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Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ (Read 1702 times)

Serowbot

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #15 - 12/14/13 at 20:50:09

...(please read this... no cutting or pasting here,... I took a lot of time to write this...
If you read it with an open mind,.. you will either agree, learn something new,... or just keep a closed mind... it is up to you...
All I ask is that you read it)...
______________________________________

Decisions, decisions, decisions...

Allow me a moment to point out a few statistics, and pieces of historical context...
...and I hope you will accept them with an open mind...
Very open... open wide... Huh

...

Statistically,... the very most significant predictor of whether you will believe a conspiracy.. (the very most)...
...is, whether you believe in any other conspiracies...
The likelihood of your being Republican or Democrat,... Christian, Muslim, Jew, or non-religious,.. is mostly based on what your parents believed...

Both of my parents claimed Christianity as their faith... but,.. I was not churched...
I did pray a child's prayer as a toddler, and was fascinated by a semi-comic book rendition of the life of Jesus that I had as a child...
So,.. you might say I was raised a lightweight Christian...
I'm now a godless atheist... (but admittedly, I wasn't much of a Christian)...

So,... you are what you are born... your beliefs are your parents...

Secondly,...the history...
You are what you are taught...
Jews have been persecuted...
This didn't start in 1948... it has been millennia...
Why?...
The why, is money... they seem to have it... and we are suspicious of why they got it... (and why we don't)...
It comes from the suspicion that they are no better than us, but they have more, and they must be doing something dastardly that we can't figure out in order to be doing so much better...
They control money...

Well,.. they control money because we told them to...
A thousand years ago,... when "Christians" were more devout,... Usury (lending for profit), was a crime among Christians... but, Christians did need loans... So, they invited Jews to their communities... wealthy Jews, that had no prohibition against usury...
Christians used Jews for their money, and simultaneously resented them for it...
... and this is the root of the hatred of Jews by Christians...
All the "they killed Jesus". and "Jews are cheaters", is rooted in this resentment of their lending for profit when Christians weren't allowed...

Today,... Christians lend... there is no disgrace in investing, lending, or making a profit from your money... most of us get interest from our savings, and 401k's, and stocks or money market accounts...
Years ago you would have been stoned to death...

Today it's different... but the old prejudices remain... passed down parent to child, in the same way we hold our Southern, Jersey, British, accents...
They aren't directly taught,... just culturally absorbed...

If you think you aren't affected... try not sounding Texan,... or Carolinian,... or British,... or Jersey...
Some things are ingrained...
You can pretend different,.. but it is deeply set...

Very many things... not just accents and prejudices...
We are what we are made... becoming is a tiny part us...
The more we stretch ourselves, the more we overcome it...
...but never doubt that it is there...
And it isn't some awful thing,.. it is natural...
All creatures have a wariness of the unfamiliar,... and a comfort from the familiar... Birds, monkeys, fish, humans, even bugs...
There is no shame in having a good instinct... but as humans, we have minds that can control our beliefs...

Best to all... JMHO... Wink

...

« Last Edit: 12/14/13 at 21:57:02 by Serowbot »

Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh

...

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ZAR Serious Thumper Offline Rock this town! Rock it inside out! Posts: 961 Kentucky, USA Gender:	Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ Reply #16 - 12/14/13 at 20:59:10 Sero I'm impressed,but not suprised! You post is well thought out and presented. While I don't agree with all of your assessments, I can see the logic behind them.
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Serowbot YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline OK.... so what's the speed of dark? Posts: 28416 Tucson Az Gender:	Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ Reply #17 - 12/14/13 at 21:34:12 Thank you, ZAR... I appreciate that you read it... and that you took it in the spirit intended... Agreeing with me is secondary... You listened... Peace, Serow
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old_rider

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #18 - 12/14/13 at 23:22:07

Your logic applies well to you and how you were raised, however not all children had parents, so some have no prejudice or have even more, depends on lifes instances.
It also is determined on how the mind of the individual works, how fast or slow the synopsis fire, how well memory is retained or even understood.
I have often been told I have a closed mind, simply because I disagree with someones point of view, but in all fairness, I have a view also...so in turn their mind to me is closed.
Someone recently called me a heartless bastard because I did not cry at a friends funeral, a good friend... but yet I bawled my eyes out when my sons girlfriend was taken from him, I bawled my eyes out when my pet cat had to be put down. Heartless bastard... I think not...
It is all in how you process the information before you, and your life's instances and stages of growth will determine the outcome.
More often than not, if I don't see it happen, and you didn't see it happen, how can we "prove" it? pictures, film, audio files ect.... can be duped to the point that they cannot be proven to be tampered with.
I often read both sides of the story and determine in my own due time which I deem the most truthful and often, more often than not I choose the realistic version vrs. the ones that involve conspiracy (not saying the conspiracy is wrong, just that I don't personally believe it to be true). I'm more of a realist... If I could change the world I would...but I'm not going to change it, can't see that happening.... if you can... go for it.

We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.

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Serowbot

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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #19 - 12/15/13 at 00:31:49

old_rider wrote on 12/14/13 at 23:22:07:

Your logic applies well to you and how you were raised, however not all children had parents,..

Am I to assume you were raised by penguins?...

Even orphaned or adopted children are influenced by their adult indoctrination and cultural influence...
If you believe yourself to be immune to learning,.. that is your prerogative...
... but this is of what I speak..
You learn from what you are exposed to...
We all are educated by what information we are given...

If you were raised as a feral child by a wolf pack, you would have indoctrinated beliefs and prejudices...
Wolf beliefs and prejudices...

We were all raised... there is no intelligent life without upbringing...
If you are telling me that you weren't raised by your birth parents... that is irrelevant...
You were raised... in a location, at a time, by a living being...
... or locations... by beings...
The wider your experience, the wider your understanding... but no one can understand all experience from personal experience... we need a broader palette and empathy...
What makes us human is our ability to live in another's shoes and understand...
That is why we cry when we hear sad news, or watch a sad moment in a film,.. or laugh when we hear a joke, or when others laugh
Some intelligent animals have been seen to do this to some extent... but, we are the best at it...
.. as far as we know...

Attacking my premise on technicality only proves my point...

Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh

...

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WebsterMark

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #20 - 12/15/13 at 05:48:07

A good post Sew, thank you.

The Jewish people have been oppressed, but have just as often been the oppressor. A fair reading of the Old Testament (which is a valid history book for their early days) shows them both captive and taking captives. Every nation or group of people a couple thousand years old has ups and down.

My point would be that today’s anti-Semitism as displayed in Rat’s original post does not have an easily defined origin. He doesn’t know why he hates Jews, he just does. I think you’re correct in that the Jews took to business, and quite successfully, when many first came to American. This continues today where being lazy and poor is frowned at in their communities. Positive peer pressure if you want to call it.

Plus, they are not a ‘race’ defined by physical characteristics rather they defined themselves as a race mostly by religious beliefs. Is there another group that does that? I can’t think of a similar group.

But the hatred towards Jews is not money based. If it was, Rat and others would hate Asians who seem to be able to flourish in America while other minorities cannot.

If it is caused by an unfair US foreign policy, then why not hate the Koreans who we bailed out in a war and now South Korean’s economy is pumping along quite nicely. We sacrificed 58,000 lives so Hyundai could exist? No, it’s not that.

My opinion is some people have a hatred for Jews for the same reason ESPN wasn’t going to show a commercial that actually spoke the word: Jesus. That one word brings out a visceral reaction in some and I would say the word Jew does the same for some people, not all. It can be a dividing line.

My own belief why, and this is will really tick a few people off but whatever. All of us have evil in us. We can recognize that evil or not. We can define it or not. We can to a certain degree, control it or not.

I think it’s a fundamental law of nature, no different than gravity that Evil always recognizes when it’s in the presence of Good and is humiliated when its failings are on display. So it responds by lashing out at Good, trying to bring Good down to its level.

Remember, Jesus said “I did not come to unite, but to divide. I will turn a Mother against her Son, a Father against his Daughter.”

The second part of my good/evil law of nature is that Good on the other hand, doesn’t always recognize when it’s in the presence of Evil and can be deceived.

All of us have evil within us, it is our nature. If we recognize that, we can fight against it.

The final part of my good/evil law is to remember the opposite of love is not hate, but selfishness.

That's my Sunday School lesson today folks...... fire away.

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RatdogWillie

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #21 - 12/15/13 at 08:06:26

WebsterMark wrote on 12/15/13 at 05:48:07:

My point would be that today’s anti-Semitism as displayed in Rat’s original post does not have an easily defined origin. He doesn’t know why he hates Jews, he just does.

Will Mark Webster read this reply???
Probably not since he never reads my posts or if he does, he skims it then gives an incorrect half-baked reply.

Well, what the heck…. I will repeat myself again.

Webster, you have no concept of who Semitic peoples are. True Semitic people are of Arabic, Hebrew, Amharic, and Aramaic races. Since the zionist occupying government of Palestine are mostly decentants of Ashkenazi Khazarians and are not descendants of Arabic, Hebrew, Amharic, or Aramaic origin and not related to the biblical Israelites, Then my professed hatred of zionism and the evil Israel zionist government is not anti-Semitic. Since the evil zionists have infiltrated the U.S. government and funnel money, favors and war equipment to evil Israel at a great cost to American taxpayers, my hatred of zionism is justified. Since the zionist manipulated the U.S. congress thru the AIPAC to do their bidding and fight their wars at a great cost in American treasury and American lives, my hatred for zionism is justified.

So No, I am not anti-Semitic. I like Semitic folks just fine. I am however very much anti-Parasitic and the zionists are very much parasites.

« Last Edit: 12/16/13 at 14:02:07 by RatdogWillie »

What was the best thing before sliced bread?
Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot them?
How is it possible to have a civil war?
What if there were no hypothetical questions?

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RatdogWillie

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #22 - 12/15/13 at 08:10:34

WebsterMark wrote on 12/15/13 at 05:48:07:

Plus, they are not a ‘race’ defined by physical characteristics rather they defined themselves as a race mostly by religious beliefs. Is there another group that does that? I can’t think of a similar group.

Have you heard of Amish people? They define themselves correctly as a religion, not a race. They don’t resort to trickery to stop people from faulting them. Former Israeli Minister Shulamit Aloni explains in less than a minute and a half.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0kWAqZxJVE

« Last Edit: 12/16/13 at 14:03:08 by RatdogWillie »

What was the best thing before sliced bread?
Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot them?
How is it possible to have a civil war?
What if there were no hypothetical questions?

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RatdogWillie

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #23 - 12/15/13 at 08:13:30

WebsterMark wrote on 12/15/13 at 05:48:07:

If it is caused by an unfair US foreign policy, then why not hate the Koreans who we bailed out in a war and now South Korean’s economy is pumping along quite nicely. We sacrificed 58,000 lives so Hyundai could exist? No, it’s not that.

Why not hate the Koreans like I hate the evil Zionists? Well there are no dual Korean/American citizens infiltrating the U.S. government and manipulating policy to rob American treasury and wage wars of aggression for them.

South Koreans only seek protection from invasion and do not seek a “Greater Korea”.

South Korea does not threaten the world with the “Sampson Option”.

South Korea appreciates the aid that the U.S. offers and does not continuously demand more.

What was the best thing before sliced bread?
Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot them?
How is it possible to have a civil war?
What if there were no hypothetical questions?

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RatdogWillie

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #24 - 12/15/13 at 08:15:49

WebsterMark wrote on 12/15/13 at 05:48:07:

My own belief why, and this is will really tick a few people off but whatever. All of us have evil in us.

I do not have any evil in me! No I don’t. I hate evil, that is why I hate parasites such as fleas, ticks, roaches, mosquitoes and zionists.

I appreciate your honesty for admitting that you harbor evil. It has been obvious with the antisemitism that you have displayed in the past and your desire to bomb the second largest Jewish population in the Middle East.

What was the best thing before sliced bread?
Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot them?
How is it possible to have a civil war?
What if there were no hypothetical questions?

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raydawg

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #25 - 12/15/13 at 09:41:09

Bot.....

Truth or belief, is subjective. Everyone believes as they do based on a whole bunch of mitigating circumstances.

You have revealed by your post/reply some of the criteria that you believe you have drawn from, to form your belief structure.

Am I entitled to deny you "your" beliefs or truths?
Based upon what, my beliefs and truth?
Are you to deny mine?

I think the crux of the question is WHY do I need to prove others wrong, to prove I'm right?

I think each one of us needs to search their own heart and soul to understand their beliefs, and why they believe them.

Do I look upon mine intellectually, or spiritually?

The biggest question to answer, and perhaps the telling of its riddle is, do my beliefs sustain me with peace, and joy, from within, our nature state, and one mankind tries to replicate through many actions as we taint our buzz with all sorts of toxic and opposing behavior.....

Or, are they predicated on external factors, that I need to control in order to benefit from them (beliefs).

I can't possibly answer yours, can you answer mine?

“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)

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old_rider

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Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’
Reply #26 - 12/15/13 at 10:05:25

All I am saying is that "how I was raised" does not mean I follow the beliefs or life styles of those that raised me....

Each individual forms their own "opinion" from the experiences in their life. If you have followed the beliefs of your birth/adopted/foster parents then you surely cannot think for yourself and have their prejudices.

But to say I have the same prejudices of those that raised me is a misbelief... I do not, I formed my own prejudices and opinions based on what I believe is "right or wrong" "good or bad".

What I got out of your statement was we follow what we are taught reguardless of what we think, my statement was to say that each individual has the ability (but may not use it) to use the information and decide on what they believe to be true or false and form their own prejudice or opinion. (I really don't like that word prejudice, it is so harsh...so "set in stone" against everything...like you could not be swayed).

So maybe I misread your statement or you misread mine... sometimes my exact "thought" does not transfer to text very well.

We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ Reply #27 - 12/15/13 at 11:46:12 That was a good post Rowboat,best Ive seen in a while, Ya know, theres a reason there are laws regarding conspiracies. Its because theyre common,
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RatdogWillie Serious Thumper Offline Nostalgia isn't what it used to be... Posts: 854 Johnstown, PA. Gender:	Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ Reply #28 - 12/15/13 at 12:57:56 The way it is in apartheid Israel now: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx-B67s8g3E (first 11 minutes)
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RatdogWillie Serious Thumper Offline Nostalgia isn't what it used to be... Posts: 854 Johnstown, PA. Gender:	Re: Israel’s ‘Right To Exist’ Reply #29 - 12/18/13 at 07:15:42 Lest We Forget… http://theuglytruth.wordpress.com/2013/12/15/lest-we-forget-44/
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