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Refuges ? (Read 957 times)
Serowbot
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #120 - 11/25/15 at 21:19:21
 
MnSpring wrote on 11/25/15 at 19:22:41:
“ … accused you…”

‘’Troll’   With out a doubt.

“Progressive”,
  Your responses have shown that profoundly.

‘Ultra-Liberal’, That is  a  US term, for, ‘’Progressive”.


An opposing view, is not a troll...
If that is the case...
I'm a troll...

A 9 year,... 18,000 post,... Moderator type troll... Huh...

Where would the TT be without a backboard?.. Grin...

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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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HovisPresley
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #121 - 11/25/15 at 21:46:00
 
"But the newspaper’s interpretation of the poll data was called into question by numerous critics who noted that an earlier survey for Sky News had shown that more than 30 per cent of non-Muslims had shown a degree of sympathy with young Muslims fighting in Syria."

That story in the "Sun" newspaper received record complaints.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/media/press/the-sun-front-page-on-british-m...
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #122 - 11/25/15 at 22:47:08
 
HovisPresley wrote on 11/25/15 at 21:46:00:
"But the newspaper’s interpretation of the poll data was called into question by numerous critics who noted that an earlier survey for Sky News had shown that more than 30 per cent of non-Muslims had shown a degree of sympathy with young Muslims fighting in Syria."

That story in the "Sun" newspaper received record complaints.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/media/press/the-sun-front-page-on-british-m...


Citing an opinion of a survey without the article itself is an extremely weak argument.  

Regarding the record number of complaints, that actually supports my position.  It sounds like the truth hurts.

Best regards,
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #123 - 11/26/15 at 03:49:04
 
MnSpring wrote on 11/24/15 at 17:24:56:
Their are about 270, basic religions in the world.
Their are several Thousand, variations.

For this discussion, will just use two,
and the, ‘books’, they go by.
The Bible and the Quran.

In Both those books, their are references to, ‘killing’ someone for some reason or another.
In Both those books, their are MANY, contradicting  statements.

YET,  How, many of those, ‘Religions’, are,
 STILL, Killing people, because they do NOT,
convert to, ’their’ Religion ?


I can Only think of, ONE !

Let’s see, if a ‘Fringe’ group, called themselves,  ‘Knights Templars’, or ‘Crusaders’.
(Which both went out late 1200’s or early 1300’s.)  700 YEARS  ago !
And, (today),  BEHEADED, people, in the name of that religion.
Do you think the, ‘Christens’, (that, ‘Fringe’ group associated with),
would, DO, something about them. ?????
(Not just give,  ‘LIP’ Service, but, DO, Something!)

Do you think if a, ‘fringe’, group, calling themselves the, "Avenging Angles”,
Cut OFF Peoples Heads,
The, Mormons, would,  DO, something about them ?
(Of course, the, ‘oral traditions’, of the Mormon, ‘Avenging Angles’,
was that they did NOT,  ‘CUT OFF HEADS’, of people that did not believe,
they only, ’Avenged’, wrong doing, among the people, who did, believe in that Religion.)

Gee, perhaps the, Muslims, who believe in Islam, need some, “Avenging Angles”.    LOLOL

Some, ‘religions’, Centuries ago, did Live Human sacrifices.
They continue this practice today, BUT TODAY USE, Efficacy’s, of the human/animal/etc.

But which,  ONE,  is  STILL,   ‘Cutting Off Heads’. ?

And, (outside of, ‘LIP’, service), are ’They’,  (the believers in that Religion),  doing Anything ??????
[b]Do not see, ANY, evidence of it.
[/b]

So, conclusions.
1.  The, Muslims, who follow the, Quran, are to terrified, of their OWN, kind, to do anything about it.
or
2. You never know, ‘when', a Rattlesnake will bite.
You only know, it, ‘ WILL'.
or
3.  Islam, is  NOT, a, ‘Religion’.


I would like to challenge the above statements with a little history; not opinion, not hearsay but HISTORY.

The Sovereign Military Order of Malta, officially the "Sovereign Military Hospitallier Order of Saint John of Jerusalem of Rhodes and of Malta", still exists today.
Their headquarters is in Rome, a few km from my office. They survived and repelled all Turkish, Saracen and Arab attacks but could not repel Napoleon's Navy in 1798. It was then transferred to the UK in 1814, regardless International Law demanded the Knights of Malta be acknowledged their rightful possessions.

YOU ARE WRONG HERE - AGAIN
IRAQ is fighting ISIS - anthough the best and battle-hardened senior Officers were fired from the New Iraqi Army thanks to US influence in the Iraqi Government, so they went off to the other side - purely out of spite and for revenge.
IRAN is fighting ISIS - although the US call this an aggression into Iraqi Territory, even though Iranians and Iraqis are actually fighting side by side !
SYRIA is fighting ISIS - although it is in the US Cabinet's Book of Planned Invasions that after Iraq comes Syrian, then Iran, hence your smear campaign of Pres.Assad.

WHO, on the other hand, IS FUNDING ISIS ?
Roll Eyes Hmmm... let's see...  Roll Eyes
Saudi Arabia is funding ISIS... and when Yemen objected to ISIS, Saudi Arabia invaded Yemen.
Kuwait is funding ISIS...
The United Arab Emirates are finding ISIS...
Bahrein is funding ISIS...
Take notice, ALL OPEC Countries which must send their tankers through the SUEZ Canal.
But Syria is NOT OPEC, so if it became an OPEC-controlled Colony...  Cheesy no more SUEZ !
Oh, and... there's one more Nation funding ISIS... but I'll let Sen. John McCain explain that to you.

As for cutting off heads etc. ... look up the pliight of the Australian Aborigenes and how the CHRISTIAN Clergy would organize mass abductions of Aborigene children from their families in order to destry and annihilate Aborigene Culture and Religion.

Nobody's without sin, MnSpring. Don't even think of picking up that stone...

PS: as for "Islam is not a Religion"...

Please define "Religion".
By Christian Theological standards, a Religion needs:
- a Revelation,
- a Prophet who received the Revelation,
- a Book where the Holy Words of revelation were written down,
- a Clergy which is trained and academically educated in specific Institutes,
- a Clerical Hierarchy,
- a (number of) Houses of Prayer.

By these standards, among Christians: Catholics, Orthodox, Lutherans, Anglicans are acknowledged Confessions of a Religion;
Baptists, Evangelicals etc. are NOT a religion because they lack a clerical organization ("elders" NOT being clergy) and specific education (Theology in College is NOT Theology in a Seminar)

Islam, be it Sunni, Shi'ite or Ba'ha, are a Religion.

Shinto is a Religion.

Buddhism is NOT a Religion because the Gautama Siddhartha was NOT a Prophet, he did NOT receive a revelation but meditated his way to Nirvana (Enlightenment)

As for Mormonism - I do not know whether it qualifies as a Religion because I am not informed on its Clerical orcganization (and I will NOT pore over Wikipedia to find out, I simply do not care)
BUT MORMONISM IS CERTAINLY NOT A FORM OF CHRISTIANITY !!!  Angry
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #124 - 11/26/15 at 06:43:31
 
BUT MORMONISM IS CERTAINLY NOT A FORM OF CHRISTIANITY !!!  

+1
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #125 - 11/26/15 at 07:14:36
 
Folks...obviously we enjoy bickering over details and arguing POV, why....
Gee, I ain't gonna even guess.
I just want to point out one observation, please

When we formulate our opines on secondhand or gathered elsewhere ( that includes research base data ) information, and forge our own opinion based on that, you should really assign it heresy, for in reality, that is all it is.
Human nature has a commonality, regardless of culture, the primitive and basic 3, which are foremost, are, we all seek/need shelter, food, and companionship, or love.
The first two are pretty easy to discern success, the third, ah, not so....
And of the three, this need is prolly the greatest, for within its confines is propagation, spilled over into other sub-feelings with societal implications dictating its influences.
And too, this leads to transmission, or dissemination, of ourselves, which, can be in conflict with others, because society/beliefs have put a condition on a basic need we all have, using it as a tool to leverage and manipulate humans.

The only escaping is to look inside one self and to extend what you find/need, to others, as in you must give, to receive.

A struggle for man cuz we have lost our own compassion (companionship) , yet, demand it of others.
It becomes a vicious cycle of laws, and political showmanship, that leads to only conflict and fragmentation of the human race.
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #126 - 11/26/15 at 10:21:22
 
Quote pg:
"Regarding the record number of complaints, that actually supports my position.  It sounds like the truth hurts."
.........................................................

You are using "The Sun" as a source!

There is even a phrase in the UK, "Sun reader", it's hard to explain to a non UK resident.

The record number of complaints supports either argument, but the background history of the paper's 'sensationalism' and false claims speaks volumes.
You realise that the phone-hacking scandal, and corruption in this newspaper is as famous as it's soft porn on page 3 ?

Really, and regardless of political differences, I advise anyone not to use 'The Sun' as a source of accurate news.
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #127 - 11/26/15 at 10:31:34
 
@Ray,  "heresy" or "hearsay"? Both could be applicable!
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #128 - 11/26/15 at 10:38:52
 
HovisPresley wrote on 11/26/15 at 10:31:34:
@Ray,  "heresy" or "hearsay"? Both could be applicable!


My bad, you bad  Grin
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“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #129 - 11/26/15 at 10:49:46
 
Grin
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #130 - 11/26/15 at 14:12:53
 
HovisPresley wrote on 11/26/15 at 10:21:22:
Quote pg:
"Regarding the record number of complaints, that actually supports my position.  It sounds like the truth hurts."
.........................................................

You are using "The Sun" as a source!

There is even a phrase in the UK, "Sun reader", it's hard to explain to a non UK resident.

The record number of complaints supports either argument, but the background history of the paper's 'sensationalism' and false claims speaks volumes.
You realise that the phone-hacking scandal, and corruption in this newspaper is as famous as it's soft porn on page 3 ?

Really, and regardless of political differences, I advise anyone not to use 'The Sun' as a source of accurate news.


We have this same thing in the USA, it's called a New York Times reader. Ask Donald Trump.
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #131 - 11/27/15 at 10:57:55
 
Serowbot wrote on 11/25/15 at 21:19:21:
" ... An opposing view, is not a troll... "


No it is not.
And. ‘one lines, satirical responses’,
are not trolling.

And, when posters ask, for a more detailed response.
(about that ‘one line/word’ response)
And it is given.     It is not Trolling.

I consider trolling, when a poster,
constantly, throws out a comment,
which has, absolutely, nothing to do, with the, ’thread’.
and when asked Several times, by Several people,
to explain that comment.  No ‘explanation’ is forthcoming.
That, is a much different story.

Also, it is, very, apparent, some people,
read things, they, ‘want’ to hear.
Not read things that were, ‘said’.

On the Subject of accepting mass Quantities,
of, ‘refugees’, which are not ‘vetted’ in any way.
I, Very Sincerely, hope I am wrong.
About a number of them, Taking, this or that, for Free.
Then in the future, USE that training, knowledge, education, tools, Against US.
I, really, hope I am wrong.  

Now before someone gets their, ‘panties’, in a bunch.
Their is Quite a difference, between a, Immigrant, and a  Refugee.
And their, Vastly different, ’types’ of Refugees.
( Gee, are people, with ‘black’ skin,  ALL,  the Same ?)
And a refugee, from 30 -70 -150 + years ago,
is the,  SAME,  as one today?

If you go back, and keep going back, Just about everybody,
is a Immigrant, as to the place they are living now.
Just look  at the people called, Native American Indians.
A well believed, Theory, is they are decedents, of Aztec & Mayan, people, that migrated North.

And again, as to, Muslim based Countries.
Still don’t see any, useful forces of them, working to eradicating the problem.
It’s all ‘lip’, service.

And of course, all,
(the people that, ‘want’, this ‘flood’, of people,
who have a very long ‘history’ of Terrorism).
Are ALL, saying,   “In YOUR Back Yard,  Not  Mine”.

Oh, and one more thing.
Next time I am traveling in several Countries in Europe,
(On a very tight budget)
I will also budget to, make, sure, I stop,
each time I cross a border,
and find a store, and then purchase,
the, ‘appropriate.’ clothing, for that country.  
(Now, let’s see, just what would that be?)
O, Wait, how about a ‘Baseball Cap, and Tennis shoes’.   Grin
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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #132 - 11/27/15 at 13:40:03
 
Like I said before, just because someone doesn't 'get' the connection in a post, or it just plainly goes right over their head, doesn't mean it has 'absolutely nothing to do with the thread'.
Everything I've posted has been relevant (as far as I remember), but post a link to something I've said that you don't see the relevance of, (different opinions aside).

MnS, if you use a 'spell-check' when you write, the words will be spelt right, but they are often different words (words that the 'spell-check' thinks that you mean).

That, my friend, is posting stuff that is completely irrelevant.
But please continue, I always enjoy your posts.

Did you notice that the title of this threads says "refuges" which is a correct spelling, but "refuges" are not the people fleeing Syria, etc.
A 'refugee' can be a person fleeing Syria, etc.

Please reassure me that you are not a teacher, an author, sign-writer or a calligraphist....

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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #133 - 11/27/15 at 17:33:24
 
[quote]MnS, if you use a 'spell-check' when you write, the words will be spelt right, but they are often different words (words that the 'spell-check' thinks that you mean). [quote]

Lighten up Hovis. Nobody likes a grammar, spelling, or typo Nazi. Just sayn'.

Yeah I know. Godwin's Law.
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Re: Refuges ?
Reply #134 - 11/27/15 at 20:10:06
 
HovisPresley wrote on 11/27/15 at 13:40:03:
" ... Please reassure me that you are not a teacher,    ..."

Yea, I Am.  I,   Volunteer,  (for only the last 35, years),
for a class, twice a year,
For,  (Firearms Safety Training).
I Guess that is something unknown in the UK.

’Teaching that class”,  actually,  COSTS,  the,  ‘VOLUNTEER  INSTRUCTORS”.
As we,  ‘DO   Not Get Paid”.
And we expend our time, resources, etc.

And, 2+2,   Actually, Equals 4.
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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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