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New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer (Read 1197 times)
Dave
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #60 - 03/17/17 at 02:57:31
 
eastsidedirtykid:

I have a set of Progressive shocks on my bike that may be just what you need/want.  They are 13" long, which is the longest that I believe is workable on the Savage - any more than that and the swing arm angle is just too severe, and you get too much tension change in the belt as the swing arm moves up/down.

I weigh 160 dry.....about 175 suited up to ride.  The Progressive shocks were too stiff even on the lightest setting for me, and I installed a lighter set of springs and that has helped some.  It was also necessary to install their spacers to limit the length of the shock travel, to keep the tire from hitting the seat when the shock are fully compressed.   I just bought a set of RFY shocks as shown in this thread a few posts above this one, and I had them rebuilt - but I have not ridden with them yet.  It will be a few weeks before winter leaves KY and I can ride the Cafe bike - I don't want to sell the Progressive shocks until I get a chance to try out the RFY shocks and see if they are better.  Once I get the RFY's on my bike I might be able to sell you my Progressive shocks.  They are model 412-4061C and they came with a 120/170 spring stock, and I rode them last year with 105/150 springs and they were better for me - but they still need to be on the lightest pre-load setting and still feel a bit stiff.

In the quest for better handling - definitely consider the tires sizes/shapes.  A 130/70-18 tire does not belong on the 18-2.50 rear rim, and a 100/90 front tire has a very tall sidewall and a lot of weight - a 90/90 tire is more responsive  Here is a link to the Cafe' tire discussion thread.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1435340395

The Savage as a Cafe' can be a fun bike, and it does ride well in the curves when set up well - but it is not a sport bike and will never handle as well.  The steering will always feel just a bit stiff, as it has a Cruiser heritage.

   
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Gary_in_NJ
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #61 - 03/17/17 at 05:58:01
 
The rake and trail on my bike have been measured at 28 degrees of rake and trail is 3.5 inches. There was a robust discussion on rake and trail two weeks ago (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1488745527). I've experimented with a rake of 27 degrees and I found the steering too light and the bike not as stable as I like when leaned over. I think that the frame just isn't stiff enough to handle the high steering head angle and short trail.

Dave is right on the tire size. The 130 cross section tire is pinched onto the 2.50 rim. It really should be a 110/90.

eastsidedirtykid, tell us more about your bike.

- Are you keeping the belt drive or going with a chain?
- Are you going with RYCA's fork solution or converting to GVE's? (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1421689358/0)
- Are you going to use an 18" front wheel or are you using the stock 19"?
- Have you given thought to the BBK?

I'm 6'1" (but only 170 lbs). I too have owned a long list of sport bikes and dirtbikes, so when I first finished my cafe racer I found it to be absurdly small. It didn't take me long to get use to the low height and I no longer think about it.

I've put a lot of effort into my suspension, and as a result my bike handles great and gives a nice ride. This bike has made me rethink (or relearn) what I like in a street bike. I now have 1/3 the horsepower as my riding buddies (and they do leave me in their dust leaving stop lights) but I'm still one of the "fast guys". Modern sport bikes are just too much bike for street riding.

The old saying "I'd rather ride a slow bike fast then a fast bike slow" is so true. This savage-cafe has retaught me this.
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A life-time student of motorcycling.
LS650 Cafe, DRZ400SM, FZ6N, SV650S, CB900C, Ducati ST2, CB550F-SS
My LS650=> http://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/Left.JPG
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Ruttly
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #62 - 03/17/17 at 07:02:50
 
Glad I didn't buy my stickies yet , so you think a 130/100 is too wide for the 2.5 rim ? It has 120/100 rear 110/100 front both 18". I don't want the wrong sizes tires , please advise me of the proper size .
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Dave
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #63 - 03/17/17 at 07:18:28
 
Ruttly:

Rather than dragging this man's thread off-topic - lets have your tire discussion here:

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1435340395
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eastsidedirtykid
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #64 - 03/17/17 at 09:33:27
 
Dave:

That sounds like a good Idea! I actually posted a new thread topic of an alternative way to raise the seat height.

But once I finish the plug oil leak and get riding again, I might have to take you up on the shock offer. I'll let you know! I'm just such a big guy I feel like the RYCA shocks aren't stiff enough.

Gary_In_NJ:

I like the belt drive look a lot more, plus less maitinence, even though I can covert to the chain drive because I ordered the kit with the cutout in the bracket.

As for the front fork I just used the tool and the spacers to lower it, not the upgraded springs they offered. I feel like it feels good for my riding. (I'm like a hybrid of aggressive and cruising, never really one or the other on a ride)

Yep! Definitely got the 18 inch front wheel instead of the 19 stock wheel.

Not sure what BBK stands for...still learning! But I fully agree that riding this slow bike fast is WAY more fun than ride my old CBR's so slow.

I know it's an ongoing project and that's what's so fun about it. And knowing what everything does and where everything is make for a piece of mind ride.

Anyways, I can't wait to hear more about the RFY shocks. I've read the same thing where people who've never tried them said they are garbage, and others who have taken the dive AND rebuilt them were extremely pleased.
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Gary_in_NJ
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #65 - 03/17/17 at 09:46:30
 
eastsidedirtykid wrote on 03/17/17 at 09:33:27:
Not sure what BBK stands for..


BBK = Big Brake Kit

eastsidedirtykid wrote on 03/17/17 at 09:33:27:
I'm just such a big guy I feel like the RYCA shocks aren't stiff enough.


It's a common way of expressing how a shock feels, but it's quite wrong. A "stiff" shock is either over sprung, or over dampened, or both. There is a very different path for correcting each of these. Another VERY common misconception: Increasing preload does not result in a stiffer spring. Preload is used for setting sag - that's it.

Setting the sag (I use the terms static sag - no rider, and race sag - with rider) is the measurement for determining whether a spring rate is correct for the application (bike + rider). If you have around 5 to 10mm of static sag and 25 to 32mm (RYCA shocks) of race sag, your spring rate is correct. If after setting your race sag you have less then 5mm of static sag it means that you need a heavier rate spring. If the static sag is more then 10mm then a lighter rated spring may be needed.

Damping controls the speed at which the shock compresses or rebounds. If it compresses too slow it is perceived as being too stiff. But you can have an undersprung shock that moves too slowly if it is over dampened.

The RYCA shocks are both oversprung (for most riders) and over dampened. I would conduct a proper adjustment of sag with the RYCA shocks to determine if the spring rates are correct for your weight.

A great resource for explaining suspension set-up can be found here ==> http://www.ntnoa.org/suspension_preload.htm

Understand what is wrong with your shocks (and forks) before throwing money at the "problem".
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A life-time student of motorcycling.
LS650 Cafe, DRZ400SM, FZ6N, SV650S, CB900C, Ducati ST2, CB550F-SS
My LS650=> http://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/Left.JPG
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Dave
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #66 - 03/17/17 at 09:51:43
 
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #67 - 03/17/17 at 11:15:50
 
If after setting your race sag you have less then 5mm of static sag it means that you need a heavier rate spring. If the static sag is more then 10mm then a lighter rated spring may be needed.

You Sure bout that?
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Gary_in_NJ
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #68 - 03/17/17 at 11:30:28
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 03/17/17 at 11:15:50:
You Sure bout that?


Yep! I know it seems counter-intuitive but that's the way it works. Remember you set the sag to achieve the correct race sag - we don't adjust for (too much) for static sag. The static sag is a result of race sag. So if you get the target race sag dialed in perfectly, but you have too much static sag, it's an indication that you need a lighter rate spring.
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A life-time student of motorcycling.
LS650 Cafe, DRZ400SM, FZ6N, SV650S, CB900C, Ducati ST2, CB550F-SS
My LS650=> http://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/Left.JPG
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #69 - 03/17/17 at 11:45:45
 
That doesn't just Seem counterintuitive, it Iz,,
I still don't get it, but don't waste your time trying to help me. I wouldn't remember it and I'll never need it.

That's weird..
Rebuild a centrifugal pump. The jam nut for the shaft is just bakkerds to what you would think.
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antmanbee
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #70 - 08/05/17 at 14:56:05
 
I was wondering if anyone had any further comments or updates with their experience with the RFYs either in the reservoir or standard type shock.
Also if there was any recommendations for shock length for a non ryca bike with standard size wheels with maybe one size taller tire.
From my reading an 11.5" sounds good but there is not an RFY  in that size.
Is the 320mm with a 7mm spring a good option for a light rider (daughter at 110lbs or 150lbs for me).
Are there fitment problems with the 320mm length?
I am more inclined to buy from China and rebuild it my self.
Or the other option is shocks for a Harley Sportster. I am then concerned about the spring rate for a lighter bike and rider.
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antmanbee
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #71 - 12/09/17 at 07:56:57
 
There was a lot of interest in these RFY shocks and then this thread died.

Please keep adding to it as I feel this is important information.

I am really curious how these shocks are working out for the several people that ordered them.

I am still slowly looking for new shocks for the s40 and maybe my Guzzi too.

I have seen 2 spring sizes with either 7mm or 8mm. 7 is probably what is needed for the s40 and 8 for the 500lb Guzzi.

Dave, I did like the looks of the non reservoir shock. Perfect for a classic styled bike.
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Dave
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #72 - 12/12/17 at 04:43:19
 
My RFY shocks are still sitting in the box.  I went to install them, and I discovered that I needed to make some spacers to keep the bottom of the shock from moving back/forth on the mounting bolts and rubbing on the swingarm.  I just haven't gotten around to making them yet...winter is here and the time I used t spend mowing grass each week - can now be spent in the garage.

I currently have Progressive Sportster shocks on the Cafe' bike, and they were too stiff originally.  I bought lighter springs and installed them - and they are working pretty good right now.
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snels516
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Re: New Shocks for my RYCA Cafe Racer
Reply #73 - 02/18/18 at 11:40:34
 
Dragging this one back to the surface. Dave, did you ever get those shocks on? It’s time I make my decision on shocks as I have a pile of parts in the garage to start using.
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