SuzukiSavage.com - Power outage. Main fuse blowing

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #15 - 10/28/13 at 11:18:46

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/28/13 at 10:16:24:

A light will go REal Bright or blow. YOu can watch it go from normal to Small Sun. Dont let it do that for too long, else youll melt wires.

You can use a Big Bulb & see it go from barely lit to well lit,, & thats sure to not blow & save your wires,, be kerfull!

I don't understand this concept. If the light can be connected directly from the positive to the negative of the battery......and light up. What is going to make it blow if you put it where the fuse would go? You aren't going to get any more current through the light than you would by placing it as a dead short between the two battery terminals?

Let's say put the light where the fuse would be.....then find a wire and place it directy agains the fame. Instead of the fuse blowing the light bulb will get bright......but it won't blow as there is only 12 volts running through it and that is exactly what the light his designed to do.

I am not sure how this light in the fuse locaiton is going to help. When you replace the fuse with the light bulb and turn on the key, current is going to start flowing in several directions. It wil be going to the neutral light, the headlight, the tail light, the front running lights, the ignition system, the safety interlock system(s). The light in place of the fuse is going to light up as you have put it in series with all these other systems....and maybe some of the currentl will flow through the short and into the frame - but the lgiht where the fuse goes will not burn out.

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old_rider

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #16 - 10/28/13 at 11:26:58

If the voltage regulator (does this thing have one?) is broken or there is a surge causing the fuse to blow by a short in wires after the regulator of a higher amp wire crossing a lower amp wire a bulb or fuse could blow.

That's what I'm trying to picture...but of course I don't do that well without some kinda map (schematic) in front of me, so I hope I'm not confusing him.... keep me straight ok? If I am causing more mayhem than help I will step aside.

But it since he has looked at the wires under the seat and they look good, he needs to remove the tank and chase those wires all the way to the control switches and lights. I just don't know where higher amped wires are bundled with lower amped wires to tell him where to start.

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Dave YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 18096 Camp Springs, Kentucky Gender:	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #17 - 10/28/13 at 11:36:01 verslagen1 wrote on 10/28/13 at 09:59:03: Have a fuse that's blowing? The light controls current, excessive current blows light. Safe. To use while running, should be same wattage as fuse or no go or not go for very long. Fuses are measured in Amps.........light bulbs are measured in Watts. What is the "same"?
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verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28884 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #18 - 10/28/13 at 11:59:45 volts * amps = watts For the typical rear signal lite... 32 watts / 12 volts = 2.7 amps 12 v * 20 amps = 240 watts that's a freakin' flood lamp! and note, if you use a 120 v rated bulb, you're going to get 1/10 the current at 12 v. for a head lamp... 60 watts / 12v = 5 amps.
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Arnold Serious Thumper Offline The dude abides... Posts: 896 Westchester, NY Gender:	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #19 - 10/28/13 at 12:04:39 You can calculate the current (I) needed for the fuse, if you know the system is 12 volt (V) and the wattage (P) of the bulb, then P/V=I
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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #20 - 10/28/13 at 12:19:30

verslagen1 wrote on 10/28/13 at 11:59:45:

volts * amps = watts

For the typical rear signal lite...
32 watts / 12 volts = 2.7 amps

12 v * 20 amps = 240 watts
that's a freakin' flood lamp! Cool

and note, if you use a 120 v rated bulb, you're going to get 1/10 the current at 12 v.

for a head lamp...
60 watts / 12v = 5 amps.

I still aint' buyin' into this concept. You cannot get more power, amperage or wattage to flow through a light bulb than you can by placing it into a direct short with the battery terminals. Anything else you add will just increase the resistance in that circuit and make the light grow dimmer..... as it will increase the resistance in the circuit and reduce the current flow. You are putting the light bulb into the fuse location and making a "series" circuit....and the light bulb will limit the current and a direct short will only make the bulb light at the designed wattage....it will not blow the light bulb. If the circuits are working properly you will get some form of glow I suppose.......but trying to figure out the proper glow is anybodies guess.

I can see how this might keep you from wasting money blowing fuses......as you will never be able to blow the light bulb placed where the fuse should go. However the lght bulb is gonna limit the current to whatever the maximum current is for the bulb you use.....and the headlight and other lights are going to do almost nothing if you use a very small bulb for the test light. I suppose if you watched the glow while you wiggle wires and watched to see the test light bulb get dimmer/brighter then maybe it could help.

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verslagen1

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #21 - 10/28/13 at 13:12:58

Dave wrote on 10/28/13 at 12:19:30:

I still aint' buyin' into this concept. You cannot get more power, amperage or wattage to flow through a light bulb than you can by placing it into a direct short with the battery terminals. Anything else you add will just increase the resistance in that circuit and make the light grow dimmer..... as it will increase the resistance in the circuit and reduce the current flow. You are putting the light bulb into the fuse location and making a "series" circuit....and the light bulb will limit the current and a direct short will only make the bulb light at the designed wattage....it will not blow the light bulb. If the circuits are working properly you will get some form of glow I suppose.......but trying to figure out the proper glow is anybodies guess.

I can see how this might keep you from wasting money blowing fuses......as you will never be able to blow the light bulb placed where the fuse should go. However the lght bulb is gonna limit the current to whatever the maximum current is for the bulb you use.....and the headlight and other lights are going to do almost nothing if you use a very small bulb for the test light. I suppose if you watched the glow while you wiggle wires and watched to see the test light bulb get dimmer/brighter then maybe it could help.

True, the light will limit the current and cut the voltage in half.
And if you happen to plug that into the TCI side, it ain't gonna start no how.

The object of the game is to limit current to a safe level even when shorted. So, when working normally, lamp will be dim. When shorted it will be glowing brightly.

If you had to ride around to look for the short, then the HF fuse gage will be better.

Another alternative, you can get resettable fuses. I think you have to wait 5 min's for it to cool down then you can reset it.

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justin_o_guy2

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #22 - 10/28/13 at 19:05:57

Dave wrote on 10/28/13 at 11:18:46:

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/28/13 at 10:16:24:

A light will go REal Bright or blow. YOu can watch it go from normal to Small Sun. Dont let it do that for too long, else youll melt wires.

You can use a Big Bulb & see it go from barely lit to well lit,, & thats sure to not blow & save your wires,, be kerfull!

All based on the SWAG method,, scientific wild assed guess,,
I don't understand this concept. If the light can be connected directly from the positive to the negative of the battery......and light up. What is going to make it blow if you put it where the fuse would go? You aren't going to get any more current through the light than you would by placing it as a dead short between the two battery terminals?

Let's say put the light where the fuse would be.....then find a wire and place it directy agains the fame. Instead of the fuse blowing the light bulb will get bright......but it won't blow as there is only 12 volts running through it and that is exactly what the light his designed to do.

I am not sure how this light in the fuse locaiton is going to help. When you replace the fuse with the light bulb and turn on the key, current is going to start flowing in several directions. It wil be going to the neutral light, the headlight, the tail light, the front running lights, the ignition system, the safety interlock system(s). The light in place of the fuse is going to light up as you have put it in series with all these other systems....and maybe some of the currentl will flow through the short and into the frame - but the lgiht where the fuse goes will not burn out.

Kinda depends on Where its put. If the thing was put in the line providing power to the starter, its gonna blow up. If its in series with a load thet drops voltage, then itll be dim, until there is a short around the load, then itll get bright.Probably only as bright as it would be in a lamp socket,

All based on the SWAG method,, scientific wild assed guess,,

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #23 - 10/29/13 at 04:40:38

Many wild guesses, electrical seems to be difficult for many.
You can't blow a bulb by shorting it to ground

Just disconnect all at the junctions and start to examine all wires. Nothing, connect one by one.
The resistance in the bulb makes it glow, fuse does not glow, they blow.
What draws current when engine is off? Disconnect.

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #24 - 10/29/13 at 09:08:56 You stick that sucker in line with something that draws big current & itll blow..
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Dave

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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #25 - 10/30/13 at 08:42:57

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/29/13 at 09:08:56:

You stick that sucker in line with something that draws big current & itll blow..

I still don't believe that. You cannot create any bigger current draw than by providing a direct short.....that is the biggest current draw that exists as the resistance is basically zero. Anything you add inline will offer more resistance than a direct short. So when you connect a light bulb by putting both wires to a battery.....that is the most current flow that will ever occur through the bulb. Adding anything in the circuit will reduce the voltage and current flowing through the bulb.

If I connect a 12 volt, 65 watt bulb to a battery, the bulb will light up and operate at 65 watts, 12 volts, 5.4 amps. If I now connnect a 12 volt starter in that circuit.....the light is going to operate at a few less watts and amps, and the starter is going to just sit there and do nothing as the resistance in the light will be limiting the current flow...and the starter will be sitting there stationary and running a small bit of current through the windings and generating a small bit of heat.

I won't have time to do it this week - but I will wire a circuit up and check voltage drops across the bulb and starter.....and take pictures.

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #26 - 10/30/13 at 20:49:43 Okay,,, take the hot wire off the battery, put the bulb in series, hit the starter,,
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Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing
Reply #27 - 10/31/13 at 02:39:01

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 10/30/13 at 20:49:43:

Okay,,, take the hot wire off the battery, put the bulb in series, hit the starter,,

And nothing else happens then the bulb light up.
For all of you who don't understand this. Think about a hose, take a 1/4" hose from your tank and put a 1" hose at the end, how much gas will it flow?

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #28 - 10/31/13 at 03:37:22 The bulb becomes a fuse, the motor draws more current than it can handle & blows the bulb. I dont believe the resistance inside the bulb ( effectively zero) will slow the starter down, the starter will blow the bulb, unless it can carry the current of a starter motor.
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swedishbiker Full Member Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 119 Växjö Sweden Gender:	Re: Power outage. Main fuse blowing Reply #29 - 10/31/13 at 04:23:32 learn more about electricity. The bulb is a resistor. Only way to blow the bulb is more volts. A simple picture, starter is less then 1 ohm but close enough. 1.2 Volt is not enough for the starter but bulb will glow with 10.8 Volt.
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