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Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly (Read 1788 times)
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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #120 - 06/10/14 at 16:35:03
 
 
Chromebooks and Chromeboxes double, then quadruple market share inside first 6 months of 2014.

http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/2014-will-great-year-chrome-os/#!Xcmio
 



...... and it seems the younger the folks are the more likely they are NOT to buy a Windows solution to their computing needs .....
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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #121 - 06/11/14 at 17:23:25
 

Intel, still struggling to get into tablets, still locked out of phones,  grabs on to Chromebooks as their next "big thing" ....



Intel now is aiming their quad core 14nm chipsets not at tablets any more, but at Chromebooks.

Two reasons for this -- first, a tablet doesn't need the uber-powerful quad core 64 bit chipset Intel has designed (doesn't need 64 bit memory registers or over 4 gigs of systems memory) and a tablet really doesn't need the very large calculation capacity inherent in the Intel designs.  

And a tablet DOES need good economy in power consumption, something Intel's quad cores really do lack compared to ARM tablet designs.

Intel, realizing they were going to stub their toes yet again in tablet land, looked around and found some of their newest chips slated to go into CHROMEBOOKS and CHROMEBOXES by the various Chrome device makers.

A Chromebook can use 4 or more gigs of systems memory, and it can sometimes use a lot of calculation capacity (big spreadsheets, database crunching, etc).   But only if the Chromebook is used in a very serious business fashion, which is beginning to happen, BTW.

And so now, as of last month, Chromebooks/boxes are HOT HOT HOT -- wiping up in the low end laptop PC arena at nearly 89% of units moved in the less than $300 bracket.    Intel was expecting MS's free Windows efforts to work out a lot better, but no -- the Chromebook is taking off instead.   But only in the sub $300 device portion of laptop land.

This, however, is the exact area where all the current sales are moving.

So, Intel wants to re-purpose themselves to aim at something they might actually succeed at against ARM -- Intel has asked Google to take Chrome OS to the 64 bit level ASAP and to add even more internet independent functionality to the OS as they sense that ARM is lagging in moving to 64 bit and so Intel could have part of a year all by themselves in a burgeoning marketplace if they played their cards just right.

What Google does next sort of determines if ARM controls the immediate future of Chromestuff or if Intel does.   Intel is desperate and wants to win at something (i.e. make a real profit again) even if it has to put Microsoft under the bus to do it.

Google likes to play Switzerland, and they will not drive anybody down into the mud by any direct action of theirs.   So Google will move in a way and at a timing that can be done reasonably by all parties.

Intel has three major problems with this wish of theirs.

1)  Rockchip's RK3288 is out in Chromebooks as we speak (32 bit low end Chromespace is spoken for, and at a level that raises that low end bar a lot).  Folks haven't thought much about it, but the "32 bit" A-17 can answer 64 bit calls from an upstream big/LITTLE paring, so in a sense 64 bit support is already built in to this low end "32 bit" ARM chipset.   Bringing this 64 bit functionality out is Google Chrome OS's job, the hardware requirements are in the chip already and the drivers are in the Linaro store already.   And Google is already working on doing it.

2)  Allwinner, Mediatek and two others already have VERY STRONG octacore ARM processors that can threaten Intel in athe Middle to UPPER level 32 bit Chromespace, easily outperforming any "current production energy efficient" Intel dual or quad core chipset.   But not at 64 bits.

3)  HOWEVER, if Intel pushes hard for this soon to be emphasized "64 bit OS" hole, ARM will have to MOVE SOME to fill the hole up with new 64 bit designs before Intel can get in there and set up shop all by their lonesome.  

Samsung and Qualcomm are 64 bit ready now, with Mediatek and Allwinner and Rockchip coming close behind.   So is Apple, with their already in production A9 64 bit chipset (and yes look at the chart, Apple could possibly play in these same low end areas).

ARM could answer this need simply with a "software based update" that allows the existing 28 nm 32 bit processors to answer 64 bit system calls, or they could continue to force their ARM based crew to actually update to the A57 generation by not releasing any more old A15 stuff in any 14mn downsized designs.  

So far ARM has wanted the crew to upgrade to A57 designs and ARM has only released the one (1) A-17 "interim" design for 28nm.   And that was done to slam block Intel's last move into tablets.



But hey, Intel is due for a win sooner or later.    

Since Chromebooks getting all hot all of a sudden is sorta unexpected and this opportunity sort of falls right into Intel's lap so to speak, now maybe is Intel's win that they are due.

Undecided

The one who is losing really big in this whole thing is Microsoft, who can't effectively even GIVE their software away right now because nobody really wants the current versions.

Look to see Apple come out VERY SOON with their 64 bit quad core A9 in a very thin, very light laptop right off the bat later on this summer.   Aimed at the upper edges of Chromebook space no less.   But with mebbe too high of a price tag to really ring that bell.

Look to see Microsoft to perhaps have to pull more of Win 7's interface design back out of retirement as a desperation move to staunch the blood flowing from the low end Chrome bleeding.

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« Last Edit: 06/13/14 at 08:44:17 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #122 - 06/13/14 at 02:50:11
 

Intel and Google

Intel has a surprise coming when they approach Google while attempting to lock down a market (even a small growing one like Chromebooks/boxes).  

Google will not act to destroy anybody nor will they help you destroy anybody.

But Google will act in order to let you compete (if there is a barrier in their software anywhere that is stopping you in any fashion).

Google will not sue anybody nor will they restrict anybody.   Nor will they give you an advantage over anybody.

Google will give it away for free if it means more people are on line (and viewing Google ads and using free Google services that are laced with discrete ads in side bars, etc).

Google could hand Chromebooks/boxes over to Intel, or they could allow free competition and make Intel earn that market by being BETTER at it than anybody else.

Guess which is going to happen?



====================================



Google does have a bit of a long term quandary.   Their server farms really do hold up the computing power end of the current crop of tiny "insufficient processor" Chromebook/boxes and as "Chromebooks as a class" get numerically more popular that will place more of a load on Google's server farm system.

Microsoft is falling down on the OS job lately, and MS is now making some noises like they are perhaps going to depart the main OS market completely and just sell pay me yearly "services" like Office 360.   Some of this is the whole processor world (including Intel) slowly revolving out from beneath them, literally not even considering their "x86 needs" for very much any more at all (and this includes Intel).

So, Google may wind up supplying a WHOLE LOT MORE of their computing OS products out in the future.  

This presents a potential "growth, too much" problem for Google, way out there in the future.   Google ChromeOS products are supported by Google owned net-based server farm hardware, ChromeOS won't work without it.

Right now Google caps the life of a Chrome OS product at 5 years, beyond that they say technological change in the web itself will make the older ChromeOS products less useful and harder to support.   Plus, since the original product was $200-$300 and cheaply constructed so folks could tend to think of it as "disposable" at the end of 5 years.  

Google certainly seems to think so.   They back this thought by the current average service life of a MS laptop being 3-4 years, on average.


Next item to consider long term is that Google is slowly losing its predominant position as "King of Ads" world-wide.   Badu has now taken over the orient, and other, more local ad services are making inroads into Google's profitability apart from the USA.   None of these guys is supporting anything, much less for free.

So, Chromebooks/boxes are riding on top of Google's web server farms world wide for free right now, but can this continue forever?

Yes, for just as long as using the built in Google services very gently results in enough additional ad revenue for Google to pay for it.  

The Chromebook business use model and the Chromebook educational model become more dubious revenue-wise, since worker bees don't do much with their viewed ads nor do the school children, actually.

So, eventually you may have to load a replacement OS on your ChromeOS machine's hardware, so please do make sure you have enough processor and systems memory and make provisions for some sort in-device or add-on storage and get good I/O ports and such when you go to buy your Chromebook or box.   Trusting wifi and bluetooth to do everything might not work for you way out into the future. 

If it is spec'd so it won't directly support Ubuntu, then don't buy it.

Right now, this "replacement OS on down the road" planning would lead you to prefer an Intel processor in your Chromebook over an ARM processor.   And it would lead you to want a LAN jack and a few USB 2.0 or USB 3.0 ports on the device (specifically, the sorts that can attach to a USB hub device).


Wink


Hey, it is just one of them facts .....   sorry.         Roll Eyes


Look to see Tizen OS coming into play on low end laptops as well, as being pushed on laptops by Samsung and Intel (yup, it's out there right now at the big shows already in development laptops from both Intel and Samsung).   Windowing multi-user Android (oriental versions) will show up soon as well.
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« Last Edit: 06/13/14 at 08:36:16 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #123 - 08/09/14 at 21:54:46
 

http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=chromebox&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps...  


Chrome box prices go down to $150,  supply becomes ample.


    you can buy the entire kit shown here for $179


Chromebooks and boxes are fully accepted now by the Education world, the Business world and the American consumer.

http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=chromebox&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps...

HP is selling the "standard mix" Chromebox in 3 colors on Amazon for only $149.99.  This is the second generation HP Chromebox, the one that is the same as the Asus design using the Intel processor.   The first generation HP unit copied the 3 year old Samsung dual core Exynos board design and it got blasted for being "noncompetitive -- out of date out of the gate" when it first shipped 4 months ago.   It only took HP 6 months to upgrade their design to this year's latest greatest Google reference design and it is worth noting that HP sold all the dual core Exynos machines instead of having to scrap them.

Microsoft should do so good on all their dry fires of late.

HP will now sell a fully modern Chromebox and a wireless mouse and a dedicated Chrome keyboard for the same $179.99 as Asus will sell their base Chromebox.

This real competitive price drop indicates that Chromeboxes have reached production stability finally and finally are in good supply ..... and that Google Chrome Standards are in effect and are holding as both machines are actually the exact same modern Google development standards board that is being made by two different companies.

Upgrades to the machines should be similar, but YouTube upgrade videos on the new generation HP unit have not been posted yet.


======================================


The $149.99 HP Chromebox can plug into existing keyboards and monitors and it can offer a low cost drop in Google environment replacement for an old Windows machine that is being taken out of service by Microsoft's screwing around with dropping old OS's or killing an Explorer, etc.

Chrome is now picking up full Android app use and with Android L coming on board the Chrome/Android divide will be over and Google will be in essence offering a full general purpose OS system at last.   Yes, Android apps will run in 100% off line mode so you got what you have been wanting for off line in Chrome finally.


This whole Chromebox thing has been building really really quick --- the first post in this thread was on 02/19/14 and in six short months the Chromebox has blossomed into a real 31% market share holding force in computing.   And it is going to get a lot bigger .....

So much so that Microsoft is struggling right now to put together a price supported "Bing box" device to try to compete directly against the Chromebox, cannibalizing their own low end PC market share to do so.

Chromebooks/boxes now sit at +31% market share in all laptops while MS Windows machines have dipped -6% to -8% depending on whose figures you use.    

MS has to do something, anything -- they are getting plumb wiped out by the big Chrome wave.


Roll Eyes    ...... change, she comes.
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« Last Edit: 08/10/14 at 16:05:19 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #124 - 08/10/14 at 07:37:03
 

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=194362

Linux - Asus/HP ChromeBox EZ Setup

Since both the original Asus unit and the very newest HP Chromebox both directly use the Google reference board design and have the same software set up they can use the same instructions for how to load Ubuntu or other Linux operating systems.

Since Google enforces STANDARDS in the Chrome world, you get stability and ease of migration down the road if/when you need to migrate to open source for whatever reason.

Also note:    When Google releases Android L and the Chrome devices pick up the ability to run all of Android apps inside Chrome windows, then you will get an automatic Google update to your machine that will include this new functionality.

With being inside a Google Chrome Window begin being the desired place to be, expect Ubuntu (or Libre Office & various Linux softwares) to shortly be able to run inside one of those Chrome windows.

Within 2-3 years, a grumpy reluctant MS Office will have to be there as well, or else MS will be agreeing to fade away into obscurity by their own choices.    

Since Office now runs on Apple iOS on both laptops and tablets it seems that MS Office can make itself subsidiary to other OS systems when they really want to.
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« Last Edit: 08/20/14 at 03:38:40 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #125 - 08/11/14 at 09:50:34
 

http://liliputing.com/2014/08/acer-launches-tegra-k1-powered-chromebook-13-fo...

Acer launches Tegra K1-powered Chromebook 13 for $280 and up



"Acer will offer 4 different configurations, priced from $280 to $380:

   2GB of RAM, 16GB of storage, and a 1366 x 768 pixel display for $280
   2GB of RAM, 16GB of storage, and a 1920 x 1080 pixel display for $300
   4GB of RAM, 16GB of storage, and a 1366 x 768 pixel display for $330
   4GB of RAM, 32GB of storage, and a 1920 x 1080 pixel display for $380

The $330 model is aimed at the education market while all of the other models should be available for pre-order at Amazon and/or Best Buy shortly.

Acer says you should get up to 13 hours of battery life with models featuring a 1366 x 768 pixel display or up to 11 hours of run time from the full HD models.

Both versions of the laptop measure about 0.7 inches thick, weigh about 3.3 pounds, and feature NVIDIA’s quad-core ARM Cortex-A15 processor with 192-core Kepler graphics. They also pack 802.11ac WiFi, USB 3.0 and HDMI output."


Why is this important?

Intel has been crowing that they own ChromeSpace and that no ARM chip unit can compete with them.

Surprise, not only can ARM compete, but they can BEAT --- and they can have TWICE THE RUN TIME that your Intel processor units currently have.

The upper level display Tegra K1 units are only exceeded graphics wise by the Google Pixel (which costs $1,400 more).


Wink


Intel just lost the only win that they had going on in mobile space, and that wasn't really even in mobile space it -- was in laptop space (Chrome Space).


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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #126 - 08/16/14 at 17:16:38
 

Samsung builds specific Octacore chipsets just for Chromebooks

Samsung is uncorking two specific chipsets solely built to go into a Chromebook/chromebox for this Christmas.

Exynos 5480 is the first of the pair, an Octacore A7/A15 variant that is tuned specifically for the Chromebook space.  Clock speeds are maximized, memory space is fast bus 3 gig min, 8 gig max and it uses the newest fastest memory style.   On chip I/0 has been tweeked a bit to specifically include the most modern USB C version 3.1 connector, a standard LAN jack and to have increased range most excellent wifi and blue tooth connectivity.    Left off the chip will be the cell phone radio components, the GPS and other cell phone type items.

The second of the pair will be an unnamed 20nm Exynos 5433 Octacore 64 bit A53/A57 variant, not yet branded, with the same Chromebook optimized tweeks as the Exynos 5480.  

Probably call it the Exynos 5483 .... who knows?    It is Samsung, they will call it something Samsungish and it will likely outperform Intel and their current Chrome chipsets as well.


What does this all really mean?


Samsung sees Chromebooks as a rapidly growing worldwide market that is going to catch some really nice, well integrated Google Android App tricks soon, opening it up to be an even larger general purpose competitor to MS's Windows OS systems and Apple's iOS systems.  

Samsung sees a new Samsung phone tying into this new Android app happy "internet of things" computing world, so you can get all your phone notifications right on your Samsung Chromebook (along with a few other neat Googlish/Samsungish tricks).   Getting within 3 feet of you Chromebook with your Samsung phone will unlock it, give it your password and get it all warmed up and ready for you before you even finish sitting down.

Schools have accepted Chromebooks completely now, greatly curtailing the sales of iOS and Windows machines into the education sector.

Business and Consumer acceptance of Chromebooks and Chromeboxes are burgeoning, currently at the 6x level to last year (5.2 million sold so far this year) with an even greater higher peak point predicted to come at the end of  this Christmas season.

Tegra K1 and Samsung Octacore are taking Chromebooks very seriously right now and are offering chipsets with greatly increased run time and faster throughput (at better graphics levels) than the current crop of generic Intel processors can do.

Intel is expected to eventually respond with more optimized, "improved" Intel Chromebook chipsets, just as soon as they are able to pluck thumb from butt and go do it.

Right now they are being distracted by Microsoft who is trying desperately to put together a Bingbook and a Bingbox device so as to not be drown out totally in the tsunami wave of Chromebooks breaking over the top of their head this Christmas season.  

"Wintel" is desperately calling on the special red bat-phone and Intel must answer the call .....

Intel may turn around when done from the Wintel distractions and find themselves no longer in the Chromebook leadership position that unexpectedly fell into their lap this summer.  

Chrome space is going to evolve and move quickly, as it is being interlinked with Android space by Google and we all know the rapid rate at which that evolves.

Tegra K1 and Exynos 5433/5480/5483? actively optimizing chipsets for Chromespace (all done at the 20nm changeover point) is ominous for Intel -- since Intel hasn't been able to do anything of late except re-label their existing 22nm chipsets for the entire last two calender years .....

Intel's current crop of stuff isn't very good as mobile chipsets go, so they had gone after the Chromebooks as something they could succeed at with what they had on hand.

Now the big phone boys have decided to go actively play in Chromespace too .....  and they play harder and much quicker than Intel has been able to handle to date.


 Wink      


Watch out Intel, the phone boys are swinging strong performing 64 bit ARM Chromespace chipsets at you that are Chromebook optimized and far more energy efficient than your very best mobile or laptop chipsets.

Remember, your Core i3 and Core i5 chipsets are currently in play in Chromespace at this time, so new ARM developments there will involve all your lower end laptop chipsets too.

     Shocked    Shocked    Shocked

Jest guess what can mebbe happen next ????????

Windows 9 is coming out soon and it will supposedly run on these exact same new ARM chipsets.  

The ARM based Chromespace vendors will already have ARM laptop lines set up and running that could be "windowized" very quickly if Win 9 turns out to actually be something that is actually customer desirable.

Or you guys at Wintel could mebbe try to close ranks again and try to go all x86 proprietary on us again --- which will be even more Chromebook food and may prompt even more rapid changes to ARM based Chrome/Android integration.

Or mebbe your buddy MS will simply screw it all up badly again -- Lord knows they know how to do that too.

Smiley

PS    Intel did answer the red bat-phone and Intel said "I'm busy right now making Chromebooks and Chromeboxes and my energy efficient chipsets are all optimized for Android calls right now -- hey, MS, weren't you supposed to be able to run on an ARM chipset by now anyway?
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« Last Edit: 08/20/14 at 03:51:15 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #127 - 08/16/14 at 18:00:46
 

Apple, where are you?

Huh


We know the worldwide 14nm production delay debacle has you all tangled up right now, what with having to come out with a 20nm A8 chipset for Christmas instead of your 14nm A9 chipset that you wanted to have done by Christmas ..... but this endless endless silence is going to kill you if Samsung and Tegra K1 start building up real momentum in Chromespace that begins to erode away your existing laptop market share.

Folks who get attracted to them new Chromebooks swinging all them nifty free Android Apps are going to tend to want to match it with an Android phone next time they buy a new phone .....   this could be a bad thing for you.

Silence does not serve you well at this point in time, Apple.

We know you will talk to us September 6th a little bit when you push out the iPhone 6 with a 2 ghz dual core A57 64 bit chipset at 20nm.   (Samsung and TSCM are both building chips for you as fast as they can)  However, this will not be an exclusive speed range or 20mm lithography level as Qualcomm and Samsung are already shipping at those levels.

Since you are copying Samsung's format and size and about 6 of Google Android's features, on a lithography level that is already shipping from two Android big phone vendors you may be seen as being a wee bit late to the party.

But you do need to get over this total big silence thing about your laptops "until you have the entire planned run's components built up".  

No, you have no compelling fallback high efficiency chipset from Intel that is worth using at all in your eyes.   Everyone agrees with this, btw.

But you could get a quantity of your early and ongoing production of 14nm quad core A9's put together in enough volume to at least roll out a limited run of just one of your upper upper end laptops so everyone could drool over it for the next 8 months or so.

A very very small volume of Chrome Pixels got Google a whole whole lot of very good PR mileage -- it is a trick you might want to try.
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« Last Edit: 08/17/14 at 08:20:58 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #128 - 08/17/14 at 07:38:38
 

Unexpected consequence of the Chromebox tsunami surge -- Chromeboxes are killing off all demand for ARM demo boards as they all now all fall inside the same price range.    

Why mess with a demo board when you can just AMAZON direct ship the whole thing to you completely pre-digested ???

Folks like Odroid are discontinuing all production and frantically selling off their existing stocks as the big phone guys are now getting into the Chromebox business using the same chips that Odroid has been building their demo boards with.  

The difference in what you can now get for your money means nobody is going to buy an Odroid demo board any more, ever again.


  $179, but you have to pay more for a flash drive and a power supply and for the OS simm card.

   or

  $179 and it is a complete mouse and keyboard kit with all memory and power supply and OS included.

Smiley   ....duh, i think I'll pick the one I have to put everything together myself and program it and tweek just about everything just to get it to work and do anything at all ......



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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #129 - 08/17/14 at 14:59:15
 
HP is attacking this market very well, they're doing a good job of filling the gaps left open by Acer, ASUS and Samsung.

For instance - this Chromebox has support for DP and HDMI, and can handle dual displays, like a real computer Smiley

I recently picked up their 14" Chromebook, and man, it's a pleasure to use: Big, bright display, good keyboard, a responsive and predictable track pad. It has 8+ hours of battery life..., it goes in to a power miser mode when I close the lid...several times I've forgotten where I left the power adapter because I only need to charge it once every few days. I use for work and personal computing.

Thanks for tracking this market space, this is looking pretty interesting.
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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #130 - 08/17/14 at 17:35:22
 

Glad you like it, here is the link for purchasing the $179 white all in one kit.

http://www.amazon.com/HP-Chromebox-Desktop-Bundle-White/dp/B00LB11JYS

Now, since the Chromebook is taking off good to the point chipsets are being customized just for that particular use, expect some even mightier ARM processors to become available that offer superior battery life.   Expect Intel to eventually drop a new one for the Chromebox that is more powerful (but not as careful with battery life since it runs off a cord all the time anyway).

Remember, you can buy the Chromebox by itself right now for $149.99 if you have your own keyboard and mouse that you like.    You get to pick your color on the separate box by itself.

http://www.amazon.com/HP-Chromebox-CB1-014-Desktop-White/dp/B00KD5RUPA/ref=sr...

Please be aware that the actual price of components for these units are being subsidized by Intel as part of their grand "loss leader price support" plan -- when the subsidy dies off the price will jump $60 or more a unit overnight.

Get them while Intel is still being stupid, in other words .....

For a laptop style Chromebook, the Acer 13 Tegra K1 unit looks very very good right now -- similar price to the Intel based units gets you double the run life between battery charges.
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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #131 - 08/18/14 at 09:56:35
 
http://liliputing.com/2014/08/hp-stream-14-inch-notebook-coming-soon-199.html



HP Stream 14 inch notebook coming soon for $199

"The notebook features a 14 inch, 1366 x 768 pixel display, an AMD A4 Micro-6400T “Mullins” processor which is a 4.5W quad-core processor with Radeon R3 graphics, 2GB of RAM, and either 32GB or 64GB of eMMC solid state storage.

The HP Stream features 802.11b/g/n WiFi, Bluetooth 4.0, HDMI output, and it has an SDXC card reader, 1 USB 3.0 ports, 2 USB 2.0 ports, four speakers with Beats audio, and a 720p webcam.

HP includes a 32Whr battery and the notebook runs Windows 8.1 software and comes with 100GB of cloud storage for 2 years, courtesy of Microsoft’s OneDrive."


Stream is interesting, it is a totally Microsoft price supported 14" laptop that will tell us pretty much if Microsoft has a future any more in the low end of things.

When it comes out and is competitively tested we will see if AMD's new Mullens Radon 3 SOC stuff is any good AND if Windows has managed to get lean and mean and lite and fast enough -- finally.





AMD Mullens is AMD's second attempt at a fully integrated tablet SOC chipset (and indeed the motherboard inside the 14" laptop case looks to actually be an AMD tablet reference design that is rattling around inside the big 'ol 14" laptop case.    

Lots of room for some additional battery, in other words, should you decide to go there.

The whole question behind the Stream unit is the "BingOS" and its suitability and functionality (should MS actually be stupid enough to actually use the cut down OS in this product) or with it being HP's Microsoft Saving New Product Class Flagship can HP get the full Win 8.1 OS or something better out of MS.  

Especially since this is the flagship of a new "chromebook killing" product line that has MS's future riding on it.


First question becomes, should MS wait until they have Win 9 ready to go (or should Stream's OS actually be Windows 9 lite in other words).


In short, go throw it out there in a hurry with Win 8.1 full or the Bing'd version and IT WILL FLOP ON YOU just as sure as the sun rises.    

People HATE Win 8.x totally and with a passion.

Win 9 might be a different story altogether, providing you have actually managed to make the new OS desirable again.

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« Last Edit: 08/19/14 at 08:50:06 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #132 - 08/19/14 at 07:12:07
 

Why the AMD Mullens chipset?

FACT:  all of Intel's current low energy chipsets are currently somewhat optimized for ARM style system calls and Android now, not Microsoft or "pure" x86.   

MS was on board with this done deal Intel processor change way back when it happened, but MS internal has kinda forgot again about their promise "to program Win 8.1 to run well on ARM".    Optimized to run well on ARM is a lot different than "can run on ARM" -- optimization means it runs as fast or faster, as good or better on ARM than x86 .....

Mebbe it was slated internally for "doing ARM really well" in Win 9 .....  or did you really just quietly decide internally right along to be right proper proprietary x86 assholes all over again, MS, and leave it totally optimized for x86?    Appears so, anyway.

If so, we hope you like them AMD chipsets, MS, because that "Intel totally tuned for x86 on any low end stuff" ship sailed quite a while ago.

So, Intel is really busy right now building up a whole lot of Chromebooks and Chromeboxes with their "energy efficient chipsets" and so Intel didn't choose to give any of them to MS for free to go into your Microsoft low end wonder machine.  

Intel also didn't want to take part in any "fall flat on your face trying to compete against Chrome with Win 8.1" episode as Intel understands the Chrome World pretty well by now and they sense what the probable outcome of that would be already.

Intel also makes some money putting their chipsets into Chromebooks and Chromeboxes ......  and Intel needs to make some money out of something right now.

(Intel stockholders are getting really really pissed at Intel management again for throwing their money away by the dump truck load on Mobile)

AMD however was willing to play "loss leader" this time in this extreme low cost MS PR space and they have got this new Mullens SOC sitting around that hasn't been burning up the world lately.  

As a matter of fact Mullens first foray in a HP Pavilion 10" netbook looking thingie got 100% reviewer panned for very poor battery life (which had more to do with HP's dumb choices to use a small battery size and an energy eating constantly spinning platter hard drive to go along with with the Mullens SOC).

This 14" HP Steam Machine is going to be swinging an energy eating 14" screen and a sub-normal sized battery, so look to see "sub-average" battery life out of the $199 Steam Machine as it is currently configured.  
Microsoft should listen to AMD and put a decent sized battery in the device -- the egg on face warning has been given already by AMD.

The Mullens SOC got good reviews for graphics and above average for CPU performance.    
Mullins has a nifty turbo mode that will 1.8x the CPU speed during heavy demand use and a temp sensor that will cut it all back when things heat up past skin warm as temperature measured on the outside of the case.   A simplistic form of the Intel energy nanny chip in other words.

The AMD Mullins SOC itself is rather hardy and rigorous device, it can heat up to 220+oF during turbo mode and stay right on up there temperature-wise without taking any harm, and believe me that superspeed turbo mode will run it right on up there if you start doing something really demanding on a long term basis.  

Hey, you go say "it is a PC" and folks will go do PC things with it, you know ..... like play PC games on it.

The Mullins SOC can take the heat, but the operator holding it on his lap likely cannot.   (neither can the battery life, really -- it takes lots of power to make all that heat you know)

Thus the operator's skin sensibilities becomes the limiting factor in this turbo speed game -- so the Mullins system has a "skin sensor" mounted on the case itself that actually controls the turbo mode on these AMD Mullins units.    

Folks will likely be quite pleased with the unit's CPU/GPU performance, if HP will just put enough battery in the case to drive it for a long enough use life.   And remember to put you a right goodly sized large aluminum heat spreader sheet metal plate between the motherboard and the user's lap for good operator comfort ..... lots of vent slots in the bottom of the case will help cool the plate off too.

What?    You had planned on just re-using the existing HP 14 Chromebook's super thin case?

For a full on PC gaming experience with a turbo style heat'm up chipset ???

Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    Roll Eyes    


So, after fixing all these little niggles  --- success finally depends on the base OS functionality.    Is the OS energy efficient?   Is it quick and responsive?   Is it easy and intuitive to use?

Microsoft needs to spend the money to get enough battery into the Stream Machine to at least get "average" battery life and they need to REALLY AVOID any unpleasant OS experience right out of the box.  

No banner ads or other Bingish bullshite.

This is it -- Microsoft's big comeback play is happening soon.   This is also AMD's big comeback play as well.   Both have a lot riding on the Stream Machine as both are underdogs trying to stage a comeback.

Direct comparisons to Intel and ChromeOS will be forthcoming instantly, since HP currently makes an identical 14" Chromebook (which is desirable enough to command an extra $100 in price point right now).

A User Test Group of HP, Microsoft and AMD people need to sit down with their prototype Mullens machine and the Chromebook 14 that is already shipping and figure out exactly what they have to do to make the Stream machine BETTER than the Chromebook right out of the gate.

Since MS and AMD are blowing money out their butts for a comeback, they should blow a little more money and time to make sure they REALLY REALLY GET that big comeback.

Using Win 8.1 isn't an option, it is a no-show from the get-go -- don't bother even thinking about it.    You were stupid to even mention it in the Steam Machine release promo materials posted on the HP product page.

You have Win 9 prototype software that you could polish up and use.   You could even call it StreamOS and tout it as an improvement .....

MS .... if Win 9 can't be polished and tweeked to make up a real win on the Stream Machine, then you are dead in the water anyway .... MS


Wink


Or you can go be all Microsoft The Stupid again and go build a fall on your face flop again, just like that little 8" tablet thingie that you just went and built 20,000 of them, then you looked at them, then you realized MS Office wouldn't fit at all on the 8" screen and so you had to go scrap all 20,000 of them the week before the big introduction foo-rah, all this taking place just a few months ago .....


===============================


PS  The HP Stream Machine product page just got yanked right off the web after being up for over a week  .....  there is apparently some Streaming rethink going on at MS/AMD/HP.    

Finally got that Stream Machine prototype run built, huh?    Sorta sucked compared to that exact same 14 model of Chromebook, didn't it?

Grin


Try try try try try try try try try try try try try try try try try try again ......
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« Last Edit: 08/21/14 at 05:27:50 by Oldfeller--FSO »  

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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #133 - 08/20/14 at 10:16:14
 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883280512&nm_mc=AFC-C8J...



New low price on HP Chromebox from New Egg      $160 less a $20 gift card   $140 net
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Re: Chromebox predictions coming true very quickly
Reply #134 - 08/21/14 at 04:40:29
 

Intel has been funding the entry of their chipsets into the mobile world for over 3 years now.   They have actually gotten some traction finally, in the Chrome world.

They have lost BILLIONS and tens of BILLIONS of dollars of money earned off of other products so they could bribe, bully and buy their way into the mobile industry where their processors really do not fit very well at all.    For the last 2 years these processors really haven't changed very much either (but the energy nanny chipsets have been improved greatly).    

In Chrome, they finally have something their processors do fairly well at.

Now they are proposing General American Programming STANDARDS based off their semi-ARM, semi-x86 not integrated at all style of Intel BS -- you can remember when I predicted this classic Intel behavior would eventually occur.  

Because there currently are no published applications programming standards in Chrome or in mobile, Intel is getting listened to more than they should be.   Remember, an Intel general standard leads to Intel "owning" that market and eventually that intellectual property down the road a piece.  

It is a trick they learned from Bill Gates and MS.

Google needs to squash any Intel attempts at pushing a Intel processor based set of programming standards for the Chrome world -- and Google needs to actively expedite some ARM competition into that realm or else they will quite possibly lose control of what they have created to Intel.  

ARM needs to bring forth their next generation of ARM processors, the ones that can compete with Intel at laptop and desktop levels.    ARM needs to back up these chipset designs with Linaro I/O interface and VERY FIRM PROGRAMMING STANDARDS that keep all the orientals from going batshit crazy all over the place doing it every strange which way (something that has somewhat crippled ARM's upstream advancement so far) ....   Sad thing is the orientals won't pay any attention to these standards, except to break them if it is any form of market advantage for them to do so.


============================


The digital divide between the producing countries that make and buy all the goodies and the USA who now buys the wee little minority of these goodies is becoming VERY pronounced right now.

What is made in S. Korea and China for local use is VERY different from what HP or Asus or Acer or Lenovo sells through Amazon or Best Buy or Wally.    The newest & best stuff varies the most, as the Far East really gives a flip about American standards any more.

Google, MS and Intel are currently politically "greatly frowned upon" in China by the Chinese government -- and Chinese natural stuff is becoming more and more available here in the USA.    

Expect it to be different -- it is.

Stuff costs a whole quantum leap less money bought direct from China and in many cases if you want to buy the raw state of the art you have to buy Chinese directly as they sell it in their home market first and only export it once demand is totally satisfied or else the new one has just come out.

When Xiaomi hits the US market, expect it to be Xiaomi all the way -- it works well, it has very similar features but it isn't Google at all.   It costs less than half as much, too.

Expect Samsung to become more different over time as well.   Samsung sells world-wide and the majority of their customers live in the Far East.


Change, she comes ......
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