protect his faltering stock price.   He has no intention of ever really making any of these conglomerated monstrosities, it is all for show so he can preserve that all important stock price.

Needless to say, it is doubtful that Intel will sell any of these mash ups at the price Bob Swan would want for one, even if he could get it to really work at all.


===================================================




Remember, it takes all of that 6 pieces of disparate (and desperate) Intel stuff hooked up together inside a single rack case sucking in lots and lots and lots of power to not quite equal the throughput and speed of what Lisa Su is holding up in her dainty little hand.    Lisa's stuff is real and has been shipping test programming samples to key AMD vendors for months now (the public shipping announcement for the completed vendor units and updated vendor motherboards is inside 26 days to take place at the May 27th AMD keynote address at Computex 2019)  ---  Intel's homegrown BS fictional stuff is a vague, sometimes in "late 2019, early 2020" and is unlikely to ever be really sold to anyone possessing both a brain and a price - benefit analysis speadsheet.

Bob, what are you gonna do when AMD drops down to 5nm chiplets and increases the core count before you can even start shipping this somewhat smelly Frankenstein mess ????

Worse yet, suppose the existing already built and warehoused EPYC Rome 7nm Server Processor actually already has 162 PCIe Gen 4 Lanes of data throughput, more than twice as much as Intel's Xenon 9200 will have (if and when they get produced and shipped as promised -- mebbe inside the next 2 years that is ......)
           Grin
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #219 - 04/04/19 at 19:23:10
 

https://wccftech.com/tsmc-5nm-production-euv/[url][/url]

TSMC 5nm Risk Production Starts; Process Delivers 15% Performance Gain at this time
(with further performance increases expected as more fine tuning is done)

Except for Intel, foundries all over the world are moving fast with next-generation lithography and manufacturing processes.   Now, TSMC has commenced full risk production for 5nm and has validated the process design with its OIP (Open Innovation Platform) partners. Take a look below for more details.



Additionally, the fab has confirmed that 5nm has indeed finally entered risk production.  This is right on schedule according to plans disclosed by TSMC last year.  

The 5nm process allows for 1.8X logic density and 15% performance increase on a Cortex A72 core when compared to TSMC’s 7nm. At this point, we’re uncertain about which 7nm process TSMC is referring to here. The company’s first generation 7nm (present on the Apple A12 and Qualcomm Snapdragon 855) uses DUV lithography, while its 7nm+ node based on the N7+ process uses EUV lithography.


OK, 7nm++++ is officially known as 5nm, and as a real production process 5nm is working out jest fine in the real world.   The latest ASML production equipment sold this year can do both 5nm and 7nm+++ at will, with some of the current new wave crew pushing it a bit (Samsung in particular) on down to 3nm for memory production.

Apple wants to produce some very large volumes of iPhone chips at 5nm and Apple is pushing TSMC to get ready to do this --- to get ready for 5nm volume production ASAP.

7nm is getting pretty "standard" now and the real front runners who have been at 7nm for two years now all want to roll down a lithography notch to preserve their "unique" and "super cool" factor.

A 15% performance upper and 20% energy savings bump PLUS GETTING TWICE AS MANY CHIPS PER WAFER COMPARED TO 10nm are the worthwhile bonuses companies are looking for by rolling over to 5nm just as fast as they can get there.


Intel is a different story.   Intel still can't get 10nm to work correctly.  Intel still has not purchased any of the current ASML production lines and is not even listed on the published ASML waiting list.

AMD is an OIP technology partner with TSMC and AMD is indeed getting trial runs of AMD chiplets done at 5nm so they can begin working on fine tuning the new 5nm level of lithography.



===================================================


Another voltage divide is occurring at the 5nm level.   We realize that the voltage divides that occurred at 12 volts, 5.5 volts and at 3 volts actually divided the market up into have and have not groups when the entire VENDOR SUPPLY BASE rolled down to the next lower voltage level and began charging a large premium to supply the old voltage items that some computer makers were still stuck at.  

The voltage divide is now not at 3.3 volts, but will be at 0.9 volts starting at the 5nm lithography level.   Your screen and your cellular radio is now the highest voltage requiring item in your phone, and that stays at 3.3 volts I am afraid, so no serious divide effects are foreseen for this next generation lithography drop.

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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #220 - 04/05/19 at 06:59:33
 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/05/wells-fargo-downgrades-intel-on-weak-2019-dem...

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/intel-stock-falls-after-wells-fargo-downgra...

https://www.thestreet.com/markets/intel-slips-after-wells-fargo-downgrades-ch...


Oh, how embarrassing for Intel ........ the official FAT LADY for Intel is Wells Fargo ?!!?

Wells Fargo  (Wells Fargo, of all people, I mean really, Wells Fargo.   Talk about pots calling kettles black .....)  has just downgraded Intel due to weak 2019 demand and increased AMD competition.

"Weak semi demand data points thus far in 2019, coupled with an expectation of cautious outlooks into [the second quarter of 2019], leave us to consider some downside risk" to estimates for the first half of the year for Intel shares, Wells Fargo analyst Aaron Rakers wrote in a note to investors.


Stock price for Intel immediately dropped OVER a percentage point, and increased to over a 2% drop inside hours and the Intel stock price is still down but moving back up very slowly.  

Expect even more unannounced illegal point stock repurchases by Intel shills to continue and to increase sharply simply to stop this market dip and stage something of a visible mini-recovery before close of trading today.

This is also being seen by some as a vote of "no market confidence" on Intel CEO Bob Swan after his EMBARASSINGLY BAD teleprompter reading presentation yesterday on "the new innovative Intel rack space processor set".  Anyone watching that stumbling slightly technically ridiculous presentation would realize you had somebody behind the mic that really didn't understand what he was talking about (or worse, he didn't think what he was saying was true, which is actually even worse when you think about it).

Intel is now FOUR lithography levels behind the market leaders, perhaps that fact also plays in this Wells Fargo decision to downgrade Intel's stock price a bit ???
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #221 - 04/05/19 at 22:16:09
 

Remember, Intel is in no danger of failing as a company simply due to losing ground in the PC arena.   PC is only 15% - 25% of Intel's total business at this time.   The rest of Intel is well diversified, with many small pet markets where they have NO competition to oppose them.

What threatens Intel the most is becoming Price Noncompetitive in any of their pet markets due to higher cost, an effect that we already can see developing in some cases, with PC just being one case.

First, it only requires a serious COMPETITOR to appear, and Intel has intentionally moved into international market niches where it has no serious competitor AT ALL as its opening modus operandi.

At 14nm lithography Intel is good enough and efficient enough to compete on price in most of their selected market niches and Intel can discourage any new players from entering into their pet market niches by using the black bag tricks that they have mastered over the years.

Some pundits consider TSMC to be Intel's real competitor, with ARM and AMD being just the distributors of the competitive technology that is disrupting Intel.   Other pundits consider ARM's chip designs as Intel's real competitor, as it is the chip designs that actually make the win lose once the hardware can be built by any of the various paid foundries.

Once Intel can no longer compete, they can simply choose to withdraw and then refocus on the niches where they can get the most bang for their buck.

This is what we are seeing in PC --- a decision to withdraw once Intel can't make 14nm do the job for them any more.   Intel can find other uncontested places to vend their 14nm wares as the world becomes more and more computer driven.

This is also why an Intel processor is a intentionally generic sort of thing that can do MANY MANY jobs fairly well, well enough anyway.   Make them and sell them by the billions, that's Intel.

RISC-V systems (open source hardware and software acting together) are threatening to become "Intel's real competition" as the RISC-V competitor jumps up from a crowdfunding campaign practically overnight, then open sources the entire affair as the hardware and software are proven out together by a cooperative effort.

Once proven out, the designs can then be reused by anyone who is a RISC-V supporter, and many existing computing and internet companies have indeed already signed up to be RISC-V supporting members as they would be stupid not to.

Intel's generic designs will never be able to beat a full on "built from scratch" design that was carefully built to do just that one particular job, a design that is then free to be used and modified by a RISC-V member just by placing an order with a supporting foundry (the foundry just calls up the proven out design that is already programmed on their direct burn 7nm EUV line and makes you up the needed wafer counts for that particular order).   Six months from crowdfunding to first shipments, Intel can't do anything that fast including scratch their head in amazement.

And please don't think RISK-V cannot be used to build a desktop PC running Linux or Android.   Already been there and done that -- successfully I might add.

https://abopen.com/news/building-a-risc-v-pc/



And here is another big point to remember -- the general Joe Sixpack consumer today really has NO IDEA of what chipset actually resides inside his device, and could really care less as long as it works fast enough when he hits the go button.


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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #222 - 04/09/19 at 06:53:52
 
 
German Mindshare.de First Quarter sales data for 2019 is in.   AMD is still outselling Intel 2-1 in individual chip sales, verging on a 5-1 ratio for some of the more poplar AMD models.

The Big Box finished unit sales still tend to be the more expensive gaming rigs, and there sales still tilt more towards the Intel boxes.  Sales of large expensive gaming rigs are light at the moment, with the main flow of gaming sales going towards the Xbox/PlayStation sort of device.

The gaming stations are almost 100% AMD based now.   This has been consistent for over a year now.

New Finished PC Units announced are predominately AMD based and tend towards the middle to lower total power range.   This is also about the fact that AMD's middle to lower power level is as strong as the very best Intel ever was a couple of years ago.  Smart shoppers know this and buy accordingly.

New Unit Sales is different from the Total Installed Units comparisons.   Watch this point when folks throw numbers around a lot, it is VERY misleading when they get them mixed up.   Total Installed Units total data is old enough to say that Win 7 is still the dominant OS installed on the machines comprising this data ......  

Some Stuff to remember as we head into the big AMD ZEN 3000 announcements for 7nm production .......



IT IS ALL BASED ON THIS STUFF .....
The new AMD tech is this server tech, with some of the EPYC chiplets actually being the exact same as the RYZEN chiplets in some cases.
 

The AMD Ryzen 3000 lineup is based on the new Zen 2 core architecture which is made possible with TSMC’s bleeding edge 7nm process node. AMD has reaffirmed that their Zen 2 based Ryzen 3000 series processors for the AM4 desktop platform will be available in mid of 2019. We are now hearing multiple reports of a possible launch in early July and that might be it as far as the launch day is concerned for the new desktop processors.

AMD has made significant changes to their CPU architecture which help deliver twice the throughput of their first generation Zen architecture. The major points include an entirely redesigned execution pipeline, major floating point advances with doubled the floating point to 256-bit and double bandwidth for load/store units. One of the key upgrades for Zen 2 is the doubling of the core density which means we are now looking at 2x the core count for each core complex (CCX).

Improved Execution Pipeline
Doubled Floating Point (256-bit) and Load/Store (Doubled Bandwidth)
Doubled Core Density
Half the Energy Per Operation
Improved Branch Prediction
Better Instruction Pre-Fetching
Re-Optimized Instruction Cache
Larger Op Cache
Increased Dispatch / Retire Bandwidth
Maintaining High Throughput for All Modes


So, Lisa Su actually sandbagged very strongly at her last big show presentation because Intel had totally failed in their 10nm execution and all the advanced items AMD had prepped for use against Intel 10nm were not needed at all, any whatsoever in the last six months.  

So Lisa Su totally sandbagged on all that advanced 10nm Intel beating stuff, very very strongly sandbagging all the new features she could have shown in her previous show presentations.

She did this SPECIFICALLY to allow more time for more of AMD's old 12nm inventory to sell through at full price, and indeed AMD is even now hosting a MASSIVE Retail Discount Push to try to move all the rest of the old AMD 12nm inventory all the way out of the way before the new AMD 7nm stuff arrives in a few months.

AMD knows that the new 7nm stuff will sell much much better than the old 12nm stuff did to the point if AMD doesn't help their vendors to move out all their old 12nm inventory then their vendor base might take some damage when the new 7nm stuff makes the old 12nm stuff relatively undesirable and "obsolete".    

The vendors have got to move the 12nm products before it becomes un-moveable.

Since some of the most recent 7nm AMD advances are all server sized pipeline widths, greatly increased pipeline through puts and various other basic structural changes, these changes have got to come out now anyway.   Ditto for the 7nm chiplet structure being like the server/rackspace structure and all the advancements based on that.   If you think some of the consumer RYZEN data handling, floating point and branch prediction is going to be more like mainframe/server/rackspace type stuff, you are correct in that particular thought.

Look to see Intel Consumer processors drop way behind the leader at this point in time, almost shamefully far behind.   Intel consumer can't compete on a wide range of features any more.

Intel is gonna be playing catch up from now on --- extending out for around 5 years to a decade or thereabouts.


===================================================


Understand what comes after 7nm and why it will arrive so very quickly.

5nm is what it is called.   It it can run on some of the most current ASML equipment that was purchased for 7nm production, so all players can take advantage of the 14-20% speed and efficiency improvements.   You can also get twice as many wafers off your silicon wafer when compared to 10nm, so that is another good reason to use 5nm.

The final reason is one Intel cannot touch or understand ..... unless they want to start stacking their 14nm chips up into towering infernos again.  5nm direct burn EUV can burn stacked layers directly into a solid thick silicone wafer when carefully calibrated and focused and controlled.  

Like ..... well ..... nothing we have ever seen done before.   Current 7nm EUV can lay down 4 relatively crude stacked layers into a simple thick memory wafer --- generally used for simple stuff like memory chips, but the first generation 7nm EUV machines had to be customized out the wazoo to do that stacked laydown trick at all.   But both TSMC and Samsung worked it all out and got it to yield enough good chips to make it work well.

So, the stacked laydown tricks have been refined twice now and are now built right into the new 5nm ASML production machines as a basic function.  

Standard 5nm ASML EUV direct burn machines can lay down stacked layers 14 layers deep right into the same silicon wafer and that is with the standard 5nm production equipment.

Apple is going 5nm ASAP (A-14 production) because they can do just about the entire device inside the layers of the CPU itself, including a goodly bit of memory.

This saves a lot of money and a lot of post burn assembly processing time.   The chips run a lot faster and the energy they use to run is a lot less.


So, watch the Apple A-14 chipset when it comes out for radical new capabilities due to 5nm 14 layer direct burn EUV.
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #223 - 04/15/19 at 08:04:12
 

There has been a recent ripple of supporter dissatisfaction inside the Linux Mint support community.  Several key supporters have "gone on sabbatical" until such times that several of the recent basic software support choices by Ubuntu change back from the current picks.   These bad picks were made by the Ubuntu folks upstream of Mint, these same Ubuntu folks who are now having their own set of issues with upkeep as well.

Some of the new packages and sub-systems are far too cumbersome and require CONSTANT tuning and updating --- far too too much work to keep up with.    Clem is being asked to  "go back" to earlier systems that were totally stable (fully developed systems that were used in Mint 17 and 18).   Clem is discouraged by this mess as his marching band isn't following his baton flawlessly any longer and his Mint world isn't totally peaceful any longer either.

So, Clem is now beset with some time eating, nagging Ubuntu problems that were not of his own making .....  Clem is a member of the Ubuntu Council and he will voice his concerns, this we are sure.   However, Mark Shuttleworth is the Ubuntu self-proclaimed "Beneficent Dictator Forever" as his million dollar donations pay for everything ---- and Mark sometimes does not always listen to other voices when it is time to finally pick a strategic direction.

The Mint user community comments simply says they want Linux Mint to work well 100% all the time --- that any form of drama or ongoing chaos is anathema to them.

A possible choice is to break with Ubuntu, but that isn't likely as too much is taken pre-made from the Ubuntu base in order to make Mint work.  Regression to older Ubuntu levels is an option --- but since the Ubuntu base has moved on to new systems that is actually deciding to go back to outdated old systems and then agreeing to be totally stagnant, which is another bad choice which isn't going to work either.  

The last choice is to "paddle on through it" and that seems to be what we are doing .......

Mint Debian was developed relatively recently to work around a similar set of Ubuntu issues several years ago and it worked OK, but not flawlessly.   Not well enough to expand its own use naturally to any degree anyway.

Remember please, that the very existence of Linux Mint itself was a reaction from the Ubuntu community to a set of very bad choices made by Mark Shuttleworth quite some while ago.   As Ubuntu itself was a reaction to some bad choices made by Debian even before that.

Linux Mint currently sticks with the best most stable Ubuntu LTS version and they hold there for 2 years and then go to the next best most stable Ubuntu LTS version.   The issue now is the 2 year gaps in this progression are getting more severe and problematical due to the rapid evolution of all the supporting softwares.


===================================================


On another front, Android is also seeing a version of this ripple of "change illness" as Android phones across the board are not working as seamlessly on the long term any more.  Since phones get replaced every few years this hasn't been as severe a rub point compared to the Linux desktop OS situations.

Cynics among us point out that Google is getting ready to promote Fuchsia in its first cellular uses, and perhaps having a serious Android illness to fix right off the bat is a good thing for that particular effort.

How bad is it?   Linus himself acknowledges that there are too many basic Linux variants out there in Linux that are mutually exclusive at this point in time.   Linus believes that excessive variations that serve no real purpose are detrimental to the entire Linux system.   "Snaps vs Flatpacks" is his often given example of this unnecessary detrimental variation.

Eventually, Linux as a whole will have to coalesce around a key set of basic systems or else desktop Linux will explosively fragment still further, going off totally into "systems based" mini-camps that will not allow easy software movement between them.
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Re: 2019 -- new Intel failures & successes
Reply #224 - 04/17/19 at 02:37:07
 

https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/16/18411332/intel-exiting-5g-smartphone-modem...

https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/16/18410985/apple-qualcomm-settle-royalty-dis...

https://semiaccurate.com/2018/02/22/intel-talks-5g-connected-pcs-mwc/



Intel this evening says it has decided to leave the 5G mobile modem market to focus its efforts more on 4G and 5G modems for PCs and smart home devices, as well as its broader 5G infrastructure business. The announcement comes within hours of Apple and Qualcomm striking a surprise settlement in the two companies’ ongoing patent infringement and royalties dispute related to Apple’s use of Qualcomm modems in the iPhone.

It’s likely Intel’s decision here was what prompted Apple and Qualcomm’s decision to settle — which all came as quite a surprise since it happened just as lawyers were presenting opening arguments at the latest courtroom trial that began yesterday in Southern California.

But it’s unclear when Intel came to this decision, or when it informed Apple, and Intel has declined to comment. Either way, phone manufacturers like Apple will need to look elsewhere for their 5G radios now, and that means Intel just ceded that 5G cellular phone business to Qualcomm.
 And to Huawei.  And to Mediatek.  And to Samsung.

It is clear that Intel has TOTALLY FAILED yet again to meet their Apple commitments to do the production design and to make fully functional energy efficient mobile 5G modem production runs that they contracted to do for Apple.

“IT HAS BECOME APPARENT THAT THERE IS NO CLEAR PATH TO PROFITABILITY AND POSITIVE RETURNS” Intel bean picker CEO Bob Swan said in a statement today, perhaps misleading some folks to think this is perhaps an Apple "failure to pay enough" to support all the development costs and/or an Apple caused "modem design" failure of some sort.  

Not so, Intel designs the 5G modems, not Apple.   Apple has LOTS of development money, enough to fund entire new levels of lithography whenever they want a new one.   Apple isn't the failure side on this one at all.  

Intel took Apple's money last year for 5G cellular modem development, fumbled it away and now has failed repeatedly to produce a successful run of 5G cellular modems for Apple, failing again and again and again until “IT HAS BECOME APPARENT (to Intel) THAT THERE IS NO CLEAR PATH TO PROFITABILITY AND POSITIVE RETURNS”.

How bad is Intel's failure this time?   Bad enough to make Apple do a 180o ass-swapping reversal during the heat of a major court battle with Qualcomm and then to immediately sign a six year contract with Qualcomm after only 24 hours of negotiations.

Intel has failed Apple multiple times now, and Apple isn't all that forgiving for those who fail and cost Apple lots of money.   Expect Apple to put their own ARM based Mac processor chips for Apple laptops back into high gear again as they really can't trust Intel to do ANYTHING right for them any more.


===================================================


LOOK AT THE PICTURE, notice the clustered crowd of "support personnel" who are now clustered around Bob Swan, currently the head "technically challenged beanpicker" CEO of Intel.  This is the crowd that has surrounded him ever since he FLAT OUT FIRED all his old Intel Tech people and then hired Infosys out of India to be his major technological resource (and mebbe to provide his personal bodyguard security force as well ????   Huh ).

Folks, I think Intel is fundamentally broken at the top, and things are not going to do very well under this new CEO's regime.   Bob Swan is systematically firing and replacing anyone who could unseat him as CEO --- by doing so he is chopping Intel off right about at the armpits.
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