Steve H wrote on 09/05/13 at 13:47:27:David,
There are several considerations when winding 3phase and deciding what you want to get out of it. Do you wind wye or delta? You wound wye from some of your following posts. When you rectify single phase, you get 1.44 times the AC voltage as DC. When you rectify 3phase, you get 1.73 times AC voltage. The difference is due, from what i've read to the waves crossing at higher potential instead of at zero potential.
You said you scrapped the lighting circuit. So, you never measured the output from it? Remember the output is AC until after the rectifier.
It appears you were using the shorter of the two windings to obtain charging voltage.
You added almost a third more wire per winding (nearly 1/3 more voltage out) and went to 3phase.
You have higher voltage because you are rectifying 3phase instead of single phase and because of more turns on the coil form.
Here's a little more information. Took it from an explanation of building alternators for wind turbines.
The flux is the amount of magnetic field that fits inside a closed loop. You don't need to know a number or measurement of flux directly, but I'll add that it is measured in "Webers" (named after Max Weber who studied it). All we need is the electro-motive force that can be generated. We measure EMF with our multi-meters as a voltage, but ONLY when no current flows.
The formula you need:
EMF = N*F*f*2 Where:
N = Number of turns in the coil
F = the maximum Flux in the coil
f = frequency of change of polarity N-S
In the alternator, the poles pass N to S and N and so on. One cycle N-S-N will flip the field direction, and hence the flux from N to S to N, and the EMF makes a sine wave. Since the flux at the N pole was reduced to zero, then reversed to S, the total flux reversal is twice the amount Flux on one pole. Each magnet is a pole, and most of these alternators have a dozen or so magnet poles. Also, with increasing speed, the flux flips faster, and that makes much more EMF.
The other factor in the equation is N number of turns of wire. Adding turns of wire increases the EMF (and open-circuit voltage).
Thanks!
I will try to answer each section you wrote here:
There are several considerations when winding 3phase and deciding what you want to get out of it. Do you wind wye or delta? You wound wye from some of your following posts.
Yes I wound WyeWhen you rectify single phase, you get 1.44 times the AC voltage as DC. When you rectify 3phase, you get 1.73 times AC voltage. The difference is due, from what i've read to the waves crossing at higher potential instead of at zero potential.
You said you scrapped the lighting circuit. So, you never measured the output from it?
I couldn't as coil was smoked (I had forgot to clip the AC Feed to the lights... when I added lighting circuit to DCV... actually I couldn't find it so I had to open Harness and locateRemember the output is AC until after the rectifier.
It appears you were using the shorter of the two windings to obtain charging voltage.
The longer feed was attached to white/red stripe which was lighting circuit 40.5' from here it attached to yellow lead 23' (Charging) I ws under the impression that charging it uses the combined lengths
WRONG?You added almost a third more wire per winding (nearly 1/3 more voltage out) and went to 3phase.
I ended up doing coil wraps side35'/by35'/side35' with 1/16th wall plastic between. I did alternate directions of wraps. Starting the same direction as original wrap. But I also went to 18ga wire instead of 20ga.You have higher voltage because you are rectifying 3phase instead of single phase and because of more turns on the coil form.
I was also told that the 7 wire Suzuki R/R ws way more then I needed as I was dealing with 4 magnets in Rotor (4 pole). So not to worry about creating to much of anything and smokin the R/R.Here's a little more information. Took it from an explanation of building alternators for wind turbines.
The flux is the amount of magnetic field that fits inside a closed loop. You don't need to know a number or measurement of flux directly, but I'll add that it is measured in "Webers" (named after Max Weber who studied it). All we need is the electro-motive force that can be generated. We measure EMF with our multi-meters as a voltage, but ONLY when no current flows.
The formula you need:
EMF = N*F*f*2 Where:
N = Number of turns in the coil
F = the maximum Flux in the coil
f = frequency of change of polarity N-S
In the alternator, the poles pass N to S and N and so on. One cycle N-S-N will flip the field direction, and hence the flux from N to S to N, and the EMF makes a sine wave. Since the flux at the N pole was reduced to zero, then reversed to S, the total flux reversal is twice the amount Flux on one pole. Each magnet is a pole, and most of these alternators have a dozen or so magnet poles. Also, with increasing speed, the flux flips faster, and that makes much more EMF.
The other factor in the equation is N number of turns of wire. Adding turns of wire increases the EMF (and open-circuit voltage)
Hey everyone, First let me appologize! I know this is not a Suzuki 650/S40... But it is a Younger (Smaller Brother) Here I had to work this what we had.. Unless you has a Zillion Dollars to spend on Importing a Bigger Machine... you were stuck with what was here. I bet my 65 1/2" wheel base make it bigger...
So If you nominate Me to be an Honorary Member... Suzuki sent me some small chrome (ABOUT AN INCH HIGH) Badges the say "Suzuki" I believe they were from Auto line...
Also to the Professor out there who did such a wonderfull explaination... Yes I did understand every word! Wasn'rt so much differen't from the 2 Cyle Outboards I raced for 35 years Thanks again!
David