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Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring? (Read 522 times)
DavidOfMA
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Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
11/19/12 at 07:59:04
 
I've read many posts on tuning the carb on the S40 to eliminate backfiring. As my carb had a stripped idle mix screw thanks to the previous owner's attempts to adjust it, I had the local shop drill it out and, as I also had a jet kit, asked them to rejet to eliminate backfiring. I am trying to find out exactly what they did, but from the writeup it looks as if they replaced the pilot jet with one size up and adjusted the idle mix. The bike still backfires. Less often, but still almost every time I either snap the throttle off at any speed or roll it down or off from high speed (as when preparing to exit the highway or stop at a stop sign). What's the most reasonable next step to try in order to eliminate backfiring? It now seems to occur only when the throttle is at about 25% or below.

There should be no exhaust leak, as they also replaced a leaking head plug at the same time the rejetted the carb. Their claim is it will continue to backfire unless I install a less restrictive exhaust, but I'd like to keep the bike stock.

Thanks,
David
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justin_o_guy2
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What happened?

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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #1 - 11/19/12 at 08:25:27
 
I dont have the answer, but I would surely be interested to know what you paid for the screw extraction & then for the jetting.
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DavidOfMA
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #2 - 11/19/12 at 08:32:16
 
More than I wanted to (I think it was $150, but I don't have the receipt handy) but less than the cost of a new carb. I was not confident I could drill the screw out myself without wrecking the carb, nor was I confident I could get the carb bottom off without stripping the screw heads. The carb had not been disassembled before. Now that it's already been taken apart and put back together, it should be safe for me to further tinker with it myself as needed.
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OK.... so what's the
speed of dark?

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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #3 - 11/19/12 at 08:47:33
 
Are these backfires you are getting,.. pops and blats,.. or very loud gunshot type cracks?...
Pops and blats,.. are normal for a big thumper on decel... especially in cold or humid conditions...

Speaking of which,... do they increase or decrease on humid days?...
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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DavidOfMA
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #4 - 11/19/12 at 09:31:09
 
Gunshots. Haven't noticed a significant change when the humidity changes. Should I have?
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verslagen1
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #5 - 11/19/12 at 09:40:46
 
shift pows are usually leaky header or muffler joints.
use a lit candle to detect a leak

second, clean your TEV.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1267767908
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Serowbot
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #6 - 11/19/12 at 09:42:38
 
If backfires get worse on humid days, or when riding in the mountains it indicates that you are on the rich side...
If backfires are reduced,.. you are lean...
Either, will cause backfires and popping...
Constant backfires in all conditions usually indicates an exhaust leak...

Some locations have very little variance... Where are you located?...
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DavidOfMA
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #7 - 11/19/12 at 09:58:21
 
There's no exhaust leak I or the shop that fixed the head plug leak can detect. It seems related to the pilot circuit. The mechanic, it turns out, didn't replace the pilot jet due to fear I'd foul plugs if I ran too rich with a stock muffler and air box. Have any of you found that going up a size in the pilot jet fouls plugs.

I'm north of Boston, at sea level. Do lower elevations lean out the mix due to denser air?
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« Last Edit: 11/24/12 at 11:55:08 by DavidOfMA »  

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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #8 - 11/19/12 at 10:12:33
 
DavidOfMA wrote on 11/19/12 at 09:58:21:
I'm north of Boston, at sea level. Do lower e aroind lean out the mix due to denser air?

Yes, it do...
A bigger pilot might help...  if adjusting idle mix to 3 turns out don't do it,.. you might try a step larger on the pilot...
Also, make sure that you idle speed isn't too low... but, I'm assuming that's okay because the dealer set it for you...
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #9 - 11/19/12 at 18:43:31
 
but, I'm assuming that's okay because the dealer set it for you...


Dealer adjustments are as suspect as any, IMO. How many oil filters have been put in bakkerds at a dealership?
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Serowbot
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #10 - 11/19/12 at 21:42:16
 
Too true... Huh...
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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denistheruski
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #11 - 11/20/12 at 05:45:39
 
Serowbot, you're always telling folks to check their idle speed.  I know that the oil pump needs ~1200 RPM to work properly.  Are there other reasons idle speed is important?  (I realize that pumping oil to critical engine parts is a very important reason ... I'm just curious if idle speed relates to backfiring somehow.)

Also - is there an easy way to check RPMs without having a tach installed?
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Charon
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #12 - 11/20/12 at 06:13:46
 
Aside from making sure there is adequate oil pressure to the cam bearings, a higher idle speed will reduce the afterfiring and any tendency the bike has to stall when you come to a quick stop. You can prove it to yourself by closing the throttle slowly and perhaps not quite completely on deceleration instead of snapping it shut. Ever hear of anyone complaining about the afterfiring except when they are decelerating from speed with the throttle completely shut?
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Eschew obfuscation.

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verslagen1
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #13 - 11/20/12 at 08:05:04
 
denistheruski wrote on 11/20/12 at 05:45:39:
Also - is there an easy way to check RPMs without having a tach installed?

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1303712067
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DavidOfMA
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Re: Next step in trying to eliminate backfiring?
Reply #14 - 11/24/12 at 11:59:00
 
So... verified that the pilot jet was upsized to a 55 from a 52.5 and that the TEV is working fine. But, the bike still backfires, generally a loud gunshot crack but sometimes two quieter ones, as I'm decelerating and get below about 25% throttle. Opening up the idle mix screw another half turn dropped the idle speed and made the bike feel a little boggy, while only very slightly reducing the backfiring.

Any other modifications I could try, from a carburetor point of view, that have been shown to fix this problem? I did look at the "trim the TEV spring" thread, but it seems the results there were inconclusive.

Would drilling out the muffler have any effect on backfiring? I'm not interested in doing a muffler replacement at this time, and I don't particularly want to make the bike any louder, but I'd trade some increased volume for fewer backfires.
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