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new head, new rings & combustion blow-by (Read 385 times)
justin_o_guy2
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #30 - 04/10/16 at 12:53:25
 
You don't torque anything until they are All snug. Go around, by hand, just a wrench or socket and get the jug down Flat. Then keep going .
First, hand tight. Cross corners. Front left, right rear.
Front right, left rear.
If you can't just Set the cylinder down and it sit flat, something is wrong.
Lay the torque wrench down, get a 1/4" ratchet and Gently bring the cylinder down.
You don't throw a tire on a car and put one lug nut on and torque it, do you? You snug them, in a criss cross pattern, and continue to tighten them sequentially, until you get it tight.
If you have torqued to spec one bolt and Not had the others snugged down enough to keep the cylinder flat on the cases, you may have messed up the gasket. Remove and inspect.

Get it together using basic hand tools, then the torque wrench for the last bit.
You may be onto something.. if you've got something tight, but the cylinder isn't clamped down, then debris in the hole is a possibility.
Did you scrape a gasket there?

This is why I'm so meticulous in the disassembling of anything.
Of course, that wasn't always the case. I learned that, after building and stepping into several bear traps.
When you pull the bolts, is there crud on the end?
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Art Webb
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #31 - 04/11/16 at 08:31:35
 
^^^this
when you'r putting a part on that needs even torque, you run the bolts down first by hand, then torque it in at LEAST 3 even stages, criss crossing all the way, and if it's a long piece (that'd be on a multi, not a single) working from the middle out
not by torquing the first bolt to spec, then going round to the next one
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Ed L.
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #32 - 04/12/16 at 12:24:44
 
Been following this thread but haven't opened up an engine that far so was keeping quite but had a thought. When you torque the jug  down are the bolts that hold the engine case together tight? Maybe try loosen them up a little bit.
 Here's the logic behind this, if the top bolts that hold the cases together are tight but the bottom long bolts are out since the engine is out of the frame it could be that the top case bolts are pulling the cases halves together at the top to the point where the jug just barely doesn't fit into it's hole. It can't hurt to loosen them for the next assembly and it might just be what is needed to get the jug to seat properly. Luck with it
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #33 - 04/12/16 at 12:29:59
 
I see where you're going and why, but I would rather see the bottom clamped shut. If he allows the top end to open and torques the jug down,then what happens when he tries to clamp the top shut? I don't even know what bolts are involved in that.
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deadman333
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #34 - 04/13/16 at 07:10:32
 
   Ok, I will find out this morning if what I found was the problem. My bike is now 90% reassembled.  Justt a few odds & ends to completion.  
  When I disassembled this time I was certain I would find debris of some sort at the bittom of the threads recieving the cylinder Dows that hold both  both the cylinder and the head to the lower end.
  There was debris in the form of fluid.  Oil to be precise.  It has since come to my attention that if fluid can not escape and pressure is applied it can not be compressed.  
  Upon reassembling I did not have the problem of the cylinder lifting on the opposite side when I tightened the nuts on the bottom right hand side of the cylinder.  Fingers crossed this was my problem!
 
 For further experiment I intend to run a compression test this morning then take the Bike on a test run- maybe 10-15 miles.  
 Now warmed up I will return to compression test again.  Measuring the difference (if any) between the two tests.  
  I am thinking even a third compression test after a good long ride when it's really warmed up.
 If I find a meaningful difference in the results then I'll know I am getting blow by past the rings and into the lower end.  Telling me my cylinder and piston (one or both) are outside of wear limits.  
 If there is little to no difference in compression then my measurements of cylinder & piston were accurate and I'm back on the road!
 
 Thanks to everyone who has posted and shared their thoughts.  I will share the results of my compression tests this afternoon or tomorrow.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #35 - 04/13/16 at 09:23:43
 
Please tell me you honed the cylinder and put a crosshatch pattern on it.
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gizzo
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #36 - 04/13/16 at 15:45:44
 
Good luck, man. Good work. Can't imagine, with the cylinder pressure you measured before the teardown, that you're going to have excessive blow by. Hopefully was just the rookie error torquing the cylinder down the first time fingers crossed for you!
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deadman333
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Re: new head, new rings & combustion blow-by
Reply #37 - 04/05/21 at 15:00:24
 
I just ran across this thread while trouble looking for something else, and realized I never completed the thread.  
  In the end, the reason the lower gasket keeped failing was because oil had found its way into the recieving threads for the right side front cylinder/head stud.  Being that a liquid, such as oil, when enclosed within a finite space can not be compressed.  So even tho the head bolts had been torqued to spec the head bolt could not pull the cylinder down and snug against the lower crankcase to cylinder gasket.   Thusly,  the gasket was being blown out by normal operating crankcase pressure.  
  I ended up riding that bike for another twenty thousand miles before buying a 2003 Savage.
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