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Makes WAY too much sense..... (Read 54 times)
raydawg
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Makes WAY too much sense.....
10/01/16 at 07:58:53
 
A city that brought you Obama.

The resident newspaper, with such clarity in this OP/ED, that folks will have to pull their blinders tighter, and swill their Kool-Aid faster.... if they wish to hold on to their delusional world.

This is why I will vote for them.....as well.

A principled option for U.S. president: Endorsing Gary Johnson, Libertarian

How has our country fallen so inescapably into political and policy gridlock?
How did pandering to aggrieved niche groups and seducing blocs of angry voters replace working toward solutions as the coin of our governing class?
How could the Democratic and Republican parties stagger so far from this nation's political mainstream?

And the most pressing question: What should tens of millions of voters who yearn for answers do with two major-party candidates they disdain?

Polls show an unprecedented number of people saying they wish they had another choice.

We reject the cliche that a citizen who chooses a principled third-party candidate is squandering his or her vote.
— Chicago Tribune Editorial Board

This is the moment to look at the candidates on this year's ballot. This is the moment to see this election as not so much about them as about the American people and where their country is heading. And this is the moment to rebuke the Republican and Democratic parties.

The Republicans have nominated Donald Trump, a man not fit to be president of the United States. We first wrote on March 10 that we would not, could not, endorse him. And in the intervening six-plus months he has splendidly reinforced our verdict: Trump has gone out of his way to anger world leaders, giant swaths of the American public, and people of other lands who aspire to immigrate here legally. He has neither the character nor the prudent disposition for the job.

The mystery and shame of Trump's rise — we have red, white and blue coffee mugs that are more genuinely Republican — is the party's inability or unwillingness to repulse his hostile takeover. We appreciate the disgust for failed career politicians that Trump's supporters invoke; many of those voters are doubly victimized — by economic forces beyond their control, and by the scorn of mocking elitists who look down their noses to see them.

He has ridden to the White House gate on the backs of Americans who believe they've been robbed of opportunity and respect. But inaugurating a bombastic and self-aggrandizing President Donald Trump isn't the cure.

The Democrats have nominated Hillary Clinton, who, by contrast, is undeniably capable of leading the United States. Electing her the first woman president would break a barrier that has no reason to be. We see no rough equivalence between Trump and Clinton. Any American who lists their respective shortcomings should be more apoplectic about the litany under his name than the one under hers. He couldn't do this job. She could.

But for reasons we'll explain — her intent to greatly increase federal spending and taxation, and serious questions about honesty and trust — we cannot endorse her.

Clinton's vision of ever-expanding government is in such denial of our national debt crisis as to be fanciful. Rather than run as a practical-minded Democrat as in 2008, this year she lurched left, pandering to match the Free Stuff agenda of then-rival Bernie Sanders.

She has positioned herself so far to the left on spending that her presidency would extend the political schism that has divided America for some 24 years.
That is, since the middle of a relatively moderate Clinton presidency. Today's Hillary Clinton, unlike yesteryear's, renounces many of Bill Clinton's priorities — freer trade, spending discipline, light regulation and private sector growth to generate jobs and tax revenues.

Hillary Clinton calls for a vast expansion of federal spending, supported by the kinds of tax hikes that were comically impossible even in the years when President Barack Obama's fellow Democrats dominated both houses of Congress.
The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget calculates that Clinton's plan would increase spending by $1.65 trillion over a decade, mostly for college education, paid family leave, infrastructure and health-related expenditures.
Spending just on debt interest would rise by $50 billion.

Personal and business taxation would rise by $1.5 trillion. Sort through all the details and her plan would raise the national debt by $200 billion.

Now as in the primary season, Clinton knows she is proposing orgies of spending, and taxing, that simply will ... not ... happen.
She is promising Americans all manner of things she cannot deliver.

That is but one of the reasons why so many Americans reject Clinton: They don't trust what she says, how she makes decisions, and her up-to-the-present history of egregiously erasing the truth:

In the wake of a deadly attack on American personnel in Libya, she steered the American public away from the real cause — an inconvenient terror attack right before the 2012 election — after privately emailing the truth to her daughter.

The head of the FBI, while delivering an indictment minus the grand jury paperwork, labeled her "extremely careless" for mishandling emails sensitive to national security.

In public she stonewalled, dissembled and repeatedly lied — several were astonishing whoppers — about her private communications system ("There is no classified material," "Everything I did was permitted," and on and on).
Her negligence in enforcing conflict-of-interest boundaries allowed her family's foundation to exploit the U.S. Department of State as a favor factory.
Even her command and control of a routine medical issue devolved into a secretive, misleading mission to hide information from Americans.

Time upon time, Clinton's behavior affirms the perception that she's a corner-cutter whose ambitions drive her decisions.
One telling episode among the countless: Asked by a voter if she was for or against the Keystone XL pipeline from Canada, she replied, "If it's undecided when I become president, I will answer your question."

As we've asked here before, will Hillary Clinton ever get over her consuming fear of straight talk?

Taken together, Trump and Clinton have serious flaws that prevent us from offering our support to either of them.

Still, come Nov. 8, tens of millions of Americans will make a draw that they consider beyond distasteful.

We choose not to do that. We would rather recommend a principled candidate for president — regardless of his or her prospects for victory — than suggest that voters cast ballots for such disappointing major-party candidates.

With that demand for a principled president paramount, we turn to the candidate we can recommend.
One party has two moderate Republicans — veteran governors who successfully led Democratic states — atop its ticket.
Libertarians Gary Johnson of New Mexico and running mate William Weld of Massachusetts are agile, practical and, unlike the major-party candidates, experienced at managing governments.
They offer an agenda that appeals not only to the Tribune's principles but to those of the many Americans who say they are socially tolerant but fiscally responsible. "Most people are Libertarian," Johnson told the Tribune Editorial Board when he and Weld met with us in July. "It's just that they don't know it."

Theirs is small-L libertarianism, built on individual freedom and convinced that, at both ends of Pennsylvania Avenue, official Washington is clumsy, expensive and demonstrably unable to solve this nation's problems. They speak of reunifying an America now balkanized into identity and economic groups — and of avoiding their opponents' bullying behavior and sanctimonious lectures. Johnson and Weld are even-keeled — provided they aren't discussing the injustice of trapping young black children in this nation's worst-performing schools. On that and other galling injustices, they're animated.

We reject the cliche that a citizen who chooses a principled third-party candidate is squandering his or her vote.
Look at the number of fed-up Americans telling pollsters they clamor for alternatives to Trump and Clinton.
What we're recommending will appeal less to people who think tactically than to conscientious Americans so infuriated that they want to send a message about the failings of the major parties and their candidates.

Put short:

We offer this endorsement to encourage voters who want to feel comfortable with their choice. Who want to vote for someone they can admire.

Johnson, who built a construction business before entering politics, speaks in terms that appeal to many among us:
Expanded global trade and resulting job expansion.
Robust economic growth, rather than ever-higher taxation, to raise government revenue.
A smaller, and less costly, federal government.
Faith in Americans' ability to parlay economic opportunity into success.

While many Democrats and Republicans outdo one another in opposing the proposed Trans-Pacific Partnership trade deal, or TPP, we're amused by this oddity: Today the nation's two most ardent free-traders arguably are Barack Obama and Gary Johnson.

That said, Obama and Johnson are but two of the many candidates we've endorsed yet with whom we also can disagree.
Johnson's foreign policy stance approaches isolationism.
He is too reluctant to support what we view as necessary interventions overseas.
He likely wouldn't dispatch U.S. forces in situations where Clinton would do so and where Trump ... who can reliably predict?

But unless the United States tames a national debt that's rapidly approaching $20 trillion-with-a-T, Americans face ever tighter constrictions on what this country can afford, at home or overseas.

Clinton and Trump are too cowardly even to whisper about entitlement reforms that each of them knows are imperative.

Johnson? He wants to raise the retirement age and apply a means test on benefits to the wealthiest.

What's more, principled third-party candidates can make big contributions even when they lose. In 1992 businessman H. Ross Perot won 19 percent of the popular vote on a thin but sensible platform, much of it constructed around reducing federal deficits.
That strong showing by Perot the relative centrist influenced how President Bill Clinton would govern.

We wish the two major parties had not run away from today's centrist Americans.
Just as we wish either of their candidates evoked the principles that a Chicago Tribune now in its 170th year espouses, among them high integrity, free markets, personal responsibility and a limited role for government in the lives of the governed.
We hope Johnson does well enough that Republicans and Democrats get the message — and that his ideas make progress over time.

This year neither major party presents a good option. So the Chicago Tribune today endorses Libertarian Gary Johnson for president of the United States.
Every American who casts a vote for him is standing for principles — and can be proud of that vote. Yes, proud of a candidate in 2016.



PS: Do it Bot, be a leader of change, as you said yesterday, we all pretty much want the same things.
If true, lets take a stand against those who use division to empower themselves.
It won't, change, that is, come with one election, no, but we have to start somewhere, yes?
If this is not the best time to start, when?
Four years from now when the hole is wider and deeper?

Please, think about it.....

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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #1 - 10/01/16 at 08:06:33
 
I've said it before, I used examples, Johnson is NOT a libertarian.
He's just running under the banner.
Isn't that Something?
the city that brought you Obama
The newspaper is , rather than pumping Hillary, just guiding away from trump.
People are so easily led.
Johnson is a tyrant, not libertarian.
He supports, ohh, no, not falling into That trap again..

Im not gonna back up with fact, when I can just make statements.
Ray, find out about Johnson, his stance on tpp, vaccines,
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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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raydawg
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #2 - 10/01/16 at 08:12:56
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/01/16 at 08:06:33:
I've said it before, I used examples, Johnson is NOT a libertarian.
He's just running under the banner.
Isn't that Something?
the city that brought you Obama
The newspaper is , rather than pumping Hillary, just guiding away from trump.
People are so easily led.
Johnson is a tyrant, not libertarian.
He supports, ohh, no, not falling into That trap again..

Im not gonna back up with fact, when I can just make statements.
Ray, find out about Johnson, his stance on tpp, vaccines,


Sure, right after you show me Trump is a republican, etc.....

EDIT: Jog, ain't no one, like in, ANYBODY, who will be perfect.
You wanna find fault, nit pick, go ahead, I can't stop that.
But your fricken vote, and why, for Trump, is based on nothing more than your own HOPE and Wishes.....
That he can do, might do, the things YOU think need to be done.
The flip side to this I can NOT risk, for I believe he has the propensity to disrupt, rather than to build a consensus, which I feel is paramount to leadership, with views and beliefs being second fiddle....

You are getting shrill buddy, honest.
You are coming across to me that at any moment you could go postal.
I hope its just my wrong read, but nevertheless, I am concerned about you, no joking......
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #3 - 10/01/16 at 08:32:06
 
Not only have I never said trump is a bub, I've said he isn't, but has to, just as ron Paul had to, REGISTER as one, in order to be included in the debates.
Now, did you read that? I'm sick of typing it. I Really want you to understand that.

The Difference between a bub and an ALLEGED libertarian is huge.
A libertarian supports individual freedoms.
Johnson, nope, not even.
He is as libertarian as I am democrat.
Isn't it odd how THAT paper is so supportive of someone
Who will take votes from trump.
An effective strategy for supporting Hillary without saying it.
The dems are losing their base in black community, so they are pointing them away from trump.
So OBVIOUS..
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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #4 - 10/01/16 at 08:38:02
 
I thought we had determined that you both are closet Liberals... Grin
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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raydawg
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #5 - 10/01/16 at 08:46:14
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/01/16 at 08:32:06:
Not only have I never said trump is a bub, I've said he isn't, but has to, just as ron Paul had to, REGISTER as one, in order to be included in the debates.
Now, did you read that? I'm sick of typing it. I Really want you to understand that.

The Difference between a bub and an ALLEGED libertarian is huge.
A libertarian supports individual freedoms.
Johnson, nope, not even.
He is as libertarian as I am democrat.
Isn't it odd how THAT paper is so supportive of someone
Who will take votes from trump.
An effective strategy for supporting Hillary without saying it.
The dems are losing their base in black community, so they are pointing them away from trump.
So OBVIOUS..


I never said Johnson was a libertarian, either....
I said he is better than those two, period.
Read the story....
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #6 - 10/01/16 at 08:56:50
 
I already know what he is,,
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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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raydawg
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #7 - 10/01/16 at 09:16:50
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/01/16 at 08:56:50:
I already know what he is,,


Yes, and you know every vote he sucks away will be a Trumper too...

Jog, if you think a major rag like this would post this OP/ED as written, to entice folks to NOT vote for Trump, which I am guessing is not a big fav in Chicago, anyway.....
Without harming Clinton in the process, well, I think your reasoning fails in epic proportions.

1: If she needs this sort of deceptive slight of reporting to win, then she has some extremely serious problems, that this type of shenanigan won't fix.

2: The folks you say its focused on, if fact, won't be so motivated to turn out, to vote, if they feel used, or helpless.

3: Not sure if what you meant by her "Black" vote being in jeopardy, but how would a Johnson vote help her on that front?
The story is a hit piece on her "give away" campaign, that she was FORCED to engage in with Bernie....
Yes, I am making an assumption when you use the Black base, you are talking about entitlements, etc.... cuz we all know, yada, yada, yada.....  Grin

I got o go get the firewood ready for winter cold.
Hope my back holds out.
Have to move a cord to the back of the house, that is ready to burn, nicely aged.
That is down a level, and about 150 feet from its current position up top of my property in a wood shed.
Then I have 3 cords I need to stack in that shed, that will be burned after the first cord I am moving.

I am getting too old for this, 64 in January.....
But my wife loves the ambiance of a wood fire.
I offered a new pellet stove, but no.
She loves the romantics involved laying on a bear rug, in front of it, while the snow glides down from heaven....

We have worn out 3 bear rugs  Grin
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #8 - 10/01/16 at 09:21:55
 
Johnson destroyed himself with ignorance...
He's applying for a motorcycle mechanic and can't name a European bike...


PS.. Trump's lucky nobody asks him general knowledge questions...

Hillary can probably name all of them,.. and has met them...
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #9 - 10/01/16 at 09:47:48
 
In Reversal, Gov. Gary Johnson Now Supports Mandatory Vaccination
Vermont Public Radio › digital › post › r...
Aug 24, 2016 - Gary Johnson is newly in favor of mandatory vaccination, he says, after learning more about.
Gary Johnson Alters Position: Now Supports Mandatory Vaccination
thelibertarianrepublic.com › johnson-rev...
Aug 25, 2016 - Libertarian Presidential Candidate Gary Johnson recently reversed his stance on


Even though he now Says he has changed position, it's impossible to Be a Libertarian AND support mandatory Anything that would be a Choice of a Free Person.
So,he isn't a Libertarian at heart.
He's the equivalent of Sarah Palin jumping in front of the tea party parade, pretending to be the leader.
He's just taking a few votes from trump
Just my opinion. I don't feel obligated to support it considering our recent exchange over the consumption tax. If you ever decide to type out your own thoughts on a position and Explain Why you believe what you're saying, I'll honor that by actually debating with you on it. I remember, not the topics, but the
Feeling, of a few times when I was demonstrated to have been wrong and I chose to admit it. If you want to engage me in debate, you'll need to be able to defend your position and ready to accept what it feels like when logic and clear thinking demonstrate that position to be unsupportable.
The consumption tax lays the burden most heavily on those who have no savings plan. We can move on or not. It's up to you.

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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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LostArtist
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #10 - 10/02/16 at 05:23:29
 
remember, to be a JOG Libertarian, you have to ABSOLUTELY pure, you can't live in realty where the "FREE market" doesn't solve every issue and you actually NEED government to keep things fair, and if you have any liberal leanings, oh, NO, only conservatives can be Libertarians

otherwise, you might as well be a Clinton

MOST of all, don't you DARE actually support the REAL LIFE REGISTERED LIBERTARIAN party, not buy voting for them, not by donating, and definitely not by joining them and admitting it and RUN ON IT
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #11 - 10/02/16 at 07:26:53
 
LostArtist wrote on 10/02/16 at 05:23:29:
remember, to be a JOG Libertarian, you have to ABSOLUTELY pure, you can't live in realty where the "FREE market" doesn't solve every issue and you actually NEED government to keep things fair, and if you have any liberal leanings, oh, NO, only conservatives can be Libertarians

otherwise, you might as well be a Clinton

MOST of all, don't you DARE actually support the REAL LIFE REGISTERED LIBERTARIAN party, not buy voting for them, not by donating, and definitely not by joining them and admitting it and RUN ON IT


All the parties have evolved, and adapted accordingly, to what some in higher party anarchy, deem.
The democrats, steep in the south were not for equal rights for the Blacks, Republican support, pushed it through.....
Is a good example.

Funny, it seems you find Jog's rigidness of belief a fault, but you.....????

PS: You YELL a lot in real life too?
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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Re: Makes WAY too much sense.....
Reply #12 - 10/02/16 at 08:55:13
 
Libertarianism isn't a party, it's a philosophy.
It's one of freedom to choose for ones Self what you will and will not do. I can't stand and announce
I believe in individual freedom to choose

And
Ohh, by the way, vaccinations for everyone,


I used to think democrat meant antiwar.
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The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
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