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Interstate speed improvements? (Read 475 times)
MeeLee
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Interstate speed improvements?
01/28/16 at 06:41:14
 
Hi everyone,
Been browsing through some interesting topics on getting the S40 riding at interstate speeds.
Mostly rejetting, and grinding out the exhaust port, was said to improve mpg and top speed.

Almost every topic I see, is about the top speed of the S40 being limited due to:
1- vibrations
2- lack of HP
3- too high rpm.

Vibrations seem to appear around 80mph, and merely an annoyance, not a limitation;
But they do hold people from going any faster.

Essentially lowering rpm by 10%, would move up the vibrations by almost 10mph.
Number 1 can be solved, by regearing the bike, lowering rpm.
I wanted to know if there is a front pulley for sale with 1 tooth up from stock, that fits?

I'm not too fond of the pictures I saw of the chain conversion, unless a chain guard can be used. The stock one preferably, even if the rear sprocket is 3/4 the size of the pulley.

To make a re-gearing possible, the engine needs more hp (for top speed).
I read about someone drilling out the exhaust ports with a dremel. It should increase hp, and mpg.
Add a more free flow exhaust if necessary  (or in some cases, replace the air filter with a more modern one), and compensate with a slightly bigger main jet, for a richer AF mixture. Should give at least one to 3 extra hp, which is 10%.

Any other suggestions, concerning pulley system, or a nice looking, affordable chain kit with chain guard?

Also, any ideas about making the engine vibrate less by balancing it out?
I once saw a video of a guy who would just drill a .2" by .2" hole in the counterbalance of his motor; which reduced the weight of the counterbalance, and made the engine run smoother.
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Dave
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #1 - 01/28/16 at 06:56:44
 
Gearing improvements can be made by going to a 140/90-15 tire, and by adding the Kawasski Pulley Conversion.  The front pulley along works with the stock engine, and is OK with a windshield and bags being added to the bike.  The double pulley conversion is most likely a bit too high of gearing for a stock engine.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1384949185

Modifying the engine the exhaust port alone most likely doesn't do much of anything.....the biggest power improvements come from using a Stage 1 or Stage 3 cam, and switching over to a Wiseco piston that has higher compression (then the exhaust port changes help).

I have no idea about modifying the counter balance system.....it would require a thorough analysis of the engine - it is not something to be done by just winging it.  I believe that Suzuki most likely got it right as the engine is far smoother than the single cylinder bikes are without this system.

At higher engine speeds - the engine uses/loses oil, and it becomes necessary to check and add oil more frequently.
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verslagen1
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #2 - 01/28/16 at 08:24:13
 
From your post, I can't tell if you've ever rode a savage.
Everything you're inquiring about is subjective.

What is your experience with the savage?
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Serowbot
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #3 - 01/28/16 at 08:50:47
 
Most practical option, is a bigger bike....
This bike ain't intended for Interstates... (that said, it will do it), but it will never do it well...

You can 3 or 4 hp easy,... 8 or 10 the hard way...
Muffler, filter, rejet... add bore and cam.
$100,...   $1,000...
The last 4 horsies cost way more than the first ones... Huh
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Dave
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #4 - 01/28/16 at 10:12:45
 
Serowbot wrote on 01/28/16 at 08:50:47:
You can 3 or 4 hp easy,... 8 or 10 the hard way...
Muffler, filter, rejet... add bore and cam.
$100,...   $1,000...
The last 4 horsies cost way more than the first ones... Huh


Never thought of it that way - but you are correct.

And the last 4 horsies continue to cost.....as the Wiseco requires the use of premium fuel.
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Kris01
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #5 - 01/28/16 at 13:46:43
 
I'd be interested to see someone weigh the counter balance system and the reciprocating assembly to see how much money Suzuki tried to save. This engine is far smoother as-is than a lot of thumpers out there.   Wink
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Rodger
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #6 - 01/28/16 at 14:37:02
 
"...far smoother as-as than a lot of thumpers...."

Before I bought my new S40, I rode a Yamaha SR400. It only took 6 blocks for me to realize that little "butt-buzzer" wasn't for me.
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verslagen1
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #7 - 01/28/16 at 15:08:16
 
Kris01 wrote on 01/28/16 at 13:46:43:
I'd be interested to see someone weigh the counter balance system and the reciprocating assembly to see how much money Suzuki tried to save. This engine is far smoother as-is than a lot of thumpers out there.   Wink

We do have a counter balancer so it's not a matter of money.
The problem is there are multiple sources of vibration and it's nearly impossible to cancel them all out until you go BMW route of opposing cylinders.

naturally we have a balanced crank, but you have a vertically reciprocating piston/rod and a horizontally reciprocating rod resulting in 4 orders of vibration.  the counter balancer removes some of the vertical vibes but adds some horizontal if I remember my dynamics textbook correctly.
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #8 - 01/28/16 at 16:51:33
 
MeeLee wrote on 01/28/16 at 06:41:14:
... S40 riding at interstate speeds...
1- vibrations
2- lack of HP
3- too high rpm.

Vibrations seem to appear around 80mph....

Most practical option, is a bigger bike --  Serowbot
The Savage will never be a silk purse.  IMHO:

On an Interstate trip from LaLaLand to Kentucky...  vast majority of traffic cages were running 5 mph over the speed limits, commercial traffic ran at the speed limit, and the motorcyclists ran 5 mph under the limit.   A stock Savage can comfortably run 85 mph.  At 70 mph the Savage is doing about 40Hz, and for me the vibrations are relaxing.

I had no problem doing 500+ miles a day on the Savage.  However, if you want to cruise an actual 80 mph you need a bigger bike.
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Kris01
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #9 - 01/28/16 at 16:52:10
 
I wouldn't think you could dampen a single cylinder engine enough to call it "smooth" no matter what you do. I think we have an engine that's as good as it gets in that department.
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There's no problem that a full tank of gas and a sunny day can't fix!

2008 S40, Rotella T 15W-40 w/ZDDP added, Dyna, 140/90-15, Battery Tender Jr., Seat lift, #52.5/150/3 washers, Raptor
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Rodger
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #10 - 01/28/16 at 17:58:59
 
Even BMWs aren't vibration free...or at least the old air-cooled models weren't. I owned 800 & 1000cc "air-heads," the 800 being a bit smoother, while the 1000 had "longer legs" (higher gearing) for higher speed cruising. Careful valve adjustments and carb balancing worked wonders.

That being said, what vibration they had was a high-amplitude/low frequency vibe as opposed to a Japanese UMJ 4-cylinder low-amplitude/high-freq "buzz." Of the two, I'll take the former.

I haven't been on a long, highway-speed cruise on the S40...still carefully breaking it in...but initial impressions tell me that it will be good for 60-65 mph cruising without undue vibration discomfort.

http://www.vintagepaperads.com/1987-Harley-Davidson-Motorcycles-Ad--Comforts-...
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MeeLee
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #11 - 01/28/16 at 18:00:43
 
Dave wrote on 01/28/16 at 06:56:44:
Gearing improvements can be made by going to a 140/90-15 tire, and by adding the Kawasski Pulley Conversion.  The front pulley along works with the stock engine, and is OK with a windshield and bags being added to the bike.  The double pulley conversion is most likely a bit too high of gearing for a stock engine.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1384949185

Modifying the engine the exhaust port alone most likely doesn't do much of anything.....the biggest power improvements come from using a Stage 1 or Stage 3 cam, and switching over to a Wiseco piston that has higher compression (then the exhaust port changes help).

I have no idea about modifying the counter balance system.....it would require a thorough analysis of the engine - it is not something to be done by just winging it.  I believe that Suzuki most likely got it right as the engine is far smoother than the single cylinder bikes are without this system.

At higher engine speeds - the engine uses/loses oil, and it becomes necessary to check and add oil more frequently.

The article was just what I needed.
Not into changing cams etc... just a quick, mild upgrade.
Too bad the front pulley isn't hot swappable.
I probably would have gone with a front pulley and a larger rear tire, but don't have access to milling tools. The job doesn't seem feasible to do with a dremel, unlike the exhaust port, which seems to be an easy job.

Bigger bike is a no for me. Looked into a lot of bikes, but when I read that the exhaust port is restricted, I had hope that possibly 5hp could be gained, and paired with a larger tire and front pulley, could make interstate speeds of 85mph more enjoyable.
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Yoshi
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #12 - 01/28/16 at 18:23:56
 
I have a full chain conversion for sale, lowers rpm at higher speeds. Stock belt cover works with the chain, I just removed the loer cover.

Pm me if interested
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MeeLee
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #13 - 01/28/16 at 18:44:18
 
Yoshi wrote on 01/28/16 at 18:23:56:
I have a full chain conversion for sale, lowers rpm at higher speeds. Stock belt cover works with the chain, I just removed the loer cover.

Pm me if interested

Any pics?
Does it need a pulley on the chain?
I saw an S40 chain mod with a roller system to tighten the chain, and wasn't too fond of it.
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« Last Edit: 01/28/16 at 19:53:53 by MeeLee »  
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badwolf
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Re: Interstate speed improvements?
Reply #14 - 01/28/16 at 18:56:01
 
Seriously, You want to cruise at 85mph all day and you bought a Savage??? Your kidding right? Or do you mean 85k? Is it April 1st already?
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