SuzukiSavage.com - Twistyturny: cars vs bikes

zipidachimp

Serious Thumper

Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1417
surrey, b.c.
Gender: male

Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
09/16/16 at 01:13:21

Thinking back on my short trip Tuesday, I'm somewhat less than thrilled. This road was re-built for the 2010 winter Olympics and leads to Whistler. I turned around at Squamish after visiting a friend.
I've driven this road in cars and trucks, and at speeds 10% over legal, it's fun if not challenging. On my bike, it's only ho-hum. At 25% over it could be fun, but not if you have to deal with the RCMP.
My theory is this: road curves are designed for cars, that take up all of a lane. Bikes only use up 1/3 of a lane and you can choose whichever part of it for cornering you want, or is comfortable. The corner radius for 2 wheeled fun would scare too many cage drivers. I'm not an engineer so I may be out of my depth here.
I need to find more backbackback country roads! Cheers! Cool

ps: also, there are too many darn cyclists up here!
pps: every second bike in the mountains here is a harley, weird!

Back to top

IP Logged

Kris01

Serious Thumper

Offline

Eat, sleep, RIDE!

Posts: 3767
Tennessee
Gender: male

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #1 - 09/16/16 at 05:03:42

I agree. They are designed mostly for cars. Typically when I see a posted speed recommendation in a corner, I ignore it completely. I can take curves typically 10 mph faster in my car than what the sign says AND I can do it comfortably (like I'm driving to church). The roads are setup to make life easier for idiots who can't drive. There sure are plenty of 'em!

Back to top

There's no problem that a full tank of gas and a sunny day can't fix!

2008 S40, Rotella T 15W-40 w/ZDDP added, Dyna, 140/90-15, Battery Tender Jr., Seat lift, #52.5/150/3 washers, Raptor

IP Logged

stewmills Serious Thumper Offline Imagination is more important than knowledge Posts: 2641 Auburn, AL Gender:	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #2 - 09/16/16 at 06:25:01 Kris01 wrote on 09/16/16 at 05:03:42: The roads are setup to make life easier for idiots who can't drive. There sure are plenty of 'em! Welcome to America...where everything is reduced to accommodate the lowest common denominator...
Back to top	2008 \| 152/52.5–Air Mix 3/4 \| Rotella T4 \| Seat Lift w/Sheepskin \| Speedo Rattle \| Rear Pulley Shim \| 140/90-15 Rear \| Kaw Front Pulley \| Relocated Rear Signals FREEDOM ISN'T FREE! IP Logged

justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #3 - 09/16/16 at 06:37:31 A road that is curvy is curvy. If you Choose to ride the straightest line through your lane, you killed the curve. The same narrow bike can Accentuate the curves. I can zig zag across a straight road. I can do Exactly opposite of what someone Racing would do and, rather than straightening out the curves, accentuate them.
Back to top	The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke. IP Logged

stewmills Serious Thumper Offline Imagination is more important than knowledge Posts: 2641 Auburn, AL Gender:	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #4 - 09/16/16 at 06:51:41 Let's be honest JOG...this is the only reason you can ride that aggressively where others can't...
Back to top	BMW08.jpg 2008 \| 152/52.5–Air Mix 3/4 \| Rotella T4 \| Seat Lift w/Sheepskin \| Speedo Rattle \| Rear Pulley Shim \| 140/90-15 Rear \| Kaw Front Pulley \| Relocated Rear Signals FREEDOM ISN'T FREE! IP Logged

Dave

YaBB Moderator
ModSquad

Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 18099
Camp Springs, Kentucky
Gender: male

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #5 - 09/16/16 at 06:53:07

I have often wondered about the answer to this question. Most times it seems I can out-corner cars easily, and when following most cars they can speed up on the straights and slow down for the corners - and you just can't wait for them to turn or come to a place to pass safely.

However, I have been behind a few cars (and even trucks) that were hustling along really quickly and keeping pace really well. I was riding on the Dragon at very brisk pace, and I had to pull over and let a Rice Rocket car go by......he and a couple of sport bikes were just flying! When it comes to the average soccer mom in her mini van and the average big Harley rider - I think they are a pretty even match!

I do believe that with a street driven bike and a street driven car - the bike is far more nimble and can take advantage of it's narrowness to apex the curves and make them easier to take at speed. The bike leaning over seems to be far more relaxing and enjoyable - then trying to take the same corner at speed in a car. On the Dragon, I have noticed that cars as big as Camaro's and Mustangs....have a hard time staying in their lane on the really tight corners, and the front tires are all bent over a scrubbing like crazy - the cars are just too big to go around those corners quickly.

Back to top

Someday I will be old......But not today!

IP Logged

Serowbot

YaBB Moderator
ModSquad

Online

OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

Posts: 28661
Tucson Az
Gender: male

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #6 - 09/16/16 at 08:44:15

Cars have 4 wide tires of traction... they generally have the advantage in cornering and usually in braking.
Bikes have acceleration exiting corners. (better power to weight ratio)

On most tracks,... cars win over bikes...
There are exceptions on some tracks that give the advantage to quicker corner exits.

...but,.. bikes are more fun per mile...

Back to top

Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh

...

IP Logged

gizzo

Serious Thumper

Offline

SuzukiCabbage. It's
Savage.

Posts: 1318
Australia

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #7 - 09/16/16 at 08:47:56

Dave wrote on 09/16/16 at 06:53:07:

I have often wondered about the answer to this question. Most times it seems I can out-corner cars easily, and when following most cars they can speed up on the straights and slow down for the corners - and you just can't wait for them to turn or come to a place to pass safely.

Because most drivers drive to get somewere, without any skill or enjoyment. Motorcyclists are opposite: most of us do it for the fun, so we naturally gain skills in cornering, making us faster in the bends. But, the occasional skillful car driver will hose a bike through the bends. Watch some vid of the nurburgring to see how much harder a well driven car goes through the corners than the bikes holding them up.

Back to top

IP Logged

SavageMan99 Senior Member Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 391	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #8 - 09/16/16 at 10:02:09 My little 83 Scamp does the 45 mph corners at 70 on the used rubber on it. Course it may have some poly bushings, over size hub bearings, performance struts, a rear sway bar and all that.
Back to top	IP Logged

justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #9 - 09/16/16 at 11:47:40 Looks pretty light in the rear.. do you have oversteer problems?
Back to top	The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke. IP Logged

engineer Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 872 Gender:	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #10 - 09/16/16 at 12:51:17 I saw a video of a GP race bike vs. a GP car on a track and the car easily out cornered the bike.
Back to top	2005 S40, Intruder shocks, Dyna, 52.5/150, 3 washers, 2 turns, modified seat, Raptor IP Logged

LANCER Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Savage Beast Performance Parts Posts: 10667 Oklahoma Gender:	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #11 - 09/16/16 at 16:08:48 engineer wrote on 09/16/16 at 12:51:17: I saw a video of a GP race bike vs. a GP car on a track and the car easily out cornered the bike. Were they both equally qualified professional pilots ?
Back to top	IP Logged

gizzo

Serious Thumper

Offline

SuzukiCabbage. It's
Savage.

Posts: 1318
Australia

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #12 - 09/16/16 at 17:59:49

LANCER wrote on 09/16/16 at 16:08:48:

engineer wrote on 09/16/16 at 12:51:17:

I saw a video of a GP race bike vs. a GP car on a track and the car easily out cornered the bike.

Were they both equally qualified professional pilots ?

I'd presume one was a rider, the other a driver. No piloting skills needed.
Equal skills would be an obvious requisite. There'd be no use comparing valentino rossi on his GP bike with grandma in her Corolla. A quick comparo of several australian circuits shows the 4 wheel outright lap record to be significantly faster than the 2 wheel record. The fastest car up Pikes Peak is over 1 1/2 minutes quicker than the fastest bike.
Like I said before, the only reason bikes are faster on the street is because car drivers are generally useless and unskilled.

Back to top

IP Logged

engineer

Serious Thumper

Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 872

Gender: male

Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes
Reply #13 - 09/16/16 at 19:51:23

The video I saw some years ago was a fairly serious race and it was somewhere in Europe. There are several races on youtube that are entertaining. One problem with a bike vs car race through corners is that passing is dangerous for the bike. A timed course through some twisties would be the better measure.

Jenson Button vs Dani Pedrosa - F1 vs GP motorcycle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMSegwn7I7c

Honda Civic Type R vs CBR1000RR
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVNdGkCKoJk

Supercar Vs Motorbike Vs F1 Car - Top Gear Festival Sydney
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygT4bGJkerk

Back to top

2005 S40, Intruder shocks, Dyna, 52.5/150, 3 washers, 2 turns, modified seat, Raptor

IP Logged

zipidachimp Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 1417 surrey, b.c. Gender:	Re: Twistyturny: cars vs bikes Reply #14 - 09/17/16 at 00:36:22 I think my point was: on the same twisty road as a car, at the same LEGAL speed as a car, the experience on a bike is ho-hum. As I said, I was underwhelmed/unimpressed/disappointed! I need to find some unpatrolled roads.
Back to top	IP Logged