Donate!
Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register :: View Members
Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print
How much would it really cost us (Read 155 times)
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #15 - 10/30/13 at 10:41:36
 
What VAT opponents are missing is that a VAT catches all revenue - there are no deductions, "loopholes", or means to dishonestly evade it.  No forms to fill out by the average guy either.  Buy a pair of jeans at WalMart and you pay the tax.  Everyone pays - regardless of whether you're an illegal working off of the books somewhere, or a truly wealthy person buying an Armani suit.
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
WebsterMark
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 12926

Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #16 - 10/30/13 at 11:16:47
 
Ive already learned about you,, .....You really believe the taxes theyre getting now wont stay and they ADD the VAT?

No Jog; you've haven't 'learned about me', cause if you had, you'd know while the idea of a flat tax or VAT tax is appealing, I'm 100% against it because I know politicians (mostly liberals, but conservatives as well) would still push thru more taxes on top of it. How many 'temporary' taxes were later (and quietly) made permanent?. I don't trust any politician to do what they say. The very definition of a politician is someone who always keeps the door open...
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
WebsterMark
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 12926

Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #17 - 10/30/13 at 11:20:52
 
WM -
In this day and age, most middle class people want to see "the rich" punished any way they can be.

I think it was Midnight who, the other day, was talking about how, in his youth, about everyone was middle class.  Well, my family was definitely lower middle class- my parents never owned a home.  My dad always had a job, but not a high paying one, and my mother worked too, the exception for a 1950s family.
Yet, they always admired successful people, and told me that if I'd get an education and work, I could increase my standard of living over what they had.  They actually held the really rich in awe.
Not so today.


J; As a young child, I was raised by my two aunts; older women who grew up during the depression. They were the same way. While they were yellow dog Democrats, they didn't hate the rich with the jealousy we see today and particularly on this forum. Not 100% certain what changed, but something sure did. I guess media exposure and advertising just overwhelms some people with the idea they are getting cheated. Everyone's a victim of what someone else did, never themselves.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Midnightrider
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Alliance Member

Posts: 3244
Winston Salem, NC
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #18 - 10/30/13 at 12:15:35
 
Jerry Eichenberger wrote on 10/30/13 at 10:33:23:
WM -
In this day and age, most middle class people want to see "the rich" punished any way they can be.

I think it was Midnight who, the other day, was talking about how, in his youth, about everyone was middle class.  Well, my family was definitely lower middle class- my parents never owned a home.  My dad always had a job, but not a high paying one, and my mother worked too, the exception for a 1950s family.
Yet, they always admired successful people, and told me that if I'd get an education and work, I could increase my standard of living over what they had.  They actually held the really rich in awe.
Not so today.
Not so, I admire Warren Buffet. Watched him on tv the other night and he said every human life has the same value. I admire Steve Jobs, he produced a product that changed the world and made it better. I admired Sam Walton, despise his kids. Any rich man that does it honestly I admire. I admire you Jerry, I dont know how much money you have(none of my business) but you made it honestly and worked hard. I hate Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan and like minded crooks. They are above the law and they're common low life theives and should be busted instead of bailed out. JP Morgan was fined 13 billion for illegal activities, settled for 9 billion and no one was prosecuted or went to jail. What's wrong with that picture?
Back to top
 
 


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
  IP Logged
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #19 - 10/30/13 at 12:30:24
 
Midnight -
Thanks for the compliment.
A serious question, and not intended to just start an argument -  What things has Goldman and AIG done that are illegal or otherwise "crooked"?
As for the Morgan fine, $9 Billion helped the gov't, and the rest of us far more than putting some business executive in jail for a year or three.  I personally think what the gov't did to Martha Stewart, for example, was abhorrent.  She hurt no one, but some street criminal who mugs someone gets less time than she did.
I guess I could have never been a prosecutor - believe it or not, I'm too much of a softly toward those crimes that do not cause, or threaten, any physical harm.  I feel this way because I knew ( not a client ) a guy who got himself in a jam because his business was failing and he committed bank fraud to the tune of about $50K.
They actually put him in jail for a little over a year.  His wife and kids ended up on welfare while he has "away", and if there were any real victims, it was the wife and the two kids.  When he got out, it took him another year to find a job working construction labor work.  I guess I could not have done that to the family.  You can't let a crime go unpunished, but better people than I can be responsible for figuring out how to do it and not create even more victims.
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #20 - 10/30/13 at 12:46:53
 
What things has Goldman and AIG done that are illegal or otherwise "crooked"?


WOW!! That was the first real good laugh Ive had today,,
Man, you need to pay attention.. Money Laundering ring a bell?
They run employees into goob service & they control rules & regs & make sure Goldy gets the golden treatment.,
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #21 - 10/30/13 at 12:52:05
 
JOG -
Simple platitudes with no specifics.  Have you got specifics?
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
Midnightrider
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Alliance Member

Posts: 3244
Winston Salem, NC
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #22 - 10/30/13 at 13:04:23
 
Add to what Jog just said crooked mortgages, financed terrorist along with Bush and Obama and the Federal Reserve. Christopher Stevens was in with Al Quieda shipping weapons to Syria. Follow the money trail. Thats why you'll never hear the truth about Ben Ghazi. I have realatives in Washington (DEA and CIA) and I swore I wouldnt tell what I've been told but its not going to be pretty. Any reasonable person knows when the goverment spits on the Veterans somethings up and the big banks are going to help finance them. Thats why the goverment looks after them and the Federal Reserve.
Back to top
 
 


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
  IP Logged
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #23 - 10/30/13 at 13:08:56
 
Midnight -

Sorry, but I don't buy all of that.  AS for crooked mortgages, are you referring to the "liar's loans" that were made during the housing boom last decade?  If so, remember that they were mandated by that stupid housing act passed during the Clinton era.
No bank wants to lend money and not get it repaid.  That's fundamental.  But they were forced into the riskier loans by that misguided attempt by the gov't to increase home ownership.
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
Midnightrider
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Alliance Member

Posts: 3244
Winston Salem, NC
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #24 - 10/30/13 at 13:28:32
 
Just follow the money trail Jerry. You're right Clinton started it but Bush and Obama are carrying on the tradition. After we realised the so called mistake was made in Iran, no WMD's why didnt we immediatey pull out? That would have been the correct thing to do but once again follow the money trail.
Back to top
 
 


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
  IP Logged
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #25 - 10/30/13 at 13:37:33
 
That "follow the money" is an old saw to me.  Who, supposedly and specifically, made what money.
Remember, I'm in the business of evidence, not hearsay, not what some internet site says, but real, hard, and specific evidence.
And, also, don't tell me "oil".  We get very little oil from Iraq, and as long as Bammy doesn't screw up our own booming oil industry since the advent of fracking, it's predicted that in five more years we'll be a net exporter of oil.
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
Midnightrider
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Alliance Member

Posts: 3244
Winston Salem, NC
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #26 - 10/30/13 at 15:09:55
 
Thats simple, the war machine is where the money is going. Haliburton, Blackwater, etc. They get contracts with no one else allowed to bid.
Back to top
 
 


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
  IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #27 - 10/30/13 at 15:58:08
 
Jerry Eichenberger wrote on 10/30/13 at 13:37:33:
That "follow the money" is an old saw to me.  Who, supposedly and specifically, made what money.
Remember, I'm in the business of evidence, not hearsay, not what some internet site says, but real, hard, and specific evidence.
And, also, don't tell me "oil".  We get very little oil from Iraq, and as long as Bammy doesn't screw up our own booming oil industry since the advent of fracking, it's predicted that in five more years we'll be a net exporter of oil.




Maybe so,, but will we need to import water to drink? IMO, what theyre doing now is very dangerous to our aquifers.
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
Midnightrider
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Alliance Member

Posts: 3244
Winston Salem, NC
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #28 - 11/05/13 at 12:06:47
 
I hold rich people in awe who invent something to improve the world, build factories and hire workers and pay decent wages and benefits, good doctors which are becoming less and less. A lot of that is due to the system which heards people through like cows. I wouldnt be here if it werent for good doctors. I despise  CEO's who set on their a$$, appoint people to do their work. All they have to do is appease the shareholders by predominately taking away from the workers instead of R and D and trying to produce a new or better product. Their salaries are 475-1 now compared to their average workers. They're not in it for the long run, they know in 5 years or less they will leave with a golden parachute some by stealing their employees retirement, move on to another company and do the same thing, not to mention shipping our jobs overseas. Thats basically what Romney did. I hate Bankers, Credit Card Companies Management, Crooked Investment Firms like Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan, despise Bush and Obama for bailing them out. There's 18 million repossessed homes mainly from plants closing, jobs being shipped overseas etc. What I'm saying is its through no fault of the homowners. Those are the people who should have been bailed out. I like Warren Buffet because he believes in fair tax and I've mentioned this before. He said " Every Human life has the same value"  I despise the wealthy shysters that run the Federal Reserve. I despise most wealthy double standard lying politicians, especially Mrs Feinstein. They have totally screwed this country up and made billions doing it, they even admit to offshore accounts that you know they dont pay taxes on. There are no consequences for any of these peoples despicable actions. There are very few rich people left like ones who improved the world like Henry Ford. One of my respected rich people was the CEO of Costco but I heard the other day he was dropping his employees health care benefits, might have something to do with Obamacare. I hate the war machine, Haliburton, Blackwater, etc. They get rich killing people. The division of wealth in this country fully backs up what I just said. I'll just stick to being poor and honest.
Back to top
 
 


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
  IP Logged
Jerry Eichenberger
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

2006 S40.  OEM
windshield, saddle
bags, Sportster

Posts: 2919
Columbus, Ohio
Gender: male
Re: How much would it really cost us
Reply #29 - 11/05/13 at 12:43:23
 
Midnight -

Much of what you say may be true.  But, remember that a great majority of the home foreclosures were due to buyers taking out those "liar's loans" that were impossible for the borrowers to repay.  Don't blame the lenders - Clinton's Community Improvement Program legislation required the lenders to lend money to people who never had a snowball's chance of repaying.  And if a borrower didn't realize than you can't repay a huge mortgage on a meager income, whose fault is it?
Back to top
 
 

Jerry Eichenberger
Columbus, Ohio
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print


« Home

 
« Home
SuzukiSavage.com
07/02/24 at 21:58:04



General CategoryPolitics, Religion (Tall Table) › How much would it really cost us


SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2!
YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved.