Donate!
Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register :: View Members
Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print
Cubic Centimeter War Thread! (Read 589 times)
paulmarshall
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1268
Carterton,New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #15 - 06/08/13 at 12:23:55
 
Serowbot wrote on 06/07/13 at 17:03:05:
If you think about the fastest bikes for any displacement... they seem to have cylinder sizes of 250 to 350cc... 1000 to 1300cc 4cyl... 800 to 1000 triples... 500 to 700 twins,...
I guess that's where the maximum rpm/size/power lines up...
No way, are you going to get a big piston spinning 12,000 rpm's... without something flying off...

I think it's a planet Earth thing... probably different on Mars... Huh...

Life happens too fast nowadays...  I more and more liking thumping along,... harkens back to a simpler time...  clears the mind...
Not that my mind has much in it anyway... Huh...

Someone forgot to tell the Burt Munro's of this world and other high speed record breakers who have over bored the max out of there machines.
Just saying. Smiley
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Dave
YaBB Moderator
ModSquad
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 18100
Camp Springs, Kentucky
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #16 - 06/08/13 at 18:58:01
 
paulmarshall wrote on 06/08/13 at 12:23:55:
Serowbot wrote on 06/07/13 at 17:03:05:
If you think about the fastest bikes for any displacement... they seem to have cylinder sizes of 250 to 350cc... 1000 to 1300cc 4cyl... 800 to 1000 triples... 500 to 700 twins,...
I guess that's where the maximum rpm/size/power lines up...
No way, are you going to get a big piston spinning 12,000 rpm's... without something flying off...

I think it's a planet Earth thing... probably different on Mars... Huh...

Life happens too fast nowadays...  I more and more liking thumping along,... harkens back to a simpler time...  clears the mind...
Not that my mind has much in it anyway... Huh...

Someone forgot to tell the Burt Munro's of this world and other high speed record breakers who have over bored the max out of there machines.
Just saying. Smiley


Burt Monroe set the under 1000cc record with a 950cc twin.....or 425cc a cylinder.  And it was not an engine that was very reliable from what I have heard/read.  In the movie the actual clips of him riding it he broke a rod....and in the YouTube video the people that restored it broke a rod.
Back to top
 
 

Someday I will be old......But not today!

  IP Logged
paulmarshall
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 1268
Carterton,New Zealand
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #17 - 06/08/13 at 19:39:17
 
Dave wrote on 06/08/13 at 18:58:01:
paulmarshall wrote on 06/08/13 at 12:23:55:
Serowbot wrote on 06/07/13 at 17:03:05:
If you think about the fastest bikes for any displacement... they seem to have cylinder sizes of 250 to 350cc... 1000 to 1300cc 4cyl... 800 to 1000 triples... 500 to 700 twins,...
I guess that's where the maximum rpm/size/power lines up...
No way, are you going to get a big piston spinning 12,000 rpm's... without something flying off...

I think it's a planet Earth thing... probably different on Mars... Huh...

Life happens too fast nowadays...  I more and more liking thumping along,... harkens back to a simpler time...  clears the mind...
Not that my mind has much in it anyway... Huh...

Someone forgot to tell the Burt Munro's of this world and other high speed record breakers who have over bored the max out of there machines.
Just saying. Smiley


Burt Monroe set the under 1000cc record with a 950cc twin.....or 425cc a cylinder.  And it was not an engine that was very reliable from what I have heard/read.  In the movie the actual clips of him riding it he broke a rod....and in the YouTube video the people that restored it broke a rod.

It was a Indian Scout 600cc. "In its final stages, the Indian's displacement was 950 cc (as built it was 600 cc) and was driven by a triple chain drive system."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burt_Munro
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Dave
YaBB Moderator
ModSquad
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 18100
Camp Springs, Kentucky
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #18 - 06/09/13 at 03:52:41
 
So at this point I have learned that our bike is not blessed with high horsepower mostly because it is an affordable bike with old tachnology and does not have cutting edge design.  Ducati can make a 500-600cc cylnder (pair of them) make high horsepower at very high rpm's with cutting edge technology.  I need to do a calculation of purchase price dollars per horsepower and see if that might be a factor.

I really like the sound and feel of my engine at 55-60 mph....above that and it just starts to feel like I have it revving higher than the sweet spot.  



Back to top
 
 

Someday I will be old......But not today!

  IP Logged
raydawg
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

SuzukiSavage.com
Rocks!

Posts: 11551
pacific northwest
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #19 - 06/09/13 at 04:42:23
 
I agree, it seems my bike in the blink of an eye goes to that zone (60MPH) and then hits a wall......Sure I can nurse it higher, like putting the whip to her on the homestretch, but ain't that where a lot of career ending injuries happen to ponies running faster that their normal sustainable pace?
Back to top
 
 

“The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”—Eric Sevareid (1964)
  IP Logged
LANCER
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

Savage Beast
Performance Parts

Posts: 10667
Oklahoma
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #20 - 06/09/13 at 05:10:52
 
In an effort to get rid of the assorted electrical demons from the past few years and carb vibration issue of last year I am in process of putting the REX engine into a stock '87 frame with the carb in the original position behind the engine and using a fresh wiring harness from an '05 donor parts bike.  
I ran the engine for 10 years with the original Stage 1 cam and found 4500-5500 rpm to be very smooth, and up to 6000 a nice extension.

Yes, it is old tech for sure, but I like old tech.  In fact, I would have preferred that it had a 2 valve head like the "oldies".  I think Suzuki made the exhaust ports  squirrelly on purpose, so it would not be confused with or in competition with the DR series.
Both have very nice intake ports but the DR also has nice exhaust ports.  It is interesting that they had many common parts in the pre-'96 years, including basic cylinder structure, piston/pin, valves, springs, and camshaft core.  The cam is built to a different profile but it is the same core.  I have taken old cam cores from DR's and sent them to Webcam to be made into Stage 1/2/3's.  

So, with so many common parts (and there may be others as well in the bottom end) why did Suzuki make the exhaust ports different ?
Why did they make 2 engines that were very much alike in many ways, different in other ways ?  It would have been much more cost effective to build one good engine and use it in both machines.  It is done quite often.  Perk one up for dirt racing and detune it for the cruiser version.
I would like to have had a chat with the people who made these decisions.  
I just want to know !
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Serowbot
YaBB Moderator
ModSquad
*****
Offline

OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

Posts: 28663
Tucson Az
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #21 - 06/09/13 at 05:11:24
 
The easiest, and probably cheapest way to make a Savage perform like a Ducati...  is to buy a Ducati and paint "Savage" on the tank...
Grin...
Back to top
 
 

Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
  IP Logged
LANCER
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

Savage Beast
Performance Parts

Posts: 10667
Oklahoma
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #22 - 06/09/13 at 07:33:38
 
Serowbot wrote on 06/09/13 at 05:11:24:
The easiest, and probably cheapest way to make a Savage perform like a Ducati...  is to buy a Ducati and paint "Savage" on the tank...
Grin...


Ah Ha !  Direct to the point !   Wink  Grin  Cool
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #23 - 06/09/13 at 08:02:24
 
Dave wrote on 06/09/13 at 03:52:41:
So at this point I have learned that our bike is not blessed with high horsepower mostly because it is an affordable bike with old tachnology and does not have cutting edge design.  Ducati can make a 500-600cc cylnder (pair of them) make high horsepower at very high rpm's with cutting edge technology.  I need to do a calculation of purchase price dollars per horsepower and see if that might be a factor.

I really like the sound and feel of my engine at 55-60 mph....above that and it just starts to feel like I have it revving higher than the sweet spot.  







Yepp,, you can feel it. What this thing does is hustle. Its handy & a quick ride across town. It will do highway & live, but thzats just not where its happy.,
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
ZAR
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Rock this town! Rock
it inside out!

Posts: 961
Kentucky, USA
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #24 - 06/09/13 at 08:18:22
 
LANCER wrote on 06/09/13 at 05:10:52:
In an effort to get rid of the assorted electrical demons from the past few years and carb vibration issue of last year I am in process of putting the REX engine into a stock '87 frame with the carb in the original position behind the engine and using a fresh wiring harness from an '05 donor parts bike.  
I ran the engine for 10 years with the original Stage 1 cam and found 4500-5500 rpm to be very smooth, and up to 6000 a nice extension.

Yes, it is old tech for sure, but I like old tech.  In fact, I would have preferred that it had a 2 valve head like the "oldies".  I think Suzuki made the exhaust ports  squirrelly on purpose, so it would not be confused with or in competition with the DR series.
Both have very nice intake ports but the DR also has nice exhaust ports.  It is interesting that they had many common parts in the pre-'96 years, including basic cylinder structure, piston/pin, valves, springs, and camshaft core.  The cam is built to a different profile but it is the same core.  I have taken old cam cores from DR's and sent them to Webcam to be made into Stage 1/2/3's.  

So, with so many common parts (and there may be others as well in the bottom end) why did Suzuki make the exhaust ports different ?
Why did they make 2 engines that were very much alike in many ways, different in other ways ?  It would have been much more cost effective to build one good engine and use it in both machines.  It is done quite often.  Perk one up for dirt racing and detune it for the cruiser version.
I would like to have had a chat with the people who made these decisions.  
I just want to know !


Lancer...with all this in mind.......is it possible to adapt a DR head and rocker box to a LS cylinder? And if so,wonder what improvement it would make?

Also on the subject of poor exhaust ports,I figure when it's time to pull my engine down I will do some exhaust port work for better evacuation. Earlier I was thinking to polish the intake ports but now I wonder if the rough surface may not be better for mixing the air and fuel. Any thoughts?
Back to top
 
 

Yellow 1996 Jetted and Dunstall exhaust. Dakota Chubby Bags, Memphis Slim shield,Tank Bib from?? Seat riser mod. More to come!
  IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #25 - 06/09/13 at 09:07:16
 
Shiny intakes dont work as well as textured.
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
ZAR
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

Rock this town! Rock
it inside out!

Posts: 961
Kentucky, USA
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #26 - 06/09/13 at 09:34:25
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:07:16:
Shiny intakes dont work as well as textured.


Thanks JOG! At least part of my brain is thinkin right!
Back to top
 
 

Yellow 1996 Jetted and Dunstall exhaust. Dakota Chubby Bags, Memphis Slim shield,Tank Bib from?? Seat riser mod. More to come!
  IP Logged
justin_o_guy2
Serious Thumper
*****
Offline

What happened?

Posts: 55279
East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #27 - 06/09/13 at 09:39:37
 
ZAR wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:34:25:
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:07:16:
Shiny intakes dont work as well as textured.


Thanks JOG! At least part of my brain is thinkin right!


Agreeing with what I say may not be as grand of an indicator as youd like.,
Back to top
 
 

The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion.- Edmund Burke.
  IP Logged
LANCER
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

Savage Beast
Performance Parts

Posts: 10667
Oklahoma
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #28 - 06/09/13 at 18:43:59
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:39:37:
ZAR wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:34:25:
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/09/13 at 09:07:16:
Shiny intakes dont work as well as textured.


Thanks JOG! At least part of my brain is thinkin right!


Agreeing with what I say may not be as grand of an indicator as youd like.,



Grin Grin
Perhaps at times, but I do agree with the rough surface on the intake being best for help in keeping the fuel/air mixture mixed as it heads toward the intake valves.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
LANCER
Serious Thumper
Alliance Member
*****
Offline

Savage Beast
Performance Parts

Posts: 10667
Oklahoma
Gender: male
Re: Cubic Centimeter War Thread!
Reply #29 - 06/09/13 at 18:47:39
 

Quote:
Lancer...with all this in mind.......is it possible to adapt a DR head and rocker box to a LS cylinder? And if so,wonder what improvement it would make?


They will not bolt up, the shape of the mating surfaces are different.
I checked into that a couple of years ago.
Too bad though, the much better exhaust ports and the dual plug head wound be nice.
It is actually possible to drill/tap the LS head for a 2nd plug.   Wink
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print


« Home

 
« Home
SuzukiSavage.com
09/30/24 at 04:31:11



General CategoryThe Cafe › Cubic Centimeter War Thread!


SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2!
YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved.