SuzukiSavage.com - Down Shifting Hangup

Dane Allen

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Down Shifting Hangup
04/22/13 at 13:06:03

The Issue: In no specific gear (2nd-5th), when I down shift something occasionally hangs up and I have to let the clutch out a little for whatever gear I made it too to engage and then continue the down shift.

When: When I am in 4th or 5th and try to down shift several gears. Example, a fire engine came around the corner yesterday ahead of me and I was in 4th. I pulled in the clutch and did the obligatory pull over. Gear hung up out of 4th, got pulled over for fire truck to pass and then a quick partial release of the clutch got the gear to 3rd and then it was easy to go to 1st. Happens about once every other ride whether a short 10 mile ride or a 25-mile-one-way to work commute, usually when on a highway and the traffic light turns red (not a hard stop).

Where: Doesn't seem to matter, I have had it happen on the freeway, arterials and on neighborhood streets. Only once did it happen where I was at a stop light in neutral and at the green signal I tried to get into 1st and it hung up. Let out the clutch fully a couple of times before I could get out of Neutral and into 1st (before 1st oil change at around 4-500 miles on the OD.)

Shifting up has never been a problem and one once or twice on a single gear down shift. Usually happenins when I get to 2nd or 3rd downshifting from 4th or 5th. Is this even a problem or just how bike shifting works? I will say I am not a shift stomper, I give it a pretty light touch.

Stock bike, just surpassed the 1,000 mile mark.

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arteacher Serious Thumper Offline Ride as if your naked and invisable! Posts: 2581 London ontario Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #1 - 04/22/13 at 16:25:30 What kind of oil are you using?
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verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28889 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #2 - 04/22/13 at 17:44:08 shift happens
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rfw2003 Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 1108 Yantis, TX	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #3 - 04/22/13 at 17:50:19 When's the last time you lubed your shift linkage? Remember it's not on a bearing or even a bushing, it's just an aluminum shift lever with a hole in it on a solid rod, that corrodes easily. R.F.
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Serowbot

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OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

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Re: Down Shifting Hangup
Reply #4 - 04/22/13 at 18:37:30

Check that the shifter lever isn't positioned too low... (it's adjustable)...
Also,... bikes are different than cars...
Cars have syncromesh trannys nowadays... and they will go into and out of gear at a stop...
Bikes don't,... they need the gears spinning to engage... (if it won't go,.. don't try to force it... release and re-engage the clutch and try again... this will usually jog the gear positions and allow the shift)...
Wink

...

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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh

...

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oldNslow

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Re: Down Shifting Hangup
Reply #5 - 04/22/13 at 18:47:26

Trying to shift down more than one gear at at a time - going from 5th to 2nd for example - without actually engaging each gear on the way down before shifting to the next one, will sometimes cause issues. The shift mechanism works sort of like a ratchet. The shift mechanism needs time to return to center and the transmission needs to be completly in a gear before it can shift down to the next one.

The only Savage I've ever been on is mine, and while it's not terrible, it's pretty far from the slickest shifting bike I've ever ridden. If you are not having trouble when deliberately shifting down one gear at a time, making sure that gear is engaged before shifting to the next one, I don't think there's anything wrong with your bike.

Take a look at your shift rod though. They sometimes get bent.

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justin_o_guy2

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What happened?

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Re: Down Shifting Hangup
Reply #6 - 04/22/13 at 21:31:26

TRy it clutchless. Roll off the gas to the point where the engine isnt pulling the bike & the trans isnt pushing the engine & just as ya step down on the shifter, give it a little goose to pick up the RPMs & match engine/trans/rear tire speeds. 5th tp 4th is easiest to practice, cuz the rpm difference is so little.
I dont recommend 2nd to 1st unless youre feeling REALLY sharp with the reflexes.

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Dane Allen

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Re: Down Shifting Hangup
Reply #7 - 04/23/13 at 08:35:07

arteacher wrote on 04/22/13 at 16:25:30:

What kind of oil are you using?

Rotella T6 Dino with Redline - per the chart - 3 oz. to 1 gallon.

verslagen1 wrote on 04/22/13 at 17:44:08:

shift happens Grin

Except when it doesn't, that's the problem Grin

rfw2003 wrote on 04/22/13 at 17:50:19:

When's the last time you lubed your shift linkage? Remember it's not on a bearing or even a bushing, it's just an aluminum shift lever with a hole in it on a solid rod, that corrodes easily.

R.F.

I haven't

That's on me - back to Clymers...

Serowbot wrote on 04/22/13 at 18:37:30:

Check that the shifter lever isn't positioned too low... (it's adjustable)...
Also,... bikes are different than cars...
Cars have syncromesh trannys nowadays... and they will go into and out of gear at a stop...
Bikes don't,... they need the gears spinning to engage... (if it won't go,.. don't try to force it... release and re-engage the clutch and try again... this will usually jog the gear positions and allow the shift)...
Wink

...

Now that I think about it I do have a tendancy to pull the clutch and coast up to the light/stop sign and I can coast quite a distance. I don't down shift till I get close to the stop because I don't want to be coasting up to a light at 45 mph in 1st and accidentally drop the clutch.

oldNslow wrote on 04/22/13 at 18:47:26:

Trying to shift down more than one gear at at a time - going from 5th to 2nd for example - without actually engaging each gear on the way down before shifting to the next one, will sometimes cause issues. The shift mechanism works sort of like a ratchet. The shift mechanism needs time to return to center and the transmission needs to be completly in a gear before it can shift down to the next one.

The only Savage I've ever been on is mine, and while it's not terrible, it's pretty far from the slickest shifting bike I've ever ridden. If you are not having trouble when deliberately shifting down one gear at a time, making sure that gear is engaged before shifting to the next one, I don't think there's anything wrong with your bike.

Take a look at your shift rod though. They sometimes get bent.

That is very helpful, I will check the rod when I apply the lubricant. I am not having trouble with one gear at a time.

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 04/22/13 at 21:31:26:

Try it clutchless. Roll off the gas to the point where the engine isnt pulling the bike & the trans isnt pushing the engine & just as ya step down on the shifter, give it a little goose to pick up the RPMs & match engine/trans/rear tire speeds. 5th tp 4th is easiest to practice, cuz the rpm difference is so little.
I dont recommend 2nd to 1st unless youre feeling REALLY sharp with the reflexes.

I have done this by accident a couple of times and it was so smooth it didn't register that I up shifted without the clutch. I went 3rd to 4th and then 4th to 5th and then got that feeling that something was off and that is when I realized I didn't use the clutch. I have been very careful since then.

I am probably way to cautious with the mechanics of the bike. I totally was OCD with the break in process. Grin

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Dane Allen Serious Thumper Offline Carpe Diem!! Posts: 1217 Riverside, CA Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #8 - 04/23/13 at 08:36:01 Thanks everyone for the input, I very much appreciate it!!!
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apache snow-FSO Serious Thumper Offline Posts: 509 Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #9 - 04/23/13 at 09:03:44 My 2011 S40 shifts good up or down. I can be in 5th and down shift all the way to first as fast as I can with no hang ups.
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Dane Allen Serious Thumper Offline Carpe Diem!! Posts: 1217 Riverside, CA Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #10 - 04/23/13 at 09:38:03 apache snow-FSO wrote on 04/23/13 at 09:03:44: My 2011 S40 shifts good up or down. I can be in 5th and down shift all the way to first as fast as I can with no hang ups. Ok, thanks, I will see how it works after the lube and inspection.
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Dane Allen

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Carpe Diem!!

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Riverside, CA
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Re: Down Shifting Hangup
Reply #11 - 04/24/13 at 08:41:30

Serowbot wrote on 04/22/13 at 18:37:30:

...Bikes don't,... they need the gears spinning to engage... (if it won't go,.. don't try to force it... release and re-engage the clutch and try again... this will usually jog the gear positions and allow the shift)...
Wink

...

Update: I did a test on the way to work and with thoughtful shifting with regard to the advice above I wa able to shift with no problems at all. I was able to make a second issue come up 3 out of 4 times and that is when in neutral at a stoplight/sign. I usually keep it in 1st but four times this morning I kept it in neutral for a longer duration light and 3 out of 4 different lights it wouldn't go into 1st at the green signal.

I had to sort of pop the clutch to get it into gear and then immediately pull to clutch to avoid to consequences of poping the clutch and then take off as per the usual. So, the adive above makes a lot of sense and is probably something everyone else does by instinct, I'm guessing.

This weekend will be shift linkage lube and more general inspection.

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oldNslow Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 2683 Rochester, NY Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #12 - 04/24/13 at 08:56:51 Rolling the bike back and forth a little bit while pressing on the lever sometimes helps when you're trying to go from neutral to first at a stop.
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apache snow-FSO Serious Thumper Offline Posts: 509 Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #13 - 04/24/13 at 09:03:12 The only time I have a problem with shifting into 1st is when the engine is not running. I may have to roll the bike a little to get 1st. I have never had that problen with the engine running. I can coast down comming to a stop and down shift all the way to 1st just holding the clutch in.
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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: Down Shifting Hangup Reply #14 - 04/24/13 at 09:10:52 A good premium motorcycle oil like Klotz Mx4 MA 4T rated will help in the shifting.
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