Donate!
Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register :: View Members
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
Stator question - charging issue (Read 250 times)
Steve H
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1223
Spartanburg, SC
Gender: male
Stator question - charging issue
04/05/15 at 03:38:46
 
So, my 87 decided it didn't want to charge its battery again the other day.  Well, actually probably for a while but noticed it the other day when it would barely turn over and start to get home.

I checked the stator for resistance between all leads and from all leads to ground.  I've got from 1.9 to 2.3 ohms between leads and 1.9 to 2.1 ohms from each lead to chassis ground.  Is this correct?

Voltages from the stator are in the normal ranges.
Regulator is putting out good voltage. Well, I say good voltage...12.6 measured across the terminals of r/r output with the engine running. Voltage went up to almost 13 while revving engine. Battery voltage with engine off was 11.2. 12.1v at the battery terminals.  I'm losing .5v somewhere between the reg/rec and the battery.
Checked charging current from regulator.  At idle, I'm getting 5.6 amps and at approx 3500 I'm getting 7.8 amps.

Battery tests good. Charges right up and maintains voltage while sitting. When full charged, it stays over 12v when starting.

Anybody have any ideas what's going on?
Back to top
 
 

87 LS650, 2005 Ninja 250, 2009 Yamaha C3, 2001 Honda Reflex. On 2 wheels since 6/80.
  IP Logged
Yoshi
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 874
LongIsland, N.Y.
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #1 - 04/05/15 at 05:26:41
 
I usually read the voltage from stator to the regulator which should be a high number in AC voltage in all 3 wires.
Now check the voltage coming from regulator to battery, the stator is working correctly if your battery is showing high numbers while the bike is running.

You might want to load test your battery if its not acting right
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
oldNslow
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 2683
Rochester, NY
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #2 - 04/05/15 at 07:22:24
 
Quote:
Battery voltage with engine off was 11.2. 12.1v


A good, fully charged battery with no load on it should read at least 12.6V across the terminals. I just went out and checked mine - bike hasn't been ridden for about five days - it;s been too cold- and it reads 12.8V.

Like Yoshi suggested,take the battery somewhere and get it load tested, especially if it's more that a couple of years old.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
swedishbiker
Full Member
***
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 119
Växjö Sweden
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #3 - 04/05/15 at 08:56:22
 
Charging current seems ok, so check the battery. You should get 12.6-12.8V over the battery.
Back to top
 
 
14365412   IP Logged
Kris01
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Eat, sleep, RIDE!

Posts: 3767
Tennessee
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #4 - 04/05/15 at 14:21:08
 
Auto Zone will load test it for free.
Back to top
 
 

There's no problem that a full tank of gas and a sunny day can't fix!

2008 S40, Rotella T 15W-40 w/ZDDP added, Dyna, 140/90-15, Battery Tender Jr., Seat lift, #52.5/150/3 washers, Raptor
  IP Logged
Steve H
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1223
Spartanburg, SC
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #5 - 04/05/15 at 17:59:39
 
The 11.2 was the dead battery voltage after it just barely started to get me home.  The battery tests fine.  After charging for several hours, it's fully charged and the voltage numbers are back to normal.  Voltage dropped just a little after taking it off the charger then has held steady all day. Starts like a champ.

All of the voltage readings referenced were with the battery at its near dead state.

R/R output 12.6v at idle getting up close to 13v when revved to ~3500 - 4000. Charging output amps were also with the low battery.

The 12.6 to 13v was at the output terminal of the regulator.  It lost .5v by the time it got to the battery and was only 12.1v. Charging amps were also taken at the output of the regulator.  I couldn't find an easy way to check at the battery.

Should I have a low ohms connection to ground through the stator? It measures ~2 ohm to ground through all 3 leads.  It measures ~2 ohm from lead to lead.  No opens measured.  No dead shorts measured.

I don't remember the exact readings but I had good, high AC volts coming from the stator on all 3 leads so I just went on to the other side of the regulator.


OldNSlow:
Looks like I worded that very confusingly.  The engine off battery voltage when I got home was 11.2. With the engine running after jumping from a car battery to get it started and disconnecting the car battery, I had 12.1 at the battery with engine running and 12.6 and the output of the regulator.


The battery is just over a year old. I had it load tested after charging it and it tested fine.
There is a .5v drop between the reg output and the battery terminal.  I'm wondering if this is normal or if I have a bad connection somewhere in between.  Seems like I would have to have a high resistance in that short amount of wire somewhere to lose that kind of voltage.
Back to top
 
 

87 LS650, 2005 Ninja 250, 2009 Yamaha C3, 2001 Honda Reflex. On 2 wheels since 6/80.
  IP Logged
Kris01
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Eat, sleep, RIDE!

Posts: 3767
Tennessee
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #6 - 04/05/15 at 18:07:44
 
Not to hijack your thread but what is the minimum RPM to charge the battery?
Back to top
 
 

There's no problem that a full tank of gas and a sunny day can't fix!

2008 S40, Rotella T 15W-40 w/ZDDP added, Dyna, 140/90-15, Battery Tender Jr., Seat lift, #52.5/150/3 washers, Raptor
  IP Logged
oldNslow
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 2683
Rochester, NY
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #7 - 04/05/15 at 19:26:32
 
Quote:
Should I have a low ohms connection to ground through the stator? It measures ~2 ohm to ground through all 3 leads


I'm not 100% sure about this as it pertains to a savage, but I don't think so. In most alternators that  I'm familiar with the stator winding  shouldn't show a connection to ground. I can't find anything in my clymers that gives me a clue, but I don't think any of the three yellow wires should show a connection to ground. There should be continuity( low resistance) between any two pairs of them, which apparently you have.

With the engine running at 5000rpm( according to Clymers, but I'm not sure how you are supposed to determine the exact rpm) the AC voltage between any two pairs of the yellow wires should be above 100 volts.

According to the manual, with a fully charged good battery, headlight on HI beam, and engine at 5000 rpm, a voltage reading between 14 and 15.5 volts measured across the battery terminals indicates that the charging system is working properly.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
thumperclone
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

PGR rider  riding
with respect

Posts: 6065
Grand Junction Colorado
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #8 - 04/05/15 at 20:01:29
 
infinity ohms between any of the yellows
this is from the ssm
think I posted the readings some years ago maybe a mod can find them


if not can post them tomorrow

Back to top
 
 

standing for those who stood for US
















  IP Logged
Steve H
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1223
Spartanburg, SC
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #9 - 04/05/15 at 21:24:43
 
I wouldn't expect to see a wye config tied to ground either in a situation where rectification occurs between the 3 phases not between each phase and ground.

I have over 100v AC between any 2 stator leads. No problem there.

I could find nothing in Clymer's either about a connection to ground.

Kris01:
From the output reading I was getting the other day, 5.6amps at 12.6v, that's 70w, you should barely be charging at idle. I would like to see the voltage be a little higher but I think my dead battery was pulling it down consuming all the power it could get.

Looks like it might be charging now.  I ran a bypass through an inline fuse straight from the regulator output to the battery bypassing the ignition switch and the harness wiring back to the battery. Now, I'll just have to ride around a while and see if it fixed it or not.

It seems like losing .5v in 1.5ft of wire is a little excessive. I also noticed a couple times while testing that if I moved the key a little, I would notice a slight but noticeable flicker in the lights...especially with the engine off and key on.

Hope it's either fixed or I can get it fixed soon...prime riding season is just around the corner.
Back to top
 
 

87 LS650, 2005 Ninja 250, 2009 Yamaha C3, 2001 Honda Reflex. On 2 wheels since 6/80.
  IP Logged
prechermike
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

Kalashna Kitty, from
Skat

Posts: 1190
Ponzer, NC
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #10 - 04/06/15 at 03:51:20
 
I'm not sure about amps and ohms, I can do volts pretty good. Just so you know, you guys are probably beyond me. But,

I had an '87 up until a couple of years ago, my diagnosis from the guys on here was the stator was weak. I tried and tested various things, but it seems you have done all I had done. Anyway, if I rode around town for a few days my battery would go down but it i took a 30 mile one way trip things would charge up and be fine.

After chasing that for a while I came up with a good solution. I put a trickle charger on about once a week, left it on overnight, and that eliminated the symptom. I never had any more trouble with starting. I know it did not fix the problem, but it allowed me to start the bike whenever I wanted to.

I can't often help with technical questions, maybe I am no help now. But it worked for me.  Wink Wink
Back to top
 
 

2006, HD pipe, Tkat fork brace, elkhide handgrips, gel seat w/riser, silverblue, Ed L's forward controls, Wristwatch, biblethumper650@gmail.com
prechermike   IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #11 - 04/06/15 at 04:12:02
 
Mike, that's a WorkAround solution. It's a compromise. I do it.
The backhoe has leaky rear axle seals,,, repairs would cost in excess of three thousand dollars.. I just check and fill the oil..
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
oldNslow
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 2683
Rochester, NY
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #12 - 04/06/15 at 07:26:48
 
Quote:
I put a trickle charger on about once a week, left it on overnight, and that eliminated the symptom. I never had any more trouble with starting. I know it did not fix the problem, but it allowed me to start the bike whenever I wanted to.


That's excellent advice for anyone who does a lot of short trips, or doesn't ride the bike every day. The charging system on these things is marginal even when it's working correctly. If my bike is going to sit for much more than a week it gets plugged into the battery tender.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Kris01
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Eat, sleep, RIDE!

Posts: 3767
Tennessee
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #13 - 04/06/15 at 19:04:50
 
Steve H wrote on 04/05/15 at 21:24:43:
Kris01:
From the output reading I was getting the other day, 5.6amps at 12.6v, that's 70w, you should barely be charging at idle. I would like to see the voltage be a little higher but I think my dead battery was pulling it down consuming all the power it could get.



Thanks.
Back to top
 
 

There's no problem that a full tank of gas and a sunny day can't fix!

2008 S40, Rotella T 15W-40 w/ZDDP added, Dyna, 140/90-15, Battery Tender Jr., Seat lift, #52.5/150/3 washers, Raptor
  IP Logged
Steve H
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1223
Spartanburg, SC
Gender: male
Re: Stator question - charging issue
Reply #14 - 04/08/15 at 03:26:42
 
I want to thank everyone for the help.  I will update if it ever stops raining around here long enough for me to ride some.

Still have the question about the ohms to ground on the stator. Clymer says nothing about it and doesn't say to check it.

Is there any leakage back through the reg/rec when the engine is not running? That's the only reason I can think of that would make them carry the charging current through the ignition switch.
Back to top
 
 

87 LS650, 2005 Ninja 250, 2009 Yamaha C3, 2001 Honda Reflex. On 2 wheels since 6/80.
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print


« Home

 
« Home
SuzukiSavage.com
09/27/24 at 04:21:29



General CategoryRubber Side Down! › Stator question - charging issue


SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2!
YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved.